Monte Hellman and the Key to Harry Dean Stanton

I'm C. Thomas Howe, and you're listening to Movie Meltdown. Wolverines! It's showtime. The following feature has been rated R by the Motion Picture Association of America.

It is intended for mature audiences and parental discretion is advised. Our nuclear reactor pumping out one million kilowatts of power. I'm not into that. I just thought it might. Relax you while you drive.

What's up and welcome to Movie Meltdown. I'm Brian. I'm Lucy. And we're coming to you live via digital recording from Harry Dean Stanton. Are we going to pretend like that's what's happening right now?

Through the magic of. Time, space, and digital recording, we're bringing you the semi-annual recap of Harry Dean Stanton Fest. Weekend two of Harry Dean Stanton Fest, the Louisville edition. Well, first off, do we want to address last year? No.

That's why I say semi-annual, because we've done it as an annual event, but last year was Crazy Town. It was Crazy Town. I think I've asked you that question weekly since then. Are we finishing that? Is that episode ever going to see the world?

And that's why I said, let's start off with last year. So, there's many other things we probably don't want to go into. Because it was Crazy Town, but. I assume the fact that... But a delightful crazy town.

The main thing that happened, the thing that every idiot has asked you since it started, starting with me. My favorite idiot. Is Harry Dean Stanton coming to the festival? That was my first question for you. And my answer was always no.

No. Because I didn't think that it would happen. He does not fly. He doesn't like to fly. He flaps his arms sometimes, but he doesn't fly.

He doesn't like to travel. Bless his heart. The first time I reached out to him, and I've said this annually also, I said, you know, can you come? And he was like, honey. Tell him Harry's 84 and he's wore out.

And I don't even think he was 84. I think he just came up with an arbitrary age. I don't know if he even knows his number. He just makes stuff up. But now he's 88 about to turn 89.

So, I mean, I didn't think it would ever happen. And to be perfectly honest, you know, as delightful as I find him, as much as I love him, you know, I've been out to Los Angeles and spent time with him there. I kind of got to a place where I didn't really necessarily want him to come just because I knew the travel would be hard on him. If it's going to be overwhelming and not fun for him, then that makes it not fun in general. So every year I've made a little book for him and sent him the book and photos and press clippings.

And so he could just kind of, you know, see what was going on and see. He's even shot video for you guys to play at the festival. So it sort of worked from there. different coasts. Yeah, and I just kind of figured it would continue that way, and then we invited Michelle Phillips, and I guess Michelle Phillips just called him, and she was like, Harry, you're being an asshole. She got him in a headlock, and.

We're like, you're going, you're going, you're going. More or less. She's just the big bully is what she is. And so he said, well, the loveliest bully. And so he just He said, well, okay, Michelle, here I go.

And it was really sad. I'll go to my own film festival. Because when I picked him up at the airport, plus it's hard. It's hard for him to travel. When I picked him up at the airport, he was just like, so who's been here in past years?

And I went through the years and he was like, oh, I should have come that year. I should have come that year. And he really felt guilty about it, which made me feel guilty. But anyway. But he came.

He didn't want to. He took it upon himself. But it is, I mean, you guys have to keep in mind, this is a man who pretty much doesn't leave his house or the bar. From what I've seen in several documentaries now, this is kind of. What he does.

I don't know how he works in... any of his stills appearing in several movies and TV shows. Well, he doesn't. I mean, you know, he'll do a day filming, but it has to be within, you know, an hour drive. Of the bar. He really loves that bar.

But not because he's an alcoholic. Yeah, not the drinking. He likes the bar lifestyle. He goes to Dantana's on a pretty much nightly basis, and he calls it the Star Wars bar because he thinks it's like the Star Wars cantina. Because there's just all these characters that are just out of their mind nuts.

Trying to decide which character he is in the Star Wars cantina. Pando Baba, maybe? Trying to decide who he would be in this cantina. Has he lost an arm at any point during Dan Tannis? Oh, but yes, I think that's the thing.

He's so set in his lifestyle built around his house in that bar that he kind of likes that and he doesn't want to venture out. He spent 80 some odd years that he doesn't know for sure which doing all these other things and now he likes settling into that little area. So I don't blame him, I guess. If I lived there, I probably would too. So I would say the most impressive thing about that weekend was the fact that, like, they renamed the city.

Yeah. It's no longer even Lexington. No, it's Harrytown. It's Harrytown. And they gave him a key.

The Hamlet of Harry. A giant key. Gave him a giant key to unlock all the bars and all the liquor cabinets. All right. What this is, what the big gold plate.

Down here on the bottom of this is... Harry Dean Stanton Day. I, Jim Gray. Mayor of Lexington, in recognition of Kentucky native son Harry Dean Stanton, outstanding actor, musician, and singer, do hereby proclaim June 15, 2014 as Harry Dean Stanton Day in Lexington. And it was kind of a touchy moment.

It was. I was. I mean, not that I don't normally try to make my way there every year, but I was glad I was there for that because that is sort of a momentous occasion for him and you and the whole town. Yeah, I got to say, it was amazing, you know, because I was on stage introducing him and just standing next to him when he got the standing ovation. Hmm.

Like, you could feel it. I mean, it was just like it had actual weight, like that sort of adoration. Like, it was really powerful and sort of overwhelming just standing next to it. So I can't even imagine what it was like having that directed at you. Yeah, being all about you.

Yeah. This is terrifying. What does this key open? Bourbon. There you go.

I was going to say that. Go up to any bartender in town and they'll give you a drink and they'll. Send me the bill. But how long? How long?

Well now, what. Am I supposed to do? Except thank everybody. I've not been involved in this situation in my whole life with this many people for this kind of awards. I've met a lot of wonderful people here.

Kentucky's got these beautiful. Trees all over the place. And I really don't know what to say. Does anybody have any ideas? And he was just so sweet about it.

