Stocking Stuffer 10.4 The Santa Stakeout with Carol Borden

All New Sunday, October twenty fourth, A rookie detective and the gritchy veteran are on the trail of a sneaky Santa. It's the same Santa from all three crime scenes. To Mara, Maury Hawsley, Paul Campbell and Joe Pantaliano. Gout my eyes on you too, star in the jolliest. Christmas caper of the season, The Santa Stakeout, All New, Sunday, October twenty fourth, at eight, part of Countdown the Christmas Only on Hallmark.

Here we are again for another stocking stuffer. Today I am joined by the cultural gutters one and only, Carol Borden. Hello, Carol, Hello, welcome. I hope you have packed some snacks and some Christmas decorations because we're going to be stuck in this house for however long we need to. Be surveilling, watching checking bulbs, decorating tinsel.

Have you had any experience on a steakout? Not that I'm going to cop to. That's that is the correct answer. So now you picked this with you today we were talking about twenty and twenty one's The Santa Steak Out, a Hallmark movie which actually surprised me because halfway through this, I'm like, this doesn't feel like Hallmark. I thought it actually was Lifetime because it just was a little bit sassier, a little bit had a little bit of a different bite to it.

But twenty twenty one is a very interesting year for Hallmark, and we'll get to that momentarily. But let me ask you first, why the Santa steak out? You picked this one? What about it called to you? Initially just the title.

Sure, I was hoping that they were in fact staking out a house for Santa. Oh yeah, I see. And then I saw that it had Joe Pantoliano in it, and I was like, okay, I need to see what this viz is. Yeah. Here around these parts, we just call him Joey Pants.

Yeah, it's just easier, and I think he goes by that. So yeah, so we I Man, now you're making me angry because I'm imagining if the movie actually was about like Christmas obsessed people who decide to stake out Santa and do that. This is more, you know, a buddy cop move, if you will. My husband pointed out something very funny as I turned this on and we started watching it, said, you know, it's really strange to watch the watch this movie when we have spent most of the day watching like season two and three of Lawn Order SVU, like one's understanding of police work can get very very different different messages between the two. So this is directed by Peter Benson, who's done a fair amount of these movies, and written by Greg Rosson and Brian Sawyer, a team and they write together, and they've also done quite a few of these movies.

So before we dive into much of the details of it, Carol, can you give us a breakdown of the plot and you can spoil it for everybody to know. This is on Peacock so you can watch it easily that way. But tell us what's the sat A stake out about? What are we dealing with here? Well, in the Santa Steakout, two detectives move into a house next door to a man who they think is an art thief and is using his Santa disguise to infiltrate fancy parties to steal art, which I don't remember if we watched this together.

But there's another one that's it's I don't think it's Hallmark or Lifetime. I'm not sure what it was, but it was filmed in la and it was called Most Wanted Santa. He Most Wanted Santa. It's a strange one because it's almost a normal movie. So it's like in the Uncanny Valley, where on one hand it's like really good for one of these movies, but it's also good enough that you start to evaluate it like movies that aren't Hallmark in Lifetime Romances.

I know exactly what you mean. And it's a strange moment when you watch a movie like that and you start to think like, oh, I don't have to grade this on a curve. It's a movie. Yeah. Yeah, And that one has Vivaka Fox as the FBI agent who's chasing down that hot Santa who's stealing from jerks and selling the returning works or selling the works to give to the poor.

So I was like, I think there's also a part of me that's like, I wonder how Hallmark will do this, and they it is sassier and they did it in a much hallmarkier way. Yeah, it's still there's something about this one. And maybe because I have I've watched one just on my own, which is weird when I do that but I had watched one recently that was a I think it was a very Vermont Christmas and it was set in a brewery and the whole time they're brewing beer and talking actively about beer and drinking beer. And I'm watching it, I'm like, well, this has to be like tv PG then, right, And it wasn't. It was still TVG And I was like, wait a minute, does Hallmark just not like do people?

Can they start to get away with things because now everybody just thinks they can do like they're only doing a certain level of, you know, of pushiness. Yeah, so you start to wonder like, ooh, like are they going to try to sneak things in? But can I do? Sorry? No, no, Please?

Can I tell you something weird that I just discovered? Yes, Like, we're filming this over the Thanksgiving holiday weekend and one of the things I've been doing is watching a marathon of far Escape and Wow Firescape. One of the production companies that gets credited and the episodes of Farscape is Hallmark. It's like Hallmark in the Jim Henson Company, And I'm like, oh, like, what the hell. Did they used to be friends?

Hallmark and Jim Henson Company. Yeah, and then like the stuff in Farscape seems very far away wow Hallmark, like the kind of sexuality that's in it, the weird violence. And when did Firstcape run? I know it ran for like seventeen years. I feel like it was one of those shows.

But what was in early two thousands? Yeah, like I think late nineties early two Okay, so right right around the time. I forget exactly when Hallmark Network became a thing, like around the time when maybe ideas were forming. But now I really want a like Jim Henson production collaboration with Hallmark, whereas my God, like you know, the whole like the thing they say of like, oh, take a movie and cast one, make one actor a real human being and everybody else is a muppet. Like do that with a Christmas love story or reverse it and just have it miss Piggy.

