Episode 803: Timerider - The Adventure of Lyle Swann (1982)

Hey, this is Emily sowderback of Scarecrow Videos Viva Physical Media. All right, this is. Matt Lynch, co host of Viva the Projection Booth. Podcast is sponsored by Scarecrow. Try out Scarecrow Videos rant by mail service.

Choose from over one hundred and fifty five thousand films and get Blu rays, four k's and DVDs all delivered directly to your door. Visit Scarecrow video dot Org today. Oh ye is bot, It's show tie. People pay good money to see this movie. When they go out to a theater.

They want cold sodas, hot popcorn, and no monsters in the projection booth. Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring. Put it off. His name is Lyle Swan. He's racing against the clock.

Spent are automatic in more ways. Than one lap. Because this ride, instead of taking him one thousand miles forward, will take him one hundred and five years and backward. Doctor that time writer The Adventure of Lyle Swan. If I'm right, sir, he stepped out in eighteen seventy five.

I am I glad to see you. He just happened to be in the right place at the wrong time. Wondered, if good, maybe you could show me on this map here where. Where I am? Fate gave him a present?

Are you okay of the past? Only trouble was he didn't know it. I say, what was happening here? Huh? He didn't understand the people.

They're one of those guys shooting at me like. That, and they didn't understand him. Where did the country I'm taking to us? Mostly say, I hang with technologic types. We party and they come up with all this banaro boogie.

In short, everything was different. Take off your clothes, well almost everything you ahead me. Misster Swan, Time Writer, The Adventure of Lyle Swan. Generally it had that machine, we won. A war, the past present fantasy of a desert wors a beautiful gun slinger where.

Foga park l. A renegade priest, beautiful s wh did you get this? Got it out an excess and assorted bad guys. Jumped up and down on it, up and down and kicked him. Time Writer, The Adventure of Lyle Swan, An off road racer who's way way off the road.

Welcome to the projection booth. I'm your host. Mike White joined me once again as mister Aaron Carruthers. It's Swan, It's Swan. We are kicking off a month of science fiction films with William Dear's Time Writer.

The Adventures of Lyles Swan, released in nineteen eighty three. The film stars Fred Ward as the titular Lyle Swan, a motocross racer who accidentally gets beamed back to the Old West of eighteen seventy five, where he has well the titular adventure. It's just one adventure, though I kind of wish that there had been more. We will be spoiling this adventure as we go along, so if we don't want anything ruined, please turn off the podcast and go watch the film. There is a out of print disc from Shelt Factory that costs an arm and a leg, but there are other ways to see the film these days as well.

So, Aaron, will was the first time you saw Time Writer? And what did you think? I saw it for the podcast, but I was aware of it because of the of our podcast Eighties all Over with Jemmy Green Scott Weinberg, and they were talking about all it's obscure eighties movies that never came to the UK or I was too young to see. When the athor was there to talk about this film, I was like, Fred Ward, I was gonna say, Bob the good, Tracy Water the cost and then I saw it and I thought, yeah, it's really good, and then other names to involve production wise, I thought, yeah, I'll get this a go, and it was how we enjoyed it. Yeah, I remember this one from the video store.

As far as the boxer box cover looks a little, I don't know, ominous, the way that the motor bike seems to be coming out of the darkness and all this, and I was just like, what the hell is this thing? Took me years and years to see it in and I did finally see it. I was kind of kicking myself just because it's terrific, and like you said, the cast is out of control. It is wild how good this cast is. And just everybody down the line even to like, what this is Miguel Sandoval's first film role, I think, and you know, of course you've got you know, like Tracy Walter, who I love, Peter Coyote.

I mean, this is just a who's who of so many great faces. And then yeah, Fred Ward, who just every single time I see him on screen, I just always enjoy whatever he's doing, whether it's you know, like comedy of quirky Romano to some of the things that he was doing in shortcuts. But yeah, I just really appreciate what fred Ward brings to the film. Fred Ward is either Tramer's or as a bratist film here. It was a Brighton knockoff of pulp fiction called Circus that had everybody from Christopher Beggins some Americans might not know, to Bryan Connolly, Flankey Jansen, Eddiezard when she was eddiez Ard.

And it's just as weird over communicated British gangster film set at Brighton. It's mod It's definitely worth for seeing work for an episode. I've always wanted to do an episode about the Remo Williams The Adventure Begins. I've just kind of been waiting because I know for years and years, I think it was Shane Black's been talking about doing an adaptation as well or going back to the books, and I'm like, okay, I'd love to do a comparison of the two. But and that's another one where it's like Remo Williams The Adventure Begins all right, when's the next one?

And it'll probably take you know, a couple couple decades, maybe half century for the next adventure to actually happen. But man, oh man, when I was a kid, I was just like, yes, yes, Remo, Williams is the best. I was so happy about that movie. Hang for The crival for me was The Rocketeer. I know we've done an episode on The Rocketeer because as I filmed, they grew up a lot watching as a kid was a Rocketeer.