I mean, the funny part is that of all the people in the world that you would create a festival for, Harry Dean Stanton is the one, maybe the only one, who, and I'm not going to say doesn't care, but doesn't let it feed his ego because he's so zenned out, Eastern religion, I am the universe. Like that he doesn't. Yeah. Does not go to his head at all. It doesn't mean anything to him.

I mean, he thinks it's nice, but it doesn't. It doesn't. You know, I don't know. I've questioned his philosophies before. Sometimes I have issues with them.

Well, you know, Sophie Huber said something sort of interesting in her documentary. And she sort of paused, or maybe it was in one of the interviews she did in regard to the documentary, but she sort of posited this thesis that the reason why Harry adopted that sort of stance was because he'd spent so many years being rejected in Hollywood that it was better to have no ego than to. And I think, I mean, I understand. Because I don't remember it being talked about as much when he was younger. You know, maybe, again, me trying to psychoanalyze someone that's not me.

Trying to figure out if, is it part of also just the aging and dealing with... Again, you watch these documentaries and he's had a rough life and lost some relationships. And, like, you get to a point that maybe it's easier to just say nothing matters because it's kind of hard when it does matter. Yeah. Fair enough.

That's just my thinking. I don't know, because to me and the thing I always bring up is like, if nothing matters, look at that IMDb list. Why does he why has he worked so hard and put in so many years of like just I mean, traveling around doing this stuff and not being. There's only... It's a Buddhist saying.

To think that you're an individual with an individual soul is not only an illusion, it's insane. It's nothing. And frightening, terrifying, but joyous too. And that's kind of, I don't know what. Else to say.

Know. Do we feel like that sort of encapsulated last year's festivities? I think I just wanted to do like a little intro with last year. I mean, the fact that he came was kind of awesome. Yeah, it was.

I mean, it was amazing. Then we can move into this year. And I will say, I should say this really quickly. You know, I was really worried at the end of the festival that I just, have we talked about this? Which, last year?

Yeah, that I had just worn him out. I mean, we got in the car and I was taking him to the airport and he was so quiet. And I just felt horrible. I was just like, what have I done? Is he going to even make it to the airport?

That would be the worst way to end the Houdini Stanton Festival. But no, that's not what happened. So after driving for about 20 minutes, he said, what did I say when I got on stage? And I said, well, which part, Harry? And he said, did I say this is fucking terrifying?

And I said, yeah, I'm pretty sure you did. That does sound like him. And he said, was that an okay thing to say? And I was like, yeah, it was the perfect thing to say. I think your town knows you relatively well.

And he was like, did people think that was funny? And I was like, yeah, no, they thought it was hilarious. It was great. And so it did make me happy that he was actually sitting there reflecting on it. And his assistant, Logan, said that, you know, it was good for him.

And that guy seems awesome. That's all we can hope. I like Logan. Yeah, good dude. He's a good dude.

So, rolling on into this year. Yeah. So, when I came upon you in the midst of Harry Dean Stanton 2015. Yes. You seemed stressed.

I always am. You always are. Let's be honest. But I'm assuming good stress. Not in life, but during that weekend.

And that's the thing. Not that you're not doing it single-handedly because you do have an. Awesome group of people. Oh, my God, amazing volunteers. They all do a great job.

But a lot of it comes back on you to at least make sure everything's happening. Yeah, my feeling is that if something gets fucked up, it's my fuck-up. You're not hearing anything. You can't use that kind of language. So it does feel like, you know, I just want– And now that people are traveling to come to the festival, it's a lot more, I feel a lot more responsibility that people have a good time and that everything runs smoothly and that the film doesn't stop halfway through like it did last year with Bill and Jerry.

Yeah, I did sort of feel for you there. Let's not dwell on that. But we had a good talk with the projection room and they did great this year. They did great. I believe it's because it was digital, was it not?

It was. It was digital. And I guess that it just went to sleep. It just went to sleep. I've heard several people that. dealt with both film in the old days and have now been forced that everybody always says it was so much easier like if the film broke you taped it together you fed it back through.

And you just kept on moving the digital. Machine shuts down and it does not want to work anymore you're just screwed yeah and. That was the thing i mean i i asked the projectionist this year i was like how do we keep that from happening and he said well we can't yeah and i said what do you mean you can't that doesn't seem like an acceptable answer you're fine He was just like, well, you know, it's a freak thing. It doesn't happen much. But when it happens, it happens.

And there's literally nothing that we can do to prevent it. I was like, all right. There you go. I agree. Just in the little screenings I've done, it's just nerve-wracking.

Because even mine, I'm like, I don't like the sound mix now, and it's too late for me to fix that. Yeah. As much as you try to plan for this stuff, it gets kind of crazy. Well, it was interesting because, you know, Monty Hellman was our guest this year, which was incredible. I mean, he's somebody that I'd wanted since the very beginning and somebody who I just literally stalked.

I mean, I went and stayed at his house. You do this on a yearly basis. I literally stalked him. That's when the festival will end is when you're incarcerated. Right.

I'll still do it out of jail. He does have an Airbnb. I'm sure I can find some co-stars. You've got connections. Yes.

It was interesting having Monty here because, you know, Monty's 85 years old. Yeah. And he has really embraced digital. Yeah, it was kind of amazing hearing him talk about that. Yeah, I know he did Road to Nowhere digitally, but it makes sense for him.

You know, I mean, he grew up in the sort of Corman School of Filmmaking, so whatever makes it faster and cheaper, let's do that. Yeah, I'm pretty sure Corman isn't worried about digital at this point. He's still producing movies right now as we speak. He just produced, wait, he just produced another movie. Just produced another movie.

But, you know, it's interesting because there's only one, I guess, print, 135-millimeter print of Cockfighter that's still existing, and it looks terrible. I mean, it's almost dust at this point. I saw it at the Cinematheque, and it's just sad. It's heartbreaking. It looks horrible.