But in a universe of fame, right, it's gonna be Miss Piggy. A girl can dream. So yes, Sanda, steak Out is a low steaks, but we have a steak out. We have presumed art, theft art thieving suspect Joey Pants and along the way, I don't know, I mean sometimes when you're stuck in a house with nothing but Christmas decorations and somebody who is completely your polar opposite, maybe just maybe you fall in love. Yeah.

Yeah, they snipe a lot and then they fall in love. Yeah. Pretty quickly. All said and done, I'm gonna ask you a question before we dive in. Now it's twenty twenty one.

Why was this an interesting year? Well, I mean, we all try to block it out, but twenty twenty one meant it would have been filmed under most likely COVID protocol. Could you tell. I hadn't thought about that, but I think retroactively, yes, because they were ostensibly set in Denver, and our heroine is relentless in talking about how much she misses Wisconsin Christmas is compared to Denver Christmases. And at the time, I'm like, I don't know how they're so different.

Like I am a Midwesterner, so I know some things about like Wisconsin, but like there's snowy places. It's not like when he talks about the male lead talks about growing up in Albuquerque, and I assume that is slightly different than Wisconsin. But in retrospect now I know that that seems weird because I couldn't understand how they were supposedly in Denver when they were in this aggressively Christmas decorated small town set. And now I know, of course they had to film that. They had limited filming ability and filming in a city, so they're filming in one of their Hallmark cozy Christmas town sets and whatever.

It's done for probably Atlanta. Usually it is, yeah, in a warehouse in Atlanta, somewhere like a sound stage. I mean, yep, yeah, there was. Surprisingly it was shot in Vancouver. Vancouver.

Oh that that also makes sense because every actor that isn't the star has a slight Canadian accent. Also, yes, and there's I watch some of the Hallmark Mysteries on occasion with Beth Watkins, who's also at the Gutter but also does Beth loves Bollywood, and she has identified a particular office space that's in all of these things in Vancouver, yep, that they always use for the police station, and they use it. I think in this one. I would believe it. I would definitely believe it.

You can also it took a while in this movie before I even believed anybody was in the same room because there's a lot of shots of one person and then shots of the person they're talking to you, back and forth. I don't think Joey Pants was ever in a room with anybody else. Yeah, oh he was like once, but outside maybe yeah, yeah, with the the other guy who might have been his cocone cover. Yeep. Yeah.

So it's one of those things that and I mean I remember when obviously, like it wasn't that long ago, there was always that question of like, oh, are we going to remember these things? Are we gonna like catch things? And I don't know how much I would have thought of it if I hadn't immediately saw the date on this one being twenty twenty one. But as soon as I saw that, I said, oh, I bet we're gonna see a lot of you know, characters not actually facing each other. And that seems to happen.

Yeah. Yeah, I'm fascinated that they stuck with them for. Yeah, I don't, I just yeah, like maybe it's because they happened to have like one good close up of a map of downtown den they could do the Art Museum trial, right, because otherwise there's no reason for this to be Denver. Yeah, even the police captains talking about like ice fishing and fly fishing, which again are you know, like activities that people do all over but but it doesn't have to be done for with that because. It's yeah, it's funny.

We watched one last year that was set in like the most it was clearly filmed in Canada. I think it was. It wasn't single on all the way, but it was the other It was the fran Dresser one where her son is gay and she's setting him up with another boy, and it was the same thing where it was like I think it was Detroit maybe, like it was a city that they just kept like building up of like, well, you know in Detroit now it's really great to have Christmas. But the film was clearly not filmed in Detroit. It was filmed in Canada.

And so you're just sitting back, You're like, how is this working? How like is Detroit just paying for name recognition? But why did she was to do that this? It just seems like you're adding a complication you don't need to add. I think it's actually sort of the other way where like Canadian film companies, for some reason are absolutely convinced people won't watch things that are set where they're set in Canada, and so they're just coming up and they're they're also really convinced that all their places look like other places, like that Vancouver, or they're filming a lot in Alberta now or in the past, Toronto, Toronto, anywhere, and but we can I mean, we talk about this every time because you can always tell, and they might as well just go ahead and do it, like have like an Alberta Christmas and you can still have cowboys and ranches and all that kind of stuff.

It just seems like they're they've added a challenge to themselves and I just don't want them to work that hard. There's a lot of other things they could they could spend time improving. Yeah yeah. Oh well, So now that we've given story of the Santa Steak out, let's dive into the tropes of it, and the first thing being our female lead in need of a lesson. So let's talk about the star of this film.

Now, what is your experience relationship with history with Tamara Mawory Houseley, who plays Tanya or what is Tasha? Right? Is the fake name she gives? Yes, okay, not much of one. I sort of remember that she was on a show where she had a twin sister, but yeah, sister sister.

But I never watched that, and so most this is my experience with her, and I think maybe I have seen her in some other of these. But the yes, sister sister was a big thing. It's funny. It was Tia and Tamara, which I was tomorrow, but it's it's Tamara. I don't know how you pronounce it.

I'm just there's an E instead of an A. I also did not really watch the show. I always remember them because they were kind of a like they were like the Disney kids of I guess our generation a little bit. But I was also did not watch these. I know the sisters I think had a split, like had a really like public split, which is exciting because it means maybe one day they'll make a movie together, like a Baby Jane type thing.