And for what's goppening next with us some big it's a jet packing was meant to be both. Oddly enough, I think William Dear, the director of this and co writer, wrote The Rocketeer, so he knows how to start off a good story. For sure. This is the strangest time travel movie I've ever seen, insofar as our main character travels over a century or about us yeah, a little over a century, and has no idea that he time traveled until the end of the film. And I don't even know if then he realizes that he time traveled.

It's a strange eye diametric the way he doesn't know through the whole film that he's not in the pasty things just act kind of Western reserve cities liquors or songer, and then he turns up and his bike and they'll freak out over his bite his machine. At one point he talks about Harry Krishna's and stuff, and I'm just like, what he thinks. This is like some sort of far out commune, which is ironic because I always think of him in Miami Blues where he is investigating the death of a Harry Krishna. So when he starts doing like the Harry Harry thing, I was just like, all right, that's odd because that would be another you know, eight years or something before he was doing Miami Blues. But yeah, like, just no idea.

Why are all these people dressed like cowboys? Why? I guess they dressed this way in Mexico. It kind of reminds me of that DJ Qualls later the Cable Guy movie where they go to Mexico but they think they're in Iraq. I think I'll see that sometime.

Yeah, the whole time he's in this Old West milieu, no idea what's going on? And then yeah, the people from the Old West think that at first he's the devil because he's wearing this red motocross uniform or they ed laughter claims that he's sent by Heaven and stuff Ed latter plays a priest who kind of runs this town and is just bilking everyone out of all their money. And after a while you realize that he's in cahoots with the other bad guys that are in here, led by Peter Coyote. So yeah, it's just like you never realize this whole time. And it took me probably it was probably the second time that I watched the movie that I realized that he didn't even know what was going on.

It just he just he plays it so well. And as an audience member, I'm not screaming at him, being like you idiot, don't you realize what's going on. I'm just like, Okay, I'm kind of going with this. Thanks to you. The same time, I just watched it there again for the recording, and I think I got a vibe of Army of darkness.

I don't know too, It's like I mean, and in the backwards times, and I mean, he's not fay Worth. I don't know if he has or not, because Cosmotic is bizcompbell. But I then the satame time wasn't get a vibe of army of darkness the himbo in De blond. Oh, yeah, and he knows how to woo the girls. When it comes to the woman, who I think actually does run the town, I think she runs the priest.

Basically, it feels like the priest thinks that he's in charge of the city, but it's actually clear played by Belinda Bauer, who really seems to be the power there. At least everybody seems to defer to her when it comes to so many of the decisions. Though I can't say she's a bad person, she just seems kind of morally ambivalent. Yeah, definitely, she said that. Especially the scene where she says about taking off your clothes Swan, I'm thinking, is that me repe I don't know.

And the thing is to the fib of the film as well. It give us a kind of like a like a PG rating, maybe twelve A rating, and then then that seems ut of the balloon. I'm like, whoa and a kid's film. Yeah, it does feel very much like if I had seen this when I was a kid, I would have loved this movie. And I don't know why I hadn't other than maybe that I was only ten years old when this came out, so maybe I was just a little too young for this.

But had this played on cable and I caught it, I probably would have fallen in love with this movie. I mean too, it seems like kind of movie that we would have watched his Kids during the Christmas break and the bankalities over here in the UK. But and speaking a bit Biam Deer, the film that we used to see a lot as was either Think Teenagent it was called or If Luke Could Kill It was a Teenagent. Can remember seeing the videotape in the video store and I kind of quirky sci fi that does something different, and the film does do something different with it from the compound of the genre plus the Western, the sci fi, the motorbike, so it's a lot. It's kind of like exploitation movie light sci fi.

Yeah, And of course I grew up more on like Back to the Future, which is ironic because the third Back to the Future movie feels a lot like this. You know, this whole idea of Marty and the Old West kind of thing. But again, Marty's very well aware of what's going on and has been a Fish out of Water for the last three films or two previous films, and then when he comes to the Old West, he already knows the rules, knows everything. Meanwhile, Swan is just like, you know, oh, hey, why is this old man so afraid of me that he has a heart attack and dies? Like why are people amazed that I have this map?

I've got it at the Exxon station. You know, It's like he just is so clueless when it comes to that. But I can't say that. You know, you call him a himbo, and I kind of agree with that. But at the same time, he doesn't seem like a stupid person.

I mean he's he's definitely has read a few books, which impresses the hell out of the matriarch of the town. And I love how she has that. I mean it's almost like a well, they do have a sex scene, but it's almost like the flirting of everything really happens when he's able to start reading a book to her. Yeah, when it's Mark Twain to talk about fascinated by reading. And I mean back then, if you went to school, you're probably seen as a sissy.

But if you're educated and read a book because of the West was star harsh post quite old Mark Twain reading. It's an interesting way to in a session. And I like the little nod that he says, what I have you read Tom Sawyer yet? And she's like, no, I haven't heard of that one. And it's like, Oh, that's because it hasn't been written yet.