And so... He didn't want us to show that. I didn't get to have the conversation with Monty where I'm like, sorry, Lexington doesn't have 35mm capability anymore. He actually asked, there's not a good DVD transfer. If you're going to show it, you need to show the Japanese Blu-ray.

So we ordered the Japanese Blu-ray and he was just like, but it does need some color correction. So he came in and he tweaked with the brightness, and he was our guest projectionist for Cock Rider. That's pretty awesome. Which was really exciting. So we saw it exactly, you know, not exactly how he wanted us to see it, but the best possible way we could.

And actually, I thought it looked great. I mean, it looked way better than I'd ever seen it. So they have not done an American Blu-ray? No, no. Only the Japanese Blu-ray.

Those weird Blu-ray releases. I don't know. It's always kind of been like that. Each country has its own weird release system. But fortunately, they are the same international Blu-ray numbers, us, or whatever.

I think most of them now, they're just getting smarter and they all know what they're doing. I know there's region-free ones, but I felt like the new ones are just getting to be a computer anyway, so it just knows what to do with it. I mean, you're streaming Netflix on them now. You might as well be able to play whatever region you want. It's intermission time.

So how about taking a break, get out and stretch a little, and relax before the show begins again. And why not make it refreshment time, too? We have lots of tasty, delicious treats waiting for you at the refreshment center. There's hot popcorn, so golden good and fresh out of the popper. And all kinds of refreshing ice-cold soft drinks.

Sizzling hot dogs just bursting with juicy goodness. ice cream so smooth and delicious you'll hanker for more. Plus, all the most popular candy bars and many other favorite treats. So why not visit the refreshment center now? Our courteous attendants are ready and waiting to serve you with a wide and wonderful variety of good things to eat and drink. So step right up and make yourself at home.

What you are about to see is illegal in 47 states. I'll take 25 to 30. I'll take it. You're on. I'll take 25 to 30.

25 to 30 on the red. I'll take 30 to 20. 25 to 30 there. Anybody got it? All right, you guys pick the 30 on the black.

I got the black wrist. You want to know something, boy? I am the finest trainer and conditioner in the whole world. All right, let's go. Cockfighting, the dirtiest sport in the world.

Get ready. Hit. Now what's your face? No pity, no love, nothing. Oh, wow.

Hey, listen, Mr. Mansfield, I'm sorry. You know, I didn't bring no cash with me. I was so sure I was gonna win and everything, but listen, I got some money at home. I got a lot of it.

I'm gonna bring it back as soon as I can. Get over here! Frank Mansfield, professional with a passion for violence. I want to get married and have children. The drive.

The drive in it is to be the best. I like to call it sharpness. Not since the hustler has the violent underbelly of the gambling world been so nakedly exposed. What kind of a man risks. Everything in America's most controversial bloodsport?

The kind who will do anything to win. It's the desire to win. I'm not going to wait for you forever. Winning is the name of the game. Stick up.

Hands over your heads. Anybody who moves gets a head blasted off. I think that bird has more of a heart than. You ever will have. Anything that can fight to the death and not utter a sound, well, winning is.

The name of the game. Warren Oates. Cockfighter. Rated R tweaked audio your source for high performance noise reducing earbuds available in three styles and seven colors durable and designed to sound great for both music and those chatty podcasts like the one you're listening to now tweaked audio earbuds come with a one year warranty and now there's a special deal for movie meltdown listeners just go to tweakedaudio.com and when you check out enter the discount code meltdown then you'll get 33% off and free shipping Pre-audio sounds better. So, Monty.

Yes. So how did your conversation go? Would you like to find out right now? Yes, please. I think that's the best thing.

Well, first of all, let's just say I was most impressed that not only was Monty there, which that was awesome, but that he brought his, I'm using quotes, producer, Or his manager or his agent. What did he keep referring to him as? Oh, Kona? And Kona's a lady. I don't know why managers or agents have to be men.

You're such a sexist. Kona's a lady dog and a delight. She was. Yes. And I had gotten to know Kona previously because, as I think I mentioned, I stalked the shit out of Bonnie Hellman.

He has, and I do want to put this in as a plug. First of all, he's just the most delightful human being imaginable. He kind of was. Second of all, he knows more about film than maybe any human being who ever lived. Seemed to.

And he has an Airbnb. Airbnb. So you can pay, and I honestly think that when I did it, it was like $ 72 a night. He has since upped his price to an astronomical $ 92 a night, which if you've ever visited Los Angeles, you know you can't even get bed bugs for like $ 92 a night. There is no place that you would want to stay that you could stay.

There's no fleabag that you could stay in for $ 92 a night. So the fact that you're staying in a bed bug free residence where Monty Hellman is your host, where he makes you a cocktail at night and pancakes in the morning, where you have a sliding glass door that leads to like this amazing swimming pool. You're up in the hills. It's insane. There's a puppy on hand at all times.

And Kona's there. I just I don't understand why any like I don't understand why it's not booked 365 days a year. I just thought it was awesome that I first got there and he was sitting at the outdoor dining and had the dog. And I was like, oh, that's probably why he's sitting outside because they brought that. And then later I realized, oh, no, the dog just goes everywhere.

The dog literally goes everywhere. The dog went to the theater with him. Yes. It was time for Q & A. The dog went up for Q & A.

Yes. Kind of amazing. Kona's a service animal. And she's, oh, my God, she's the sweetest dog. I like that at one point she was so excited to see our Q & A person.

She was climbing on him during the Q & A. Yes, guest moderator Michael Blowen, who was also an incredible person. I don't know. Do you know his backstory? I've heard a little of it.

Um, I have, I just found out that I made up a backstory for him, but I like it better than the one that I read in the paper. Sorry, real life. I think the truth is somewhere in between, but, uh, he told me this amazing story about how he met John Houston. He was a film reviewer for the Boston Globe for decades, decades. I mean, I think over the course of four decades, even though it was just like 24 years, um, he had to do an interview with John Huston in like 1980 and he is supposed to go to John Huston's hotel room and meet him and he knocks on the door and John Huston opens the door and he says, who the hell are you?