But that's just always my dream with any twins. Anyway. I think they just had an episode of Elsbeth about where one of the sisters was involved in a murder that was like kind of sort of them. Oh oh fun, Okay. I don't know what I've ever seen her actually act, other than again seeing her in bits of you know, things that you'd see growing up.

But she's done a lot of these movies, I believe were a fair amount of them. Uh, And I I liked her. I didn't think she was great, but I thought she was likable and she was energetic and it worked for me. Yep, she was solid. And I don't feel like I feel like it's a manner of the material in the direction and not her of her ability.

Like I think she can probably do really great work, and she did solid work in this and yeah, I can't ask for more than that. And these Yeah, I mean she's written as the like a lot of movies will do this where it's like, okay, we need the type a personality. So she's very like perfectionist and very clean and very competitive, which is the thing they like to really like throw in these movies. And again, as a competitive person, I don't know how I feel about all of that, but it lets her play big and it lets her kind of go for something and I know it works small enough. Do you think she needed to learn a lesson?

Very like, very rudimentarily, Like, I don't think it was a big point. I think it was that that is so sort of baked into these things that it was sort of it kind of implied but never really drawn out with like she and the lesson was like she needed to learn to trust herself as a detective, and because she had left Wisconsin to become where her father was the police captain of Wisconsin. I guess he's like Jamara Murray from Wisconsin. Made like many I don't know, like Madison or something like that, maybe Milwaukee, but but she was acting very small towns so like she could I don't know, like maybe Wisconsin is just a big small town. Like it's like they just didn't drew a name out of the hat and they're like, it's Wisconsin.

Yeah. I know. I'm cue because I'm like curious now that we're saying it. They're so specific about Wisconsin. It's weird.

But they're not specific about anything in Wisconsin. No, they are not. Yeah, and they don't even say it right, they say Wisconsin instead of Wisconsin. I mean at that point and I don't even believe you. Well, let's move over to the Bland love interest.

So we have Paul Campbell as Ryan Anderson. Had you seen Paul Campbell. In anything, probably again in these, but I don't remember him from anything I do. I will say this is probably the most memorable I've seen him. If I've seen him before, well.

Since you haven't remembered him anything else. Yeah, And I thought he did a good job of being sort of sort of uh Joel McHale in. Oh yeah, that's oh, that's it. That's who he was going for, right, Yeah. Yeah, And I thought he did a good job with that.

He's a big home mark. And I thought it was interesting that they didn't make a big deal of like I watched the clothes in these a lot, and so they had they were doing like she's all put together in professional but like her professional clothes were like normal professional clothes. They weren't like I expect more over the top professional clothes where they're like she's so put together and like she's got a run yeah yeah, and she's like I'm wearing a jacket and some slacks at work, and like he's wearing a hoodie over a Henley and even that's not super slobby. So but there was a point where when they were in accord after they had fallen in love, that they're both wearing like jackets and shirts and slacks, and they didn't make any point about how he had changed how he was dressing more professional clothes.

But I didn't catch that. But that's a good observation, thank you. He so. Ryan, something interesting about the character of Ryan. Of course, I'm sitting here waiting to find out about dead parents, dead wife, did whatever here we have a dead marriage.

Yes, that's a good way of putting it. Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy when characters say the D word in a Hallmark movie. Yeah, you're just not ready for it. Yeah, it's like and yeah, because usually they're like, no, no, the true love is forever and when you fall in love, it's true love and so it's always.

But he was like, I wasn't good and I messed up. Yeah, which is you know, I don't know if you know this, but it happens. One of my favorite things is there have been now a few like sequels to Hallmark movies, and in some cases it's like the couple like And what reminded me of this is Paul Campbell is in one of the Nine Lives of the Nine Lives of Christmas Nine Lives and then The Nine Kittens of Christmas, and it was two ways where in one, it's like two characters fall in love, and then a couple years later they did a sequel where it starts with the characters had broken up years earlier. And I cannot tell you the amount of angry IMDb reviews from Hallmark viewers who were just zero stars. I won't watch this because I can't believe Hallmark would make a movie that implied that the romance that ended the movie before wasn't real.

Yeah, So, yes, it's nice to see things like that. Yeah, appreciated it. And he did that very well too, Like he had a it was like not super nuanced, because they don't want super nuanced, but it was a reasonably nuanced performance about like, oh, you know, I'm sad about my marriage and I've recognized now the things that I did wrong and now I'm kind of ready to move on. Yeah, And Paul Campbell is very good at these He's kind I won't say he's like the Lacy Shabet of these movies on the mail side, but he does more than one a year. He's done a lot of very different roles.

He's the one that I probably first saw him then was Three Wise Men and a Baby, and he's and all of them in that are very funny, and he does seem like somebody who has a really clear understanding of like what the tone to go for, and this one does. Then let him stretch that a little bit because he's not playing the role he would normally play. Yeah, that's probably why I think I will remember him for this. Yep one next movie, he's gonna be clean shaven and you're gonna have face blights, just like you led you in that movie. So number three is are setting a big bad city, a charming small town, or a magical winter wonderland?