So nice like subtle jokes that. Are in here. They're not hitting me over the head with like oh, hey, you know you're again you're the man out of time. You're quoting from something that she would have no idea about. At least he didn't say something very obvious like oh, I'm a big fan or well or something like that.

Or Stephen King or are E L. Jeames If he said that, I would have just turned off the movie. Again, Deer doesn't go crazy with symbolism here. He makes it nice and subtle, and he knows how to make an adventure film. Yeah, definitely gently enjoys those biking shots across the lawns in the shots.

And I saw a clip there and one of the stunt team and he was going on about how that it just stopped somebody to the front of the steady calm, to the front of the bike, and it's definitely a DIY filmmaking when it comes to even stopping somebody bike. Well, yeah. Listening to his audio commentary is fascinating because he posits it as kind of a less send to younger filmmakers. So he's talking about like, oh, hey, if you've got a chance to shoot some second unit footage, you know, definitely do that. He talks about how he offered a kid, what was it, five thousand dollars for him and his friends to go shoot second unit stuff, and he's like, I'm going to give you this stuff, and you know you're going to come back to me tomorrow and you're going to tell me that I'm ripping you off by, you know, offering you five thousand dollars.

So they went away, they talked with their friends. They come back and they're like, yeah, you're ripping us off by giving us five thousand dollars to do this whole thing for you. And he's like, listen, this is an opportunity of a lifetime. You're never going to be able to work with this thirty five millimeter equipment at this stage of your career. You know, I'm giving you this chance to go out and just go nuts basically, and they ended up doing that and kind of started them off, you know, put put them on the right path with stuff.

And he knows how to really make a small budget work. I saw that he started a biker movie as well. I didn't tend to see the biker movie, but and this is how the same kind of style to the filmmaking that he would with time Writer and native films. It's very scrappy. Yeah, you can definitely tell he's a very very scrappy filmmaker.

And it's funny because I had heard of the Northfield Cemetery massacre for years, and I just always thought that it was someplace called Northville as opposed to a city that's about two cities over from me. And then when I finally talked with them, I was like, is that Northville, Michigan? And he's like, oh yeah, yeah, like the total Michigan boy. And listening again to the commentaries, you know, talks about Sam Raimie and that Raymie and Campbell and Tapper at all kind of did like Pa work for him on different commercials and stuff, and just it's like they all deserve all the success that they have because they were just so hard working and such nice people, and I was like Wow. And I loved listening to him in the commentary because he just seems so genuine.

I love some of my favorite film of all times, Evil Dead, so I appreciate Sam Raimi's work and the whole time. The Bill Warren book I loved when I was asked student. I read it from cover to cover in May May Times and God p book. I love too that they do little subtle things in here to set up Swan as the good guy versus the Peter Coyote character as the bad guy. Like when Coyote shoots this old timer that they're working with, and I love that whole thing that he does with the silk and kind of it's almost like a bullfight kind of thing, and he shoots him behind the silk that they just leave him unburied, and we've just saw Swan bury that old Mexican man.

So it's like we get that nice, you know, contradiction of Swan. It does the right thing. And meanwhile, as soon as we see Peter Coyote, we see him commit a cold blooded murder as opposed to scaring somebody to death and then just leaves the body to rot. And then the way that they use the two brothers between Maser and Walter as like the moral conscious of like we should have buried that guy. Now, how this apparition, this this devil on a motorcycle is you know, the machine as they call it, is coming to get us.

I really liked how they had that contradiction of those two characters. And then they seemed too with it too henchmen where they're stripping the body literally off their clothes and oh that's nice. That's so that was an interesting to Sade as well, that basically, when you're Dave, you strip your bones. Yeah. I like how he talks about the costumes and just how rady he wanted the costumes to be, like oh, yeah, they either stole this off a dead person or they've been wearing this for years or combination of both.

And I'm like, yeah, no, I really do like how they're the vultures in this situation. Yeah, and a maz I mean, I just fucking love that guy and to see him in anything, and I guess he had just been in well had he done the thing at this point or was that the same year, because this is eighty two probably. The same year in terms of production, I mean probably shooting. And Mace has got that voice as well. Whit Cat talks like the kind of rasp me.

When he seems to be the only one that can talk to Peter Coyote and that gets shot, I. Think that must be a kind of I don't know, maybe a secret lover affair between the two of them. I don't know. Maybe I WoT that mountain thing. I guess.

I do like how he's always looking out for his brother too, And when Tracy Walter gets his nose shut off, I think that's pretty hilarious. And then just take a bit of wrapping around it, and that said Luis's face off, Appy's face. Loft in his little line when his brother's season hinklined with the nasal effect some. Of this saying. And it's a bit weird as well.