And he says, well, I'm Michael Blow and I'm here with the Boston Globe. I'm supposed to interview you today. And John Huston says, well, oh hell what? No, I'm going to the track today. This all sounds like John Huston.

And Michael Blow and says, well, I, I, you know, I've got a deadline and he was like, oh hell, come to the track with me. So it wound up being three days at the track with John Huston. And the name of the movie, this this love affair was born. And I don't know if it was born there before that or slightly after. But anyway, round about the same time, this love affair with with the races was born.

And Michael actually started moonlighting. But whatever the early morning equivalent would be as like a as a as a trainer's assistant. And started developing these relationships with the horses and fell in love with the sport. And then just, you know, started realizing, oh, well, what happens at the end of their careers? Blue.

And, yeah, found out that the answer is not what you want the answer to be. And so he said, well, what can I do about this? And so he told his wife that, hey, you know, I think we need to do something. And they moved to Kentucky and started a farm for thoroughbred, retired thoroughbred horses. Which is incredible.

That's kind of, I mean, again, somebody taking it upon themselves to actually do something. Not everybody does that. She was a writer for The Globe as well. Oh, God, the How They Met story is amazing, too. But I'm not going to tell every detail of Michael Blum's personal life right now.

But he, I guess she said, well, all right, here's the deal. We'll do it. But if I leave you, you're not allowed to follow me. And he said, okay. And so they moved to Kentucky.

This is an odd story. No, no, they're still together. They're the happiest, sweetest couple ever. They're just delightful humans. They're the best.

So anyway, so yes, he moderated the Q & A, which was incredible. I kept telling him, you're really legitimating us, Michael. Thank you for doing this. And at one point, I guess Kona decided, well, this... I don't seem to be the center of attention right now.

What's that about? To be proactive. And so she just hopped up on Michael Blowen's lap. And she's not a small dog. No, no.

Let's reiterate, she's a bearded collie. That was my other thing. You picture someone from Hollywood traveling around with their dog. Sure, a little lap dog. Yes.

He did not have a purse. No. He had a giant, fluffy dog. Yes, amazing. That was way too big to be climbing on you.

And yet, if she wanted to, she would. Yeah, I let her. And I was fine with that, too. Yeah. In fact, usually he kept coming in the room, and I was probably supposed to pay attention to him, but I just started petting the table.

It's easy. It's easy to do. I think she appreciates it. He's a star. Her predecessor was actually in, because he's had a series of bearded collies.

They're magnificent dogs. And the bearded collie that he had before Kona is in his film Road to Nowhere. And when you go to stay at Monty Hellman's Airbnb, which again, everyone should do. Why wouldn't you do it? It doesn't make sense.

If you go to stay at Monty Hellman's Airbnb, he will play you Road to Nowhere in his screening room. And you will realize about 10 minutes in, oh. I'm in that house right now. That house in the movie. And it becomes sort of surreal at that moment.

Yes. The universe collapses upon itself. And oh yeah, the director is sitting next to me. And oh yeah, that dog looks a lot like this dog that's sitting next to me in this house where I'm sitting watching this movie that's in the movie. That is kind of strange.

Yeah. Oh my God, it's amazing. So I'm going back this summer. I love it. As long as I get to go as well.

Slumber party at Monty's house. He actually has a new room now too. It's even bigger. Somebody needs to come up with some money. $ 92. Is that what I'm up to?

Yeah. 92 for the single. And then there's like a four sleeps, four giant standalone apartment. That's like a hundred and something. If you guys want a special Monty episode, start sending in donations.

Now sponsor our trip to Monty's house. Oh, Why would we not want to do that? Monty's awesome. Let's go and talk to Monty right now. So usually with these, I try to get in early and see where people kind of got interested in the arts in general, I suppose.

So were you initially inclined to that when you were younger? Were you interested in, you know, the theater? Or were you watching film, you know. Early on? I was always interested in theater.

My parents started taking me to theater when I was, I don't know, five years old. I couldn't really... differentiate between theater and movies i mean it was like i mean theater theater and and magic i should say yeah yeah and i went to a lot of magic shows i saw blackstone i saw uh what was the other great magician anyway i saw uh some wonderful magicians i saw some wonderful theater uh but what got me interested in movies was saturday matinees and particularly uh The cereals. I think the first cereal that entranced me was the Lone Ranger. It was better than any other version of the Lone Ranger. I don't know if it changed the legend or created a different legend, but the idea was that there were these five Texas Rangers and they kept getting killed off.

But one of them was the Lone Ranger, and we never knew which one it was until the end. So was it that mystery that kind of brought you in? I think that's it. That's cool. And the other thing was Tarzan.

I was in love with Tarzan, and I actually could do a pretty good imitation of the L. And you still do it on occasion. Exactly. Well, then, I guess as you got into it, did you actually in school pursue the theater part of it, or did it take a while before you got around to it? I went to a Y camp when I was 10, and one of the activities was a presentation of a play or whatever.

And so I wrote and directed a, I want to say a 10-minute thing, but maybe it was like three minutes. I don't remember exactly. Accurately, but that was it. I began as a director, and then I worked my way down to being an actor for a while, and then I went back to directing. Well, then, I guess what led you toward film?

Was it something you knew you were going to head towards that versus trying to do theater? I think that I never felt that I had any chance of breaking into the movies. Yeah. I didn't have any family connections or anything. And so I always thought that what I would do is regional theater.

And so when I was still in graduate school, I got an offer to act in a summer stock company. And I said, I'll only... do it if you let me direct as well. And so I began acting and directing in Summerstock, fully expecting that that's where I would spend the rest of my life. And then one of my co-workers in the Summerstock company was offered a job as an apprentice film editor at the American Broadcasting Company. And he wasn't interested.