Ah? Yes, Denver is a pretty small town. And a magical Christmas wonderland. I know it's weird to say that this is aggressively Christmas decorated when we're talking about these kinds of movies, but I felt like it was just so assertive about Christmas. It's Christmas.

Look at all the trees. Come on you, look at our lights. It's Christmas. I know. And yet one can walk around without wearing gloves in Denver in the middle of December.

Who knew? Who knew? Yeah? I did not see anyone's breath. No, No, that was all the COVID glass that they then have to digitally remove, so it made it easier for them to take that out.

Now Number four is our dead parents or dead wife. Like a dead marriage, dead marriage. We do have a dead wives. We don't have dead parents. We have instead of the like dead dad.

It's like, oh, no, I have a dad who's really hard to live up to. But then we have a dead wife. Who's our dead wife. Joey Pants' is wife. Joey Pants's wife is dead.

Yes, So of course I'm going to tell you why I forgot that he had a dead wife. Why because I have this okay, like, he read very much as a gay man to me, and I think my brain could not stop, like if he had a dead husband or a dad partner, I would remember it. And it was very interesting to me because often the male romantic leads like they're often played by gay men yep, and they often come off as gay men to me. And then I think all about all the poor, very Christian women who watch these and get their gata all messed up. I had that the lash when I watched Three Wisemen and a Baby.

I thought Paul Campbell's character was gay, and then halfway through the movie, I realized like, oh no, he's in a romance with this woman, and I was so confused, And you're right, Joey Pants in this movie does feel like a well, okay, jumping but I have to, like so I have. After this movie, I thought to myself, Joey Pants is playing this as if he were in hospice. Doesn't it feel like he is dying in this movie? And I don't. I mean, it was a rough time for everybody, it was a rough year, but it really feels like he is in a different universe of movies where he is like really trying to like think about his legacy and he's playing it very tenderly.

But it's weird for this movie. Yeah, yeah. And I think some of that is he is not as used to being into these kinds of movies, so he doesn't have the acting calibration. And not that it's bad, but I think that he probably really searched in himself about how terrible he would feel if his wife had died, and how he was trying to move on and how and I and I think that that informs this feeling of like you say that he feels like he's he's in hospice. And he's ready to go but holding on.

Yeah, it was. It was a little strange. Yeah, and I I am glad I didn't think earlier on in the film, oh, this this character is clearly gay, because then that would have really fucked with my brain because I think I would have been watched it and like, well, that's the real tragedy here is that he's not himself. But yeah, I'm sorry, no, it's I mean again, this is a This is like all in all, a pretty like kind of fun movie. It has some very good comic bits, but there is this like weird I'm trying to think of, like what the comparison is.

I don't know if it's like if you sat down and just had a bunch of little kids around you said, Okay, guys, we're just gonna watch Christmas movies. But you put on like the like the Jim Care Grinch, and you put on Frosty and Rudolph and Elf, and then you put on the Peanuts Christmas and like you forget how different mooded the Peanuts Christmas is and suddenly, like it just changes the dynamic of the room. That's kind of what Joey Pants is doing in this movie. Yeah, yep, he's bringing it. Yes, it's it's something.

And then I think it also gets a little tangled up with they. They clearly wanted us to wonder whether he was or he wasn't, so I think he was being directed. To, yeah, be mysterious. Yeah, yeah, that's a good point. That's a very good point.

Yeah. Now number five is our sassy sidekick. I think there's there's a few options here. What do you think did you kind of mark anybody for that? I think maybe Stanley, uh, the neighbor who first introduces like they're trying to be secret and surveilly and take pictures out through Venetian blinds and have nobody notice that they're being creepy in the neighborhood and.

They're they're very bad at this, let's just be clear, not bad. But but their neighbor stan Lee is the one who decides they must be the young, newly led couple that's moved. In that and he's power walking, So that is a sassy move. And yeah, yeah, doesn't he also wear the same or thematically. Same thematically same Yes, Christmas water Christmas better.

Ye, Stanley is a definitely good option. We've got we do have a sister character? Uh? Oh, yes, Tasha. It's not Tasha, it's what Uh?

What is what is her character's name in This Isn't Tasha, Tasha's fake Tanya. Tanya has a sister who exists solely for to talk to her about stuff. And to sass her about how she Oh is that guy? Oh? You said partner?

And I'm like, how fast do you think she gets a partner? Also, like, isn't a partner? Like? Yeah, Like, I'm a police person, of course I have a partner, I know. I mean, come on, does she not watch eight hours of Lot on her SVU before sitting down for Christmas?

Like others? Should she not pay any attention to her police captain father's light rights? What goes on in Wisconsin? I wonder a son, one more sassy sidekick that I feel like is a very important that I think is handled really well in this movie. Is it Talbot?

Is that the character's name? Yes, yes, Officer Talbot, Officer Talbot Hero. Officer Talbot. Is his whole experience trying to sneak into the back of their house and all the falling down and slipping and no one will answer the door because of the loud Christmas music. Yeah, it's a good time.

Yeah, I liked him. And then he had to dress up as a toy soldier and again that's a good thing. Yes. So number six, our villain an evil woman or an evil male boss. We do actually have spoiler alert, an evil woman in this movie.