I mean at the end I spoiled it where the said Kyder gets killed. The noise or the helicopter it sounds like there's a bit in bottom where Rick Neill was cropping himself with this cuttle prod the Halloween episode and the fark noise sounds it when Coyote is getting struck by the helicopter. If you hear it, you need to make a comparison. It's just as weird. Yeah, it's very electronic, and it definitely sounds like it's more part of the score than any sort of attempt at realism, which I think that has a lot to do with the person that scored this, produced it, and co wrote it, which is Mike Nesmith.

And this is one of three things that he produced, or at least like one of the three big things, because he also did Repoman. He also did this one, of course, and then Tape Heads, and we talked about Tape Heads years ago, and I love how he makes like the little cameo and everything in there too, but yeah, it makes cameo in this one as well. And then yeah, doing the score and just working with Deer, and I really loved when I was able to talk to Deer to hear more about Nesmith, and especially about elephant parts, because I used to watch that when I was a kid on television, and that just found that I remember that one I loved so much. And then there was a Steve Martin TV special that I loved a lot as well, and whenever those were on, I would try to watch those and then I think those were some of the early things that I taped off of television on VHS.

It wasn't just a monkey with a music video director. He was an expert. He kind of started the whole kind of music video making in general, like all the other guys in front of them started. And yeah, I love the video that you mentioned, the real it's it's still it's a catchy song. With the videos engaging, you can see why what would lead to other how you got videos now.

He was definitely on the cutting edge of a lot of things, and nesmuth As just really impressed the hell out of me with obviously his music and everything, but just his personality. I mean, I'll be honest, he was my favorite monkey. I would say minds too. Definitely. I heard him on Gilbert Gotfeed's podcast, and it seemed like a down to earth person, especially when this spoke about how his mum created liquid paper or what we call over here to pics.

But no, I just seemed got read down to earth guy, and I'm sorry that he's not here anymore. No. Super talented too, And that was the thing I appreciated, was just like, yeah, he could have probably just enjoyed a life of living off that liquid paper money, but instead, you know, he had a lot of ambition, definitely. He was a trained doctor before and then he went to audition and and that's what happened to the rest of his career, was the monkeys. It's not bod Waity Nna Cruster or inn a Banana.

The score for this is pretty fun. I like some of the dirty guitar that they have playing through this, And the music's a little contradictory to the film as far as it's sounding so modern, but I think that's really good because then you get that idea of like the music is basically Swan kind of being injected into the old time, and. That's some kind of cue to do with kind of the west On, the kind of spaghetti west On and end of the end, it's kind of like it has like music at any or video game that kind of like the kind of funky kind of drumming the type and it's like of our just it was an interesting contract between all the kind of princes and music. Music was the best part of the film, I mean successfully in trying to tell the story and how to say the kind of composed mood and atmosphere.

I guess there's another connection when it comes to Back to the Future, which is this whole idea of potential incest that's going on in the film, this whole idea of him having this medallion and he's telling the story to the to the main female character about how this was my you know, my great great grandmother's kind of thing, and how she got it off of my great great grandfather and YadA YadA, and he's telling this whole thing, and then at the end of the movie she ends up with that medallion or that that that necklace, and it's like, oh, okay, so you I can't say he's his own grandpa, but he's probably his own great great grandfather. And it's like, okay, well this is interesting. So I guess you were always faded to come back to the past or else you never would have been born, which really puts a whole spin on your head.

It's a little less creepy than sleeping with your mother, even though well, I don't know, I don't know who's hotter as far as the mom versus the great great grandmother. Because our main female character is Belinda Bauer is very attractive and like I said, I like how sure of herself she is. She doesn't seem like some sort of you know, damnsel in distress throughout any part of this movie. I mean, the first time I was watching the film, I was thinking, I've seen her faith somewhere, I'm thinking, and I realized it was a doctor from RoboCop two. And RoboCop two was a movie I saw a lot as a kid.

I was of her hoving fan even eight nine years old, and she did a bit of confidence, a bit, I kind of review, a bit, I kind of well, all everybody loves me right here, I'm the kind of head boss. But I I never knew that she was a Sillian. She definitely hides her accent very well. And her last role was at nineteen ninety six, and then then she's a chained psychologist or counstar in nele from doing the research. Yeah, I tried reaching out, had no luck getting in touch with her, unfortunately.

No. It was just fascinating. I mean, her first movie was Winter Kills. I haven't seen it yet, but the cost is I looked at the cost and her first movie working with John Houston, Stall and Aiden all these other great couter acts and she's had a could run in terms of working with these legends from what I've seen looking for her career. Yeah, Winter Kills is a great film.

I had a wonderful time watching that one. All right, it's going on the less definitely. I think she's like a model and she if they found her way into acting and then she had the creer that she hadn't now she's doing something more interesting to her. I wouldn't think of her as being Australian. I would think of her being more like Sicilian or something Godic look to her.