And he said, but why don't you go check it out? Hmm. And I thought that was a great foot in the door, and that's what I did. So what led to Roger Corman? As most roads in Hollywood start somehow at Roger Corman.

Well, I mean, while I was working as an apprentice at American Broadcasting, which was actually in the studios that had originally been the famous artists, you know, Chaplin and Mary Pickford and blah, blah, blah, Douglas Fairbanks, I would go up for lunch. and sit on the grass at Griffith Park. And one day I saw Roger Corman shooting a movie there. Nice. And I didn't know. It's faded at that point.

I didn't know what a great opportunity that could be, but it kind of stuck in my mind. And then I was married to an actress who began doing movies with Roger Corman. And that's how we met. The rest, as they say, is history. Well, those early ones, how did you approach those early ones there as you kind.

Of thrown into it? Well, what happened was, you know, my wife and I started a regional theater in Los Angeles. It sounds strange, but it's like off, off, off, off Broadway. Yeah. And we did a production of Waiting for Godot and three other plays.

And Roger, you know, as a, I guess, a gesture of friendship, invested $ 1, 000 in our theater company. And we lasted a year, and then we were kicked out because they sold the theater out from under us. And he said, take that as a sign. He says, I think it's time for you to give up the theater and, as he put it, get healthy, which meant make money. Ha, ha, ha, ha.

So he offered me $ 1, 000 to. Write, edit, and direct Bistro Monaco. And you stepped up to the plate. $ 333 per job. Per job. Roger knew how to incorporate everything into one.

Well, actually, what happened was it was his first and maybe his only union project. movie because he had it was like Union out of Chicago and we had an IA director of photography and he had a Union editor and they would not let me edit it even though I was in the Union because I hadn't put my eight years in so I could be the apprentice editor on the movie I directed. Well then I guess at this point it's still sort of infamous the terror So how did you get involved in the terror, and what all did you officially or unofficially end up doing on the terror? Well, I mean, it was one of several, I guess you could call them second unit jobs, where I was adding footage to movies that were shot as TV movies, but needed to be expanded for theatrical.

And so I added 10 minutes to Beast from Haunted Cave, The Wasp Woman, not The Wasp Woman, Beast from Haunted Cave, Last Woman on Earth, Ski Troop Attack, and what was the fourth one? I can't remember. Was this stuff that you would go out and shoot? Would they give you the finished product and you had to shoot and add in? I would have to write the additional scenes.

Wow. He gave me the original actors and we would go out and shoot this scene. That's an interesting challenge, I guess, as a director to sort of sandwich your stuff in the middle of this pre-existing thing. So it was Beast from Haunted Cave, Creature from Haunted City, Last One on Earth, and Ski Trip Attack. Those were the four.

So then the terror spiraled off of. So that came out of that. It was just that extra weekend or something that he had. He had shot two days on a leftover set from the Boris Karloff movies and he asked Coppola to finish the picture and Coppola spent five weeks shooting all kinds of footage and still only wound up with half a movie including Roger's part and so basically he hired me along with Jack Hill to write Jack wrote and I directed the other half of the movie yeah. It's I'm always amazed by Corman's approach towards things and it's I don't know it's kind of refreshing in a way because he was so brutally honest about you know filmmaking.

But yet he never really. Sacrificed that for the art form I think there's still a lot of great stuff in the stuff that he directed and then as he turned it over to new directors I think he still kind of let them do artistically what they wanted to do as long as they brought in the. Profits So anyway, Francis took five weeks, and he gave us five days. Yeah, nice. Always prima donna, that Francis.

Well, so is that the first time you worked with Nicholson? I guess it was. I guess it was. And then we, no, no, I take it back. We had actually, before all this, just after I did Beast from Water Cave, one of my summer stock, you know, co-workers was doing his first movie and it was with Jack and Roger wanted me, just having come back from Vis-a-Monique, to kind of be his rep on the set to make sure that nothing went wrong because I was already experienced.

I'd made one movie, you know. You were the experienced one on his staff. Yeah, exactly. And so I was up there in Concord, California on the set of The Wild Ride And Jack and I just hit it off and became friends. And at that time, I told him that he should be a director.

And indeed, first of all, he started writing with me. And then he did become a director. Yeah. And I guess, I mean, even at that point, even early on, you can just see that charisma that he has. Like, he just expanded on it as he got more and more into the movies.

But yeah, even those early performances, he... He definitely had something above a lot of other actors. So we formed a partnership. We wrote a script called Epitaph, which was like his life story up until that point. And then we went off to the Philippines and did those two movies, and then we came back ready to do Epitaph, and Roger had changed his mind, and he said, I don't really feel that.

It's what I want to make now. But if you want to make a Western, you can do that. And then before we had finished our lunch together, he said, well, while you're making one, you may as well make two. That's Roger. How many days did you shoot?

Did you shoot both of these films simultaneously, or did you shoot one at a time? We shot the shooting first. We began somewhere in mid-April. We had a. Three-week, maybe a one-week break between the two.

And then we shot Ride the Whirlwind. We ended sometime early in June. What did Roger Corman think when you brought these two films back to him? Well, he was already unhappy before we should. Have started shooting.

He read the scripts and. His first thought, what have I gotten into? This is the craziest thing I've ever done. And then he figured out he'd already paid $ 10, 000 for the two screenplays, and he did the arithmetic and. Decided that if he quit, he'd be.

Out $ 10, 000. And if he made the movies, and they cost $ 75, 000 each, at the very least he'd break even, and that's why. We made the movies. One of the things, I mean, Jack. Nicholson was my partner, and he wrote this script.

And one of the things that he had in mind, and I agree with, was to kind of poke a hole in the balloon of some of the mythology. And one of the myths was the idea that. You take the girl to the bar and you know what you do. And so you know, and. Just the idea of kind of like making the white hat and the black hat kind of blend into.