Yes, an evil casting director of all things. It sort of falls in line with a lot of the mysteries that Beth and I have watched together, where the villain is almost still always a woman, like if there's a murderer, it's always a woman. If there's a thief, it's always a woman. An Well, I knew that Joey Pants wasn't going to be evil like. It seemed really unlike or it would be like with Most Wanted Santa, where it turned out he was stealing things from bad people for good reasons.

But it's it didn't seem elaborate enough for that, so I figured that it was not him. I did not clock it, but I remember consciously thinking about, like, who can it be, which I don't usually do. I usually just let it play out. There. And there is one red herring woman too, because he is it Alicia.

There's a neighbor who's just really into Paul Campbell's character and seems like, oh it could it be her? Or also like oh evil because she's just you know, going for this newly witted man. Yeah. I just felt as soon as you know, these movies are not movies that how do I say it, spend money when they don't have to, so when they hire a person and have a different set right, so when like normally it would just be Tanya saying oh, I went to the casting agency and here's what I learned. But when they show us the casting agency, I was like, Okay, well that that lady's clearly it.

Yeah, or she'd talk on the phone with her or something right right? Yeah? And I mean especially during like COVID shoots, like you would need to cast somebody if he didn't have to. Yes, now number seven is our montage? Uh?

What one or two? Do any call out for you? Uh? Nothing really with a they seemed very bare bones to me, like they wanted to have one, they knew they needed one. It did some work for them, and but like kind may be the kind of the Christmas tree decorating with the music yep.

Yeah, the opening credits are the art being stolen, so that's done kind of stylishly. And then we get Christmas charades mm hmm, which is I don't know. As somebody who talks with my hands, you would think that I would be good at charades. I find charades a very stressful and frustrating game. Yeah.

Yeah, they were playing peculiar charades too. It was like Christmas charades. Yeah. And they were doing a lot of. Sound.

Yeah yeah, yeah. I have got Every time I've tried to do charades and like made any kind of vocalization, people yell at me and say I'm cheating. So I did not appreciate somebody going ding ding ding and them saying jingle bells. No, that's not charades. Yeah, pouldered dash, not ball.

If I noticed that, I feel like there people will be far more annoyed by it, because I mostly I'm like, Okay, the movie wants to do the thing. They're doing the thing. It's like they clearly shot this in like twenty minutes, and the actress was like, they're having fun and they're just telling them, like do something, and so they're jingle bells. Yeah, all right, So let's talk about slapstick. And I'm going to say, I actually think the slapstick in this movie was done pretty well.

I agree again a shout out to Officer Talbot. Officer Talbot for the wind. And there was one scene that I actually did, like audibly laugh out loud at, which was the slow motion. And it's like it's such a it's a thing that it's a it's a trick that I've seen done dozens of time in movies when you have characters slow motion walking into a room and like in a group, like it's a heist movie type thing, and they're coming in they're really tough. And then you have like one character like just do like a banana peel lip like legs over the head, yes, and like you know it's coming.

But when it's done right, it's funny and they do it and it's really funny and they're just like el so it's even better. Yes, I liked it's not slapstick, but like the joke that made me laugh out out it that it was when the captain was really focused on getting his banana dakery in the beginning, Like that's just good comedy. Is like knowing that the word banana daker is funny. Yes, yeah, mm hmm. Yeah, and that that, and that the captain is like one of those serious police captains, and like the next thing you know is like, oh he likes banana dakeries and and he's got a banana daquerie riding on this.

It's it's a joke I didn't get when I was a kid. In the movie uhf right, when when when Al goes to the bar after realizing like he can't do the Netwiker's he's bad at his job. He's he's gonna lose his uncle's money. So he goes to a bar. He's like, I need a drink and he sits down in New Orders.

I think it was a blueberry jackery. But like to me as a kid, I just thought it was funny because they bring out the drink and it's like got an umbrella and the other character is mad that he didn't get an umbrella. And then as an adult realizing like, oh right, because going to a bar in the middle of the day and you know, drink ordering. But a banana daker is even funnier because banana is a fun word. Yep, is it all back to the other banana later on?

That's true? Now Number nine is our sage old person. Boy, do we have a sage old person in this movie who might have been might have thought he was dying while filming it. Ye, Joey Pants Joey Pants, and like, okay, I did write down one of his lines because I he he kind of like he also feels like he might be senile in this movie because he kind of starts talking and everybody stops and listens, and you realize he's making no sense and he's not answering the question like they ask him something of like, oh, what was your wife like? And he says, the best thing about Christmas is the people we share it with who are like snowflake, No true people are alike and everybody just like there, you know, they nod and their jaws go down, like you see them realizing like, oh my god, this man can't be an art thief because he's so brilliant.

No people, what it's it's very It's something you understand if you lived in den for I guess. That's a very good point. That is a good point, all right. And number ten, there's Santa Claus joy Pants joy Pants, but he's not your Christmas I know that also could have been a good repeal and we've taken it out. That's fine.