So let's go ahead and take a break and going to play an interview with the writer director of the film, William Dear, and we'll be back with that right after these brief messages. Matt from Viva again and Emily looking for something superior to streaming a place of more than ten times the selection available on literally all of the streaming services combined. Check out Character Videos, rent by mail service, select from an unparalleled collection of over one hundred and fifty five thousand films, and get Blu rays, four k's and DVDs delivered directly to your door. Get in on it now at scarecrowvideo dot Org and rediscover the wonders of physical media. I'm so curious how you decided to even get into show business a nice Michigan boy like yourself.

Back in the forties free TV, as far as our hosthold was going to start. Late forties into the early fifties, we didn't have a TV and I lived in Toronto, but my mom managed the movie theater, and so every weekend I would go and see the same movie over and over and over and over, and some movies scared the crap out of me, and I'd ended up like literally putting my hands over my face and hiding under her desk. And then when I look at those movies later, I think I must have been mental, because it was like it came from out of space and it was a big three D I but it scared the crap out of me. And then I'd see what movies I loved, and it was post World War two, so there are a lot of Westerns, a lot of musicals, and a lot of war movies, and so I just didn't know what it took to create that window.

But I got hooked long before we ever had a television, and it was a life beyond any life we could imagine. We literally when I was a kid in Toronto, our milkman had a horse drawn vehicle in nineteen forty seven, forty eight. It was primitive innocence. That's how it would characterize my growing up in Canada. Some strange things happened at that theater in that I don't know exactly what year would have been part of the early fifties.

They were going to screen the first three D movie ever, which took two projectors at the time to screen two images, so they had the test of the night before, and since my mom managed it, there was about six people in the whole theater and I was one of them. So I was the first kid in candidate ever s three D. Fell in love with the magic of it. Sounds so corny, the magic of movies. When did you say this is what I want to do?

I think I never thought it was possible to do that. But then my family had a shift in in my dad's and my new dad moved to Detroit, where his dad was one of the founding members of the i ATSC Local thirty eight, which was a stage fans union in Detroit, and they did all the show biz stuff in Detroit. They drag in live shows. They worked live television. They didn't have videotape then.

It was all black and white and no zoom lenses back then. And so he started working in television. And my best friend, a guy named Robert Dyke who's made movies like Moontrap and a lot of other movies. I met him at school and his dad had an eight millimeter camera and he was a sci fi bug like me. He was crazy for it.

And all the Harry Hausens that we go see every Harry Hausen movie, they'll make a home, we build a cyclops, we build the skeletons, we would we would do stop motion. So it was suddenly I was being able to touch making a movie. And I think that's then. Then as I got to be eighteen, I joined the Union as an apprentice, and I got to work on live television and different things aspects of live shows, and I got to see and very very rarely did you ever get to see a movie. Because the movie came into town, all the older season guys got it because it was big rate, that was big money.

That was called a five forty job. They made five dollars and forty cents an hour, and if you got a five forty job, you were in the money. So us apprentices never got that. We got the ship jops like spotlight operator, which would be a three hour gig. They pay a twenty six bucks, and it were doing your whole day because you couldn't work a day job, because you wouldn't get off in time to go to your spotlight job.

But when I look back at that, I couldn't be happier because we worked the Beatles, we worked the stones, we worked everybody. I look back now and it's just heaven. It just as absolute heaven. So all all things turned for the for the good. And I just always wanted to make movies.

And with the eight milimeters we started to make stop motion. We do silly movies to ourselves. Just it was a passion, it just and I'm I'm an artist, I'm a painter, and and I think that movies just became another way of a way to express a vision or something. I do a lot of studio paintings, sort of treating the studios like they were canyons. I've got a series of paintings I call Canyons of Dreams and Uh, just a series of of paintings getting back into it.

I'm getting back into it. I'm really feeling good about it. So I just I started getting back got me into water colors. I'm an oil painter, but water colors are so fast in experimenting. So now I've got a little water colors that I am now going to take that energy that I've re mustered and get back into my oil painting.

So I'm feeling pretty good about those things. Are you self taught or did you train for that? No? Like, I was an art major at school, but I didn't go to art school. My son went to art school.

I didn't go to art school, but I went to I was art major, theater minor. So you said you were making little movies on your own. Is that kind of how you finally kind of broke into the industry. Yeah, We meaning my friend Robert and his cousin Tom. We got together in Detroit and we made a motorcycle movie we called it was It was, you know, nineteen seventy one.

We started shooting and Vietnam was raging, So one movie was called Freedom a IP and we were making a statement about the unjust sort of oppression of our government. Thumnia could never happen. So we made this Mooricycle movie and we shot on sixteen and we loved we I was still working as a stage han, you know, supporting my family, and everybody was doing what they could to make this movie. It was going to take us five months. It took us five years.

But I'd get short ends from they were still shooting film at the at the news stations. It was before electronic news. So I'd get short ends from the guy in the processing room and I'd spool him into my bulllegs, you know, and we'd shoot the movie on short ends, and I take him back to the studio heat process them a night for us. But we did this whole movie. We got it released by Cannon.