A gray hat. So, I mean, I guess you'd already said you sort of had that love for Lone Ranger. Did you take to Western? Because you did several over the years, it seems like. So is that something that you sort of attached yourself to like the mythos of the Western.

Well, when we actually came around to, to, uh, making, uh, those first two Westerns, uh, I think by then I'd had other things hit me and, and influenced me. And, uh, there were maybe a half a dozen movies that we use as a reference point. Uh, The first for me, I don't know if Jack ever saw it, was William Wyler's The Virginian with Gary Cooper, like 1933 maybe. And Stagecoach, One-Eyed Jacks for some strange reason, and My Darling Clementine. So those were our biggest reference points.

I guess around that point you start working with some of the same actors in different movies. Was that something that you kind of enjoyed doing just because you got chemistry as far as like Warren Oaks and Harry Dean Stanton and all of them? Or was that just because they were there and Roger was shooting a lot of movies? Well, Harry Dean was a friend of Jack's. I don't think I really knew him before we did the movie together, the first one.

And. I guess Warren, I had seen in a stage production of One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, but Jack remembered him from several other things, and so he suggested Warren. Maybe not. I know that there were various factors. Casting, I've said it a million times, it's like they're... casting is 95% of what a director does.

It has to do well, and I can't remember the other 5%, whatever. But I remembered Warren, and I remembered my next-door neighbor was Millie Perkins. I don't know where the idea of Will Hutchins came, but up until that point, I had thought that we would make the movie with Sterling Hayden, At least one of the movies, the shooting with Donna Winter and Sterling Hayden. But one day, I just, in a flash, thought of Warren and Will Hutchins. And, of course, we had Millie as my next-door neighbor, so she kind of like, you know, I saw her every day.

It's convenient. So that was it. It was like a flash. It was just inspirational. And then bringing them back in over the years in different projects.

Was it just because you worked with them so well? Yeah, and I just love seeing Millie in Cockfighters. It was just so great. And Harry, I did three movies with him. I did four with Warren.

Five with Jack. Well, and then I guess moving to Tulane Blacktop. That were you because that was a very specific movement in cinema at that point was the car movie was it something that. You were interested in before that or is it something that just happened. It was just something that was that was offered to me and it was a really kind of saccharine obnoxious screenplay but i like the idea i like the idea i think what would appeal to me was the gambling aspect of my father had been a gambler and uh i felt an interest in that uh just kind of like born born into it and uh and then i just as i did many times subsequently we just took that idea and made it into something completely different.

Yeah i mean is it because it feels like it is sort of that very specific look at the counterculture you know that that because they're they're kind of hippies with a car you know they're sort of wandering around and they completely don't conform to normal society so it It is sort of capturing that. Place in time. They're not hippies like the hippies. Not the traditional sense. Not like in Easy Rider at all.

They're just anti-culture. They're not druggies. They're not into anything like that. They have their own separate world. Yeah, they're not even like weird free spirits.

They're just sort of driven by their thing. Like they're into the racing and just sort of wandering around. And that's, yeah. It was interesting. And then I was wondering.

How much you were connected to or what your thoughts were when you were casting two essentially non-actors to be your leads. Well, it was not something that I planned. I never really think that way. I have a great respect for actors, having started in the theater. But I couldn't find anybody.

And the first I saw... a billboard with the James Taylor on it, uh, advertising his first album, I guess. And, uh, I just liked his face and we met and we did a screen test and he, he just, you know, it was obvious he was so perfect for it. And Dennis was the last one, last role we cast. And again, I tried to find every actor that could possibly play it. Couldn't find anybody.

And, and he was, he was kind of like born into it. He would, He was born with a greasy rag in his back pocket. Yeah, it's like James is hard to get into as a character, but Dennis is so likable and so convincing. But James had a brother who was into street racing, and James was into it. But I didn't know it at the time.

I just thought he looked right. But he actually was into it, and he loved that car. He loved that car, and he loved driving it. Well, I wasn't aware of road movie as a genre at the time. I basically thought that all movies were road movies.

Another one of. My, not personal mentors, but mentor in the sense that he was a critic and film philosopher that I... put a lot of faith in, that was, it's Krakow, Siegfried Krakow. And he basically said that the difference between theater and movies was the street. Movies took place in the street. And even if you were in a room, if it didn't have.

A window onto the street, onto the outside world, then it wasn't really a movie. And so I always felt that every movie was a road movie. So having that. As a separate genre didn't occur to me. The only thing that occurred to me was I had this screenplay that I thought a good idea and was a terrible screenplay.

And my only aim was to make something out of it. And I hired a great writer and that was the key to that. I think that. It's very easy to forget the importance of the screenwriter. And Rudy Wurlitzer is a.

Great writer and is a great screenwriter. I just had. The good luck to have found terrific writers to make mountains out of the molehills I've been asked to direct. I was going to jump. Ahead to, I don't know, you've gone through different types of movies over the years and then I was going.

To get back into the Silent Night, Deadly Night series. How did you get involved in that? Well, that was truly against my will. I mean, well, the producer was a really good friend of mine, is a good friend of mine. And I just said, no, no, no.

And then I got the flu and I was like, in a very weakened condition. Preying upon your weakness. And he came, well, it was the same with Roger with, with, he convinced me to edit, uh, the, the wild ride. I was sick with mononucleosis. And he says, yeah, you know, you know, put in three hours a day.

You can go to the beach in the morning. The art of being a producer, right? So I just got, you know, my arm got twisted when I was really in a, in a weakened condition. And, uh, But again, I said, I can't direct this script. And so we literally wrote a new script in a week.

It's a totally different style of movie than most of what you had done. And they have such a weird set of rules and a hardcore fan base. It's kind of hard to enter into that world from the outside. I think what's amazing to me, looking back, is how critical... the women in my movies are and how important they are to the way the movies work. And just watching Patricia Piercy today in Cockfighter and Millie Perkins in The Shooting and Riding the World is just incredible.