But you know when he takes everybody to his special make your own hot chocolate bar, I'm sorry hot coco because it's always hot cocoa. Yes, yes, And they go to his special hot cocoa bar that looks a lot like like they cleared out all the tiki stuff from a tiky Bardo. Oh, they definitely did, because they filmed that movie in the. Morning and then gives them a flight of tasting hot cocoa. I forgave them a lot in terms of my belief that he was going to be Santa, that they were staking out Santa.

I also think now that I'm now that we're I'm reliving that scene. I I like a cup of hot cocoa, like you know around Christmas, like, sure, give me one, Like I'll keep some of the little like Swiss miss bags at work as like a little like treat for myself, but hot coco. If there's one thing that is best one in moderation, like you can't have more than one cup of hot cocoa in any given time. So the idea of like a hot cocoa party where you're sitting there like doing a taste us and flinging them back. That just I don't get ill easily.

I would get ill after that night. Yeah, Like I was thinking about that when they like they basically brought out a charcoteri plank with five full size hot cocoas for their tasting flight. And I'm like, I, yeah, I would throw up. And I love hot chocolate, so yeah. No, no, And like, you know, they're putting marshmallows in everyone.

You know, there's no option for no marshmallows, Like, that's just a lot, It's a lot. Yes, And one of them was white chocolate on the end you could see, Yeah, and that. Would be the thing that would tip me over. That would be the yeah you know, yeah, poor Officer Talbot, you know he's in the back. Yeah, definitely.

All right, So let's move on to the bonus round, starting with the unlimited use of public domain holiday songs. Did you catch any No, what. I noticed was a related thing, So I hope this is okay. That they had like they had Christmas music that sounded like real contemporary Christmas. Music, yes, but that they had made up oh yes, with lyrics are just the instrumentals.

I think that the theme song had lyrics. Yeah, it was my favorite kind the Christmas list of just here's a bunch of things that are Christmas and we put them on a song and we think that we don't have to copyright this. Yep. Yeah. And then the montages I don't think have lyrics.

I think they had mostly sort of invented ones. But I don't remember any public domain classics. That doesn't mean they didn't happen. Oh, yeah, they always happened. There's some jingle bells, there's because remember, there's some carolings God Rest, Marry Gentleman, deck the Hall.

There's we wish you Merry Christmas. Because then Tanya Tasha like just to sing really loud to cover something up. And then my favorite, aside from the Christmas List song, the word solad Christmas songs is when they take a public domain Christmas carol and make it sexy. Yes, yeah, and they do it here. There is an It Came upon a Midnight Clear where it's like a woman very like huskily singing about that night that it came up on a midnight clear.

And again it felt like this should not be TVPG at that point. Yes, let's see now our secret family recipe or very complicated holiday cocktails. There are a few things going on on menus in this movie. I mean, aside from the art hot chocolate CHARCUTERI. Yep, there is the special family hot cocal recipe that Tanya has.

She calls it Santa Coffee. Yes, And the main thing is that it's like hot chocolates. Yeah, it's hot chocolate, and it has a cinnamon sick yes. Yes, and it's served in the Santa mug. As far as I can tell, oh, yeah, no, yeah, definitely.

I assume that she those are her familial Santa mugs and she brings them to all occasions wherein she makes Santa Coffee for people. Yes, it seems like she does not travel in December without that mug. And then uh, Ryan slash Rupert has his family hard egg nog that his father used to relax and fall asleep and calm down, and clearly there's like a really big depressing story behind it. Well because then also doesn't he later say I never met my father, Like my father left when I was young. So then you're really confused because it's like, oh, is it like dad?

Like Dad? Number three is hard agnog or like he was three years old and his only memory of his father is drinking his dad's alcoholic and eggnog. Yeah, yep, that's what I took away from it too. Are you an egnog fan? I know it can be very divisive.

Uh No, I am not, okay, but I respect those who like it. Yeah, I appreciate that. There's also at one point when they're doing the Christmas party at Joey Pants, there's a woman walking around with her Christmas cheese jewels. Yes, the greener pesto and the red I guess are sundried tomato, and I at first I kind of flinched, but then I thought, okay, I'm guessing it's like a maybe like less a cheese jewel and or like like a crispy, little thin breadstick. Yeah yeah, or like one of those not exactly like the same material as shrimp crackers, like the potato material, but which is I think also kind of the same material as cheetos.

But yeah, I wasn't sure. Like, I think it was supposed to be funny, but it didn't quite land. It was because they it was one of those jokes that, like the they had to once they said it, then they had to explain it mm hm. And then you can't like it's like, oh Christmas cheese roles. Wait what does that mean?

Oh well, quenis pesto and the red is sundry tomato. Oh that makes sense. Actually, like it just goes on a long Yeah. Yeah, I think they or they needed to give it a longer beat. After she said that, with her reaction of like, Okay.

This is what happens when you have to film a movie in eight days. You don't alwa's get that second take and yeah, that has to keep moving yep, very much because we have to find out if Joey Pants is a thief. Yes, and we only have can afford to pay joey Pants for like four hours of work, so we got to wakata yep. And also he's improving and like wrote his own script, so we also have to factor in that time. You know what it felt like to me, like going back to his performance, it felt a little bit like this was his unforgiven kind of but it's before he goes back to his life of violence and arts after whatever.