He got a theatrical release. But this is the old canon, before Golden Globus. This was the canon to put out Joe with Peter Boyle years ago, to Chris Dowie and Dennis Friedlan or so somebody like that. I don't know they were. They were the most honest distributors I've ever worked with, and that is because they regarded us as some idiots who were stupid enough to give him our movie.

And where their honesty came in is the guy said to me, he says, you'll never see a fucking penny. Okay, I didn't realize how honest he was being. Anyway, I don't regret any of that. You know. It's the key is It's like you don't do a painting to put it in the closet, you know, you don't do a movie to put it on the shelf.

If you want eyes in front of it, you want people to enjoy it, to hear it, to listen to it, to feel it. So for all the ways the business can smack you around, I don't regret anything. I'm very fortunate to have been able to express myself artistically in this business. And I don't the word artistically. I mean, I don't even like referring to myself as an artist.

You know, where does Nymph fit into things? Nymph? You got it? This was a surprise to me. Nymph was a movie.

A fella named Tom Blanchard had a commercials company. This fella in Detroit back in who do know when it was now, probably it'd be the halfter the seventies. Guy moved out to California in seventy eight, but he wanted to do a movie and he had written a script, and the script was called Go Find Your Father. And it was pre cell phone and there wasn't even exhibit a pre computer's pre bhs. Let's see how long ago this this movie was.

So basically the premise was this hippie couple. We opened out a party with smoking dope and a hippi couple, and they get a phone call. Gourget's phone call. Her mom has been in a terrible car accident. Now there's no way to reach dad.

He's in the Upper Peninsula deer hunting with his buddies. So they have to drive up through Michigan, deeper and deeper into redneck country as if they were driving into the South, but driving north and their hippies and so it was like, hey, long haired as so, you look like your girl? Was that kind of movie. Then it wasn't very good. It wasn't very good.

It was my first movie as a director. The guy. I can speak about these folks now because they're passed on. But I remember one night he had a Tom Blascher had the producer had a big to do where he got all these people and he hyped it up and raised money, and we raised forty thousand dollars that night, and that was a big lump for the movie that we were trying to make. Were we're shooting thirty five, but that was a big lump, and so we next morning we went in with that, Oh man, this is so cool.

What am we going to do it? And he said, you guys can get back on it now. And I'm thinking, and the other guys that my cameraon and Pet anyway, we're all going, oh, great, great, great, And then Blanchard tells us, Okay, we did forty thousand dollars last night, so you guys can have four grand of that put towards the movie. Where's the rest of you? I raised it so literally.

I was the director, one of the writers. I was a sound man. I got a shot to me someone with long hair and nagara around my neck, and we and then when we'd moved the camera, the cameraman hauld carry the camera and the batteries and stuff. I'd carry the tripod on it in the snow. We just made a movie.

And then we never heard of it for a while. Because Blanchard was the kind of guy he was and it was his movie, and I'll tell you how terms were. I had a pay to get into the premiere, so we weren't on the best of turns, okay, And then we never heard about the movie for years, and then all of a sudden it comes out and it's called Nymph, and there's nothing in it because there's anything to do with the word nymph. There's just nothing. It's two hippi stepping to travel into redneck territory to find their father, and that's the whole gist of the movie.

So this nim thing I have tried to track down. I've seen little posters on the line of Nymph. I've never seen it in a physical form as Nym. I've never seen a print of it with the title Nymph on it. But it has nothing to do with Nymph.

And if anybody can find a copy of Nymph, make it available or somebody, because I don't have a copy of go find your father, and I would love to, even though I know it's got to be pretty terrible. But that's how other word nim that's how the whole thing came about. It was a surprise to us. Oh and then I loved the catch line on the poster. This I never forgot because there was nothing in the movie that related to this.

She could turn a boy into a man and a man into an animal? Did that come from? So that's the story of Nymph. This might be outside of the purview, but you're talking about a guy named Blanchard from Michigan. Any relation to our former governor Jim Blanchard?

Okay? All right? He was an entrepreneur in his own and not a bad guy. And then he supported me wanting to direct and shoot and stuff like that. So he gave me commercials to do, and then when it came time for him to make this movie, he let me run with it with the small amounts we had, and it just wasn't very good.

Then we did another movie on our own, motorcycle movie, which the distributor again renamed. We did Freedom Rip. Yeah, they renamed the Northfield Cemetery Massacre. Is Freedom Rip or Northfield Cemetery Massacre? Is that your first time working with Michael Nesms?

Yes? And that came about in that we were we I say, that's Tom Dyke, my friend Robert's cousin. He and I wrote it and shot and directed Bream Rip and we came out to California. We made a deal with an editor, and the editor he wanted the credit post production supervisors, so he made all kinds of financial concessions and everything does because he wanted that credit. Said sure, we didn't even know what it meant, you know, and we're getting a good deal here.

So it was a good deal. Let me talk about Netsman. I'll go back to talking about our editor, because it was pretty funny what happened with him. But anyway, the movie mckayb and Missus Miller back then had really made an impression on me. I just loved that movie, Alban's movie.