And what's her name? Matt Rue. Valdivieso in Iguana and of course Shannon Sossaman yeah. Getting to that one but before I was going to say you've also done again just sort of working in the industry you've done tons of work as an editor and you've done you know second unit type of stuff so i mean is is it just working in general that you seem to enjoy or is there something that brings you back to directing that that does it more for you. It's i think it's all the same yeah i mean the worst part of the movie world is is just getting the movies made and raising the money i won't say i like it but i'm i'm kind of like I get into it in the same way.

I just say, well, that's part of the job. It's the challenge. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and then on the second unit stuff, how did you get into RoboCop and how that seems like a lot to deal with in that shoot and dealing with.

Yeah. That was weird because that was something that actually was presented. The studio suggested me for RoboCop and the producer, John Davison, was a friend of mine. And he says, I love Monty. I love his work.

I just don't see him as an action director. And then they were getting behind schedule and they needed someone to shoot second unit. And again, the studio came back to me and I wound up shooting a lot of the action. So I thought that was ironic. Definitely.

And then I guess. Verhoeven has such a reputation in the industry. How was he to work with? Well, I didn't really work with him, other than the fact that he's, you know, like everybody, like me, he's a control freak. So he gave me something that I never do myself, his storyboards.

And so he would explain how he wanted it shot. But at the same time, I had a certain freedom. But what I also had was, I don't know if it's good or bad because Marlon Brando thought I could never be any good because I was too nice. But everybody, all the crew wanted to work with me because Verhoeven is a tough guy. That's what you hear.

And a little bit sadistic and takes it out on the lowest level of the crew. And so people would jump to sign up on my crew every day. Or is that specific style? Was he making sure that you. Because it has such a specific look and mood to the movie.

Was he trying to make sure you fit what he was doing? Well, I mean, like, the most... I say he gave me a storyboard. The only thing he storyboarded was the car chase, you know. And that was okay.

I wasn't happy with the way it came out. And maybe I could have done something different that would have been, you know, worked better. I don't know. But, you know... you live with what you have. You said you didn't storyboard really in any of yours.

The only movie I storyboarded just out of insecurity was Beast from the Haunted Cave. I never storyboarded after that because I discovered that I never followed the storyboards. So is it one you just get out there and start kind of picking your shots and. Do it as you go? Yeah, I just let it...

My secret is lots of sleep and pick good actors and Let them show me what they have and then figure out how to do it from a combination of that and whatever the location is. Definitely. Well, then of the other jobs over the years, executive producer on Reservoir Dogs. How did you end up meeting Quentin, I suppose? Well, they actually... sent me the script with the idea that I would direct it.

And with Quentin's approval. So he had written the screenplay already? He had written the screenplay, and I was laughing my head off when I read it. And so I agreed to do it, and then he sold True Romance and decided that with that money, which was like 50 grand, if he had to, he would just make the movie for 50 grand on his True Romance money. And so we had a meeting and he said, I'm sorry, I don't mean to waste your time, but I now feel like I have the ability to direct it myself.

So thanks for coming out. Nice to meet you. So we were at a place that doesn't exist anymore, which was C.C. Brown's Hot Fudge Sunday shop on Hollywood Boulevard. By the way, which he... got to by taking a streetcar from Pasadena or something.

And by the time we'd finished our banana splits, I said, well, you know, is there anything I can do to help you? And he says, yeah. Get me the money to make the movie. Help this happen. Yeah, so I did.

Nice. Well, then, I guess looking back now, how... Because you read the script. You envisioned something before you ever saw what he did. How different do you think your version would have been?

I don't know how different. It would have been different. Yeah. For sure. But I felt after meeting him that he should be the director.

Because he has a unique vision in general and particularly in that. He's so passionate about his screenplays. Yeah. I'm surprised he did other ones as, you know, imagining how true romance would have worked out with him directing. Yeah, yeah.

I'm surprised he even let go of any of them. No, no, it was the right thing to do, as they say. Well then, you kind of taken a, you had taken a break on features for quite a while and then came back with Road to Nowhere. What, how much of an adjustment was it getting back into it? It was like, I never left because all I was doing all that time was, was bringing a movie up to the point of getting to make it and having it fall through at the last minute.

So it was like one, you know, kind of like lost, you know, it's like the fish that got away over and over and over again. Yeah. And some of the, you know, are terrific. And one of the, one of those projects was, uh, is the one that I'm working on now, which is love or die. And, uh, I have a couple others that I might resurrect as well.

I guess since we're here specifically for Harry Dean Stanton Fest, I guess just to tie it in, is there a specific story that you remember of Harry Dean that's memorable? Well, Harry Dean was, I guess, horrified when he discovered that the role he was playing in Tulane Blacktop was, as he put it, a homosexual character. And he almost backed out, but it was like too late. We were in Oklahoma. What's he going to do?

And I think it's one of his greatest performances. Well, it's funny because I recently had still worked at a video store, which just closed, of course, by the way. But it was funny, one of my co-workers was one of my favorite people, and we'd put Tulane Blacktop in, and it was his favorite. He was like, wait, wait, here he comes, here he comes. And it's like, you see him pick up Harry Dean, and he loves that performance.

And that scene. He's unbelievable. It's subtle, and it's kind of not. Again, he plays it so not offensive in one way or the other. He's just the character, and yeah, I love that scene.

But he's such a sad person. Which he does that really well over the years. He kind of knows how to zero in on that. So is there anything else you said you've got projects? Should people look for you out there or is there.

You know, don't hold your breath cause you never know how long it takes, but I expect that we'll be doing love or die, uh, in probably, uh, early 2016. And, uh, Possibly, maybe, probably at this point in Prague. Sounds good. All right. We will tell people to look for it.