It is that like this is when like I'm good and I'm mister Christmas and I really love Christmas and like. As the actor as the character, like you think Joey Pants was like I want people to see me in a different light. I want them to see me as somebody who loves Christmas. I think that was part of it, yes, yeah, but I also think that the way he was performing the character made it feel like he was a little bit like well moony and and unforgiven, where he's like just a little bit it. It's living his like I'm a peaceful man now after my wife.

Right, you are not wrong at all. Yeah, Yeah, let's see. I don't think we have any small businesses in Danger and the thriving town of Denver. All right, Uh, product placement, there's a mention of a McRib but I can't tell if it was supposed to be positive or not. I think it was negative.

I think it was like one character liked them and the other character didn't. Yeah, and that he had them in his car for months. Which is also one of those very easy like dirty cup things. He's got McDonald's no children right in the movie. No, I think they went for old people some pips.

They have both. But now we do have a finding the perfect tree, Yes, right on down to I appreciate because usually it's like the perfect tree. In this case, like Tanya has a hole, like okay, no, no, it's about the smell, it's about the shape, it's about the like texture of everything. So yeah, and I appreciated the like they couldn't afford a lot of trees, and they're clearly not they're filming not in winter July. Yeah, so they have these kind of cool, very cheap paper trees that they've mixed in with the other trees, and they're like, we're just gonna put in these stylized trees to take up the space where there should be trees, but we don't have them.

It almost felt like they could have had like an actor wearing a tree costume and also just standing in that scene, yeah, to kind of fill up that space. Oh yes, Joey pants tree. Joey, you got another ten minutes. You're kind of the right size for this costume, would you mind? Now?

Number seven is empty coffee cup acting yes in seed one. I get so excited when it happened so quickly, and it does. But do the Christmas I'm sorry, do the Santa coffees count? Because I'm fairly certain there wasn't really anything in there, but they have cream. They had the whip cream, which, as I think, the rule of cinema, in case anybody doesn't know, whip cream exists in a movie in order to get on a character's nose, so then the other character can either kiss it off or gently, like playfully wipe it off.

Yees, yeah, yeah, a cinematic rule, right, yes, all right on eight actors trying hard not to take a bite of something on camera. So there's eating on camera, but there's also a lot of chewing without swallowing. Yes, where's a moment when she eats the gingerbread cookie and like she bites it and she's chewing, and she's chewing for really like you could tell her waiting for them to be like cut so I don't have to actually swallow this. It's a barboard that you made me bite into. Because I'm gonna probably have to do it a couple more times.

And have you seen that hot chocolate bar? Yeah, those cookies look pretty dry too, Like I believe that they were tasty, but I don't. Think a gingerbread cookie is ever intended to be eaten on its own. A gingerbread cookie exists to be dune, right, yep, like a biscatti, it's not meant to go in dry. It's gotta absorb soften a little bit.

It's a vessel, not a standalone treat. Yeah alright, So number nine, who is there canadianisms or obvious signs that this was not filmed on location? Again? I mean that's Denver, right, I've never been warm weather watch again, you know, I don't know, like climbing on a roof to put up lights in like just a light coat and no gloves in Denver in December. Yeah, yeah, probably not.

No eleven is our old people aggressively matchmaking our leads? Okay? In what way would you say? The way? Well, it depends on what you mean by aggressively.

Like he was not being aggressive personally, but Joey Pants was very invested in Ryan making a move and being together with Tanya or Tanya. Or Oranya Ortiya yeah or tomorrow yeah, or sister or other sona. So I feel like he was very involved in trying to get them together, as was most of his neighborhood. But uh, like compared to like, well you ought to marry them and I'm I'm lying to to set you up or far more aggressive things I've seen in ladies. Not aggressive in.

That sense, yes, very true. And now last is the fashion watch and if there was anything that stuck out to you as you watched and said, oh I want that. Nothing stuck out to me that I wanted. Everything seemed very I want to say naturalistic, but I don't think it was related to naturalism. It reminds me more of like in the seventies and eighties BBC television, the actors dressed themselves a lot of the time and did their own makeup, and this felt.

Like that, and again makes sense when you think film during COVID. Yes, yeah, I might have had more of that. Yeah, but I think the things that they were getting were very like regular person stuff, so nothing super fabulous. The one thing that did personally stick out for me was Joey Pants's plaid shirt suspenders combination, which is it was a little bit snappy, and I think that was part of why he was starting to read as a gay punt who had lost his partner. Some yeah, somebody who had better style than our typical heterosexual lunks.

Yeah yeah, yeah, Well, as always I am just you know, my eyes are searching desperately for pea coats. And to confirm my belief that Hallmark has a giant bag, and the bag is not that big. The bag might only look to be like a Santa Sack bag, but like a Santa sack, that bag is endless. But all that is inside is pea coats. And you reach in and you pull out a peacoat, and you reach in and pull out another pea coat.

And in this movie you have this. The sister character, we only get two scenes with right, two scenes of her. In the beginning she's walking down the street with her sister, and then later in the film they're like a a Christmas market together, So two scenes presumably like in the in the scheme of this movie, it's like three days later, so where the weather is probably the same. I don't know about you. How many winter coats do you own?