And I saw an ad in the La Free Paper and it said the independence was called the Free Press. The La Free Press used to hang it and they still might hand it out free. And it said McCabe. The word McCabe copy. It said McCabe's guitar shop on Santa Monica Boulevard, and I guess it had a little venue in the back, and said playing tonight Michael Netsmith, and I remember him from The Monkey Show and we were looking for someone to score the movie.

So I called up the place mccab's and found the time. He was on and went down there and we met with him after the show and we asked him if he'd be interested in scoring a movie, and he said yes, And I can remember taking him to the editor's place. It was out towards Pasadena, but not quite the Pasadena and Michael and I looked at the movie. I don't know where Tom was at this time, but we looked at a stand up Movieola. So we watched the whole movie on a little square screen about this big two two thousand foot reels at the end of the movie and I didn't have All it had was the voice track and whatever minimal track we had on it.

It wasn't didn't have any finished tracks on it. Michael looks at me and he goes, this is a terrible movie. I said, yes, I know it is. I said, do you want to score it? He said yes.

That's the exact conversation was there, all the words, and we struck up a friendship. There was a real We had great time. We made it. We made Time Rider. We won a Grammy for All fun Parts, the first Grammy ever for a video, and you know, it was great.

Michael went on to his other things that I went onto my other things, but I met and as was because of that word McCabe. And then after we did the score for a Northfield Seentury massacre, like I said, I decided, I'm gonna if I'm going to really really pursue my dream, I gotta move to California. When I told my friend Robert, who I has partnered with and everything, I'm going, I gotta go man. And so in nineteen seventy eight, I just picked up my whole family and we moved to California. And Michael was living in Carmel at the time, so we moved to Carmel and I lived in Carmel for twelve years.

And then when my children were more of an age where they were going to work in the business, because I was still hopped down to LA and do commercials now and then is I thought I got to get as closer to LA, but I didn't want to really bring my kids up in LA. So we moved to Santa Barbara and that's where I've been for the last thirty five years. The short hop of LA and peaceful. Oh you're going to talk about the editor. We're just learning the term production post vircttional supervisor and we said, yeah, what does that mean.

It just means I oversee the pogram. Oh yes, sounds good. And our lead actor was very bad, very bad. He was kind of a small guy with long blonde hair and the bikers pick him up hitchhiking and it's his adventure with the with this bike club, the Scorpions and basically the Spirits and movie with the so real we hired a real bike club because they came with hot motorcycles, they came with their their women, they came with their outfits. All we had to do is make the colors and that they wore.

So he said you could you could a dr this guy and we said okay, what does that mean? He said loop them. We go okay, what does that mean? And he's replaced his voice through the entire movie and oh really, because we were learning, we didn't know this this stuff. So we had seen this fell in a play in Westwood.

It was Injured the Prison and we said, well he's a good actor. Let's so we had just literally wait at the stage door. He came out. We introduced ourselves. We told him from Michigan and we said, yeah, we're interested in ad ring one of our part because we just learned the term two days ago.

And then probably my friend Tom said, yeah, we're gonna loop it. We were using all the terms we learned and he said, uh. We said it's the lead character. And he said how much money you got and I said one hundred and fifty bucks. He said for the whole movie, for the lead yep, and he did it.

Nick Nolty. Two weeks later he was doing rich Man. He got rich Man for Man and became a star. So our our lead guy in our movie kind of talked about this kind of Nick naughty boye. He's younger, but he's totally adr by Nick Nolty.

So it's a much for better performance. But it says way, it's a hoot, you know. And I don't know if people would pick up on it or not, but we we love that story about learning terms, getting a guy and getting to loop the movie and loop it. See now I've even say it, but that's that's the end. Yeah, there was a good guy.

He wanted that credit, post production supervisden. We would barger anything to get it done. Word just that way. So did I read write that you worked with Paul Schrader for a little bit Michigan. Yeah, what would happen is being in the Union Local thirty eight.

I also joined what was then there was three caming unions in NA. There was six fifty nine in LA, sixty sixty six in Chicago, and six hundred in New York. And they've consulting into one local now six hundred. But I joined the Chicago local, and there was a rule within the IA that if a movie came to town, then if they brought a cameraman and an assistant or something like that, then they would have to then also put on a union cameraman from the union and a union assistant. They'd have to man for man them union wise for bringing other guys into our union territory, some union rules thing.

And I realized that when they do that, they the union would give them some old cinematographer who hasn't worked for years, and he'd sit on an apple box for six weeks while he shoot and get paid every day. And so I heard that Blue Collar was coming to town. I didn't know Paul Schrader from anybody except that Nesmath had taken me to see taxi driver, and I knew that Paul Schrader wrote it, so I literally blew myself to La got a meeting with Paul Schrader. I said, look, here's what the union is going to do. They're gonna put some guy who's gonna sit in an apple box.

If you hire me, I'll work my ass off. Whatever you want to do was okay, And then when we discovered it, we worked at the Checker plant whether they did Checker cabs and Kalamazoo because the big three outmakers didn't want to do with us. You couldn't go wrong. Windows that were soot and grease, dirty for thirty years, with sunlight coming through them, and pieces of shiny steel that would go into a press come out a fender, and guys all sweaty, and guys with a welding towards lighting a cigarette. So as a second yearit cameraman, I was like a halp beard and I was in Heaven thirty five millimeter, and the one of the producers, Buzzfeisten, who later went on to produce nineteen forty one and other big movies, he looked at the second UNI stuff.

He said, okay, I want to know when the actors aren't working on the A unit And I want to send the actors out with Bill and they so they send Yaffakodu out with me for a day and I'd walk him through all these scenes in the plant. Then they send Harvick I tellout for me for a day. Everything work good. It was my first ever real film credit on a film that was produced by the studio, and I Sraider. I talked about coming back to do Hardcore.

I was doing conne'cement that we're going to shoot part of what turned into the Elephant parts, and I said, I conflicted. By about three days. I said, I really can't. I have to work until I make. It's up the tenth of February, and you're asking me to commit on the seventh.

He says, oh, coming on the eleventh. It doesn't matter, man, I want you back. So what he did is he hired me to come back and be the second year of DP on Hardcore. And what was nice about that too, is that he called up early. That was in that we fat I think around in February, but he called up early and asked me if I could put having done blue Collar, if I could put a small crew together, just bet an assistant, maybe one more person and he wanted to shoot the opening credits to Hardcore in Grand Rapids during the snow, when all the Christmas decorations were up.

So he flew out and him and Brian Greenberg, my assistant, and myself we all went around and did the whole o mening credit sequence for Blue Collar. Then I went back back. I did the thing with ne Smith, came back to for Grand Rapids three days after they started, and I worked the whole second unit on Hardcore, and I would have done American Jiggielow, but Nesmith and I were really deep into getting what we were trying to do with our Elephant Parks project, the one that ultimately won the Grammy. We were deep into that, so I didn't get to do that, but it was amazing. I remember sitting in the bar in Grand Rapids and Schrader there with a yellow notepad and he's he's really frustrated, and he was talking about what a hard time he's having.

We're trying to do the movie here and he's trying to do this. He's got what is this? And this was Raging Bull, and so what he was doing he was trying to get his story straight on Raging Bull and he was debating it was it was a son Jake Lamarta. To stop himself from masturbating in the cell, he would beat his hands raw against the wall. It was up here stuff that Trader could deal with.

You. Me, I'm I'm waving at bigfoots and doing a lighter fare. But Trader could take this stuff on you. But he explained something to us and sitting at the table, and it was so amazing. He talked about how he writes a screenplay.

And I'm sure he would get mad at me for saying, as it was like fifty years ago, but he said it was so smart. He said, forty to sixty things happened usually in a movie. And he said he'll write down in one or two sentences each of those things, and then he'll assign them. This was the intersing part. He'll assign them a page count like this seemed to be one and a half pages.

This seems to be three quarters of a page. This would be one page, he said. And then when he's writing the screenplay, if suddenly he's on page ten and according to his little beach shed made with his estimated times, he's only on page sixty. He's going why am I stretching this? Or why am I making the audience wait so long for this?

It was just a fascinating, you know, lesson that you would never get, you know, from anybody else. And this is just someone sitting over a beer at a table, you know, in a bar. But so again I treasure those moments, you know. And and George C. Scott's character working in a you know, as a frinch manufacturer and the subject of hardcore being about his daughter running off and getting swept into poedography.

It was amazing how many, as a second unit cameraman, how many sexual shots there were in a furniture factory, two holes being drilled in slow motion. It became very very odd so that you could really like I could tie very easily the auto plant into the story of blue collar I found I could tie what was going on in the in the This is probably my director's side coming through my being a second unit DP, because I was in charge of my own crew. I didn't have a director, so it was just I just had the run of what I wanted to do. But I gradually could see this kind of sexual pairing between some of the second unit some of the what Georgie Scott did. And the theme of the movies I always trying to make it more.

I guess that's what we do. We try to make it more, try to bring more to it. Now I remember seeing Elephant Parts. Where would I have seen it? Was it on television?

Was on cable? Like? How was it distributed? Back then? It was a VHS and it did well as a VHS.

But then also we did a very limited NBC did a limited show They canceled that for eight or ten episodes called TV Parts. We tried to put Elphin Parts on television. It didn't work. It just didn't work. Elephant Parts was it was comedy and music and stuff that we had shot on our own just for laughs.

Next withth and I and had We, I think we had seventeen minutes of film and Michael said, why don't we turn this into an hour? He had come back from Australia and there was a show in Australia called pop Clips, and pop Clips was music videos on television with a host and then they called a music video a pop clip back then in Australia. And so we shot a pilot called pop Clips and there was only fifteen videos in the world music videos. There was one of the live performance of Freddie Mercury, there was the babies singing there when there was video killed the