Thank you for talking with us today. Pleasure. Thank you. Kona didn't say a word. A phone.

Question. Does your dog enjoy your films? And if so, does he have a favorite movie? She does, she does. Actually, she enjoys the audience.

She is the original party animal, and she loves being in crowds. And even when we screen movies at home with ten people, she just likes being part. Of the group. I don't know if she watches the movies that much. Once in a while, she'll see something that interests her, but most of the time, she just likes being with everybody.

Thank you. I made it for $ 30, 000 in two days and a night. This is Roger Corman, and you're listening to Movie Meltdown. No, he's an actual, legitimate living legend. I was in awe of him and continue to be.

Kind of. And again, like in so many like key points in filmmaking and I, that's what I kept coming back to. It was like everything at that time felt like it was choosing a direction for filmmaking and like it was making a statement and Even if it wasn't consciously making a statement, like, now we being film geeks that we are go back and, like, dissect every little thing and figure out, well, what were they doing? He might have just been making a movie at the time, but I like to still sort of look at it from both ways. Like, a little of the hands-on, you know, how do you physically make this movie?

And then a little of the, okay, now let's look back 20, 30 years later and see what direction the film industry took because you did these sort of things. Right. Well, it's fascinating. I mean, you know, he's still a working director. He's in pre-production on a new film right now.

And his most recent film, Road to Nowhere, is incredible to watch just because it feels... I mean, it's so audacious. It feels like a 20-something director who's been reincarnated four times. I mean, it's like all the skills of an 85-year-old man who's been at it for 60 years, but with just the spirit of a kid. He still kind of has that.

I mean, yeah, talking to him. you don't feel like you're talking to somebody 85. Again, I meet people now that are probably well, well younger than. Him that don't have a clue what's going on. So the fact that he's as sharp. And is on top of his game as he is, it's like that's amazing and more power to him.

Make more movies, man. We need better people making movies and anybody who's willing to do it, go for it. So I'm glad to see him working on new stuff now. Yeah, me too. I thought Road to Nowhere was amazing, and I recommend it to anybody.

What advice do you have for young filmmakers? I would say. Don't listen to anybody but yourself. I think that the mistake that a lot of people make, and I think what's wrong with a lot of current movies, is they try... They try to predict what's going to be successful.

And the studios haven't figured that out. What is it? 90% of their movies are flaws. And so if they can't figure it out, and they're doing it only from that perspective. And I think if you make a movie, I'm quoting now from one of my mentors, Arthur Hopkins, who was a great theater producer-director.

If you make a movie. That you are sure is going to be a big success and it fails, you've got nothing. If you make a movie that you love. And you have to make because you love it so much and it succeeds great, if it fails, you've got that movie. So that's the only advice I have.

All right. So any other key moments to round out this year's Harry Dean Stanton festivities? I don't think so. It was exciting. We were inspired by Tulane Blacktop to add a drive-in component, and it was so much fun, so exciting, and so great.

I think that that's going to be an annual part of the event. And the good news is that Harry Dean made no– there's no shortage of movies about cars, weirdly. Yeah. Sort of the time period. Well, but, but spanning the time periods, you know, I mean, there's, well, I guess there's a lot in the eighties, but there's repo man and there's Christine and there's.

I just like car movies in general. Yeah. Hollywood likes to make movies about cars. Yeah. Fair enough.

And then put Harry in there. Sure. Sure. All right, so assuming they're just amazed by these tales of Harry Dean Stanton Fest and they themselves would like to come to next year's festivities, where would they go and find it? HarryDeanStantonFest.org.

Nice. And we're already planning our guest, possibly guest plural for next year, and I'm really excited. So, yeah, just go to that page, and as soon as we know what the heck's happening next year, you'll know what the heck's happening next year. But it will be a lot of, you know, your favorite things about previous festivals. And then hopefully we're going to just keep adding on.

You do have a lot of different takes on it. It is one of those that, like, it's not just the same thing every day. You do have a different and varied type of thing throughout the weekend. So it's definitely worth hitting on. Multiple things.

We try to keep it fun. And we try to keep it boozy, too. Welcome to Kentucky. Bourbon flowing from the faucets, I suppose. So go get yourself an Airbnb here right now.

Yeah. We should be sponsored by Airbnb in general. Can we get that to happen, too? In the bourbon industry. So go make your plans now.

And get to next year's Harry Dean Stanton Fest. All right. I think that will round out this episode. Otherwise, that about does it. We will return next time, same geek feed.

Thanks for listening. Hit the road, Jack, and don't you come back no more, no more, no more, no more. Hit the road, Jack, and don't you come back no more. What you say? Hit the road, Jack, and don't you come back no more, no more, no more, no more.

Hit the road, Jack, and don't you come back no more. Oh, woman, oh, woman. What'd you say? And don't you come back no more, no more, no more, no more. Hit the road, Jack.

And don't you come back no more. No more. Now, baby, listen, baby, don't you treat me this way, cause I'll be back on my feet someday. Don't care if you do, cause it's understood. You ain't got no money, you just ain't no good.

Well, I guess if you say so, I'll have to pack my things and go. That's right, hit. The road, Jack. And don't you come back no more, no more, no more. No more.

Hit the road, Jack. And don't you come back no more. What'd you say? Hit the road, Jack. And don't you come back no more, no more, no more, no more.

Hit the road, Jack. And don't you come back no more. Well. Don't you come back no more. What you said?

Don't you come back no more. I didn't understand you. Don't you come back no more. You can't mean that. Don't you come back no more.

Oh, now, baby, please. Don't you come back no more. What you trying to do? I think I was born with Calvin Coolidge's music. Is that right?

Yeah. This episode is a production of Movie Meltdown, produced and edited by The Attitude Studios, with opening music performed by The Empires. For more on how to sponsor or support the show, email producer at moviemeltdown.com. Talk hard!