I probably own like four, okay, but they're levels right exactly. Yeah, you have like your like light winter, maybe like fancy winter, heavy duty winter and like back up to something right yeah, yeah, yeah, say, and I. Like the late fall, early winter, late winter early spring kind of thing. Yep, yeah, I have like a really nice peak coat that I wear for like fancy occasions. I have a heavy duty lands end that has like you know, the three layer thing, but it has like pockets to breathe and all that.

Like that's you know, generally how it works in this movie. And granted it's Denver, so I mean, like they're probably an outerwear most of the winter. But a character that we only see two times in this movie, and the two times, she has a differ different peacoat in both scenes. Yeah, and both, and the pea coats are stunning in both. She's got a red one in the first scene and then like a kind of like it looked purple to me, but I've learned recently that I don't see color as the same way that many other people to find color.

So it could have been like deep brown. I'm not sure, but it was like gorgeous, and I'm like, wow, that peacoat back, endless, endless peacoat back. What if we stole it? Oh, that would be a hallmark movie because we would think it was okay because we just want to wear pea coats and feel stylish. But like, somehow those pea coats are actually connected to the spirit of Christmas.

Oh, you know, and like by removing it from its rightful place at the Hallmark studio, it's going to cause some kind of rift. And then all of like the Hallmark people are going to look the way they really look and not the way whatever the Hallmark filter is makes them look. And it's going to make everybody. Yeah, and we're going to have the spirit of Christmas awakened in ourselves and our living environments are going to become a pressively Christmas. And I don't want that, and know.

It's really inconvenient and rude to people around us, you know, like just my if, Like I'm thinking, like, oh, yeah, my Christmas lights are on and they're not going off. And now it's January eighteenth. Oh and now it's April fifth and my lights are still on. And a lot of people don't want to think about it. So I, as much as I too, Carol, would love to dive in and live in the Hallmark pea coat bag.

I think we have to be, you know, Joey pants big about it and do the right thing here. I don't want the word salad Christmas songs following me everywhere I go. I just just because I want a couple of pea coats. After that you could only speak in word salad Christmas songs. Imagine.

Okay, here's what happens. If you commit a crime against like Hallmark Christmas like as in steal the pea coat bag, you are cursed with the only way you can communicate it's either Christmas theme charades, words, Christmas songs, or public domain Christmas songs. So if you like, I mean, there's a way to sing any public domain Christmas song and get what you want or express what you want, Like you could be longingly singing jingle bells as we said, you could be sexyly singing it came upon a midnight clear, So there's ways to do it. But like you're speaking a different language now forever, no exactly, so we need to, like I said, don't steal the pea coat back, no matter how beautiful those buttons are, I think really nice.

You want peacoats which are never as comfortable or warm as that you think they are. But anyway though, yeah, yeah, So all that having been said, Carol, do you recommend the Santa steak out? What did you think? Overall? It was a fun time?

Like if you like these kinds of movies. Yeah, if you if you want to see a more romanticy Hallmark mystery movie, it's it's a good romantic Emark movie if you're looking for a mystery. It is not that any of them are super strong. It is not one of the stronger ones. It's almost an afterthought when they're like, uh, it was The.

Lady pretty much. I think that was the pitch for the movie. There's a great pea coat and Mick rib and it's The Lady. Yeah. Yeah, And it has Joey Pants.

It's joy Hallmark movie, which is absolutely worth seeing and giving. It just like I really, I don't think it can be said enough. When I saw that Joey Pants was in a Hallmark movie, I figured like, oh, he's gonna play like the sassy Joey Pants role. He's gonna be like, you know, the wise cracking neighbor or like the criminal Santa. And instead he's giving this like very sensitive, soft performance that doesn't really belong in this movie.

But it's kind of nice to see. And I guess he just wanted to do it and he did it here. Yeah. Yeah, It's it's really interesting and nice to see him get to play a tender person. Yeah, it's not something you've seen often, yeah, said yeah.

I also I for what this was. I enjoyed it more than I usually do, like where I genuinely found some bits of it funny. Nothing was painful. The leads were good, they clicked well, it moved like this was a good time for one of these it was. It was written better, put together better.

It had like a little snap to it, which I appreciate. Yes, yeah, all right, So now, aside from the Hallmark pea coat bag, where else can we find you and your work this season? Uh? You can find me at the culturalgutter dot com. We are a website dedicated to thoughtful writing about just repeopable art and we have a number of super excellent writers that everybody should check out.

And you can find me on blue Sky now as the as culturalgutter dot, blue sky dot social or whatever. It is exactly that. That's my thought every time i'm blue Sky. Yeah, it's I don't really I still don't really understand it, but it's it's there. Well, good, everybody should follow Carol, follow her work.

She does a wonderful job cultivating great work and it's always exciting to see so well, with that all being said, Uh, put on your finest peak coat, don't worry about the gloves, and have a merry Christmas. Yay yay do do. Do do do do. Santas watching Santas waiting Christmas, defading the night, close the door, tu out, then. Just watching Santa creeping.

No you're nodding, No, you're sleeping. Doogle dou do. My man Dad set knows if you've been mad, theremind me a treat for you in Santa spag of tos, but Christmas won me fun and games for naughty girls, sand ball. Senta. Just watching Center, just waiting body center, not do wating do do do do you do?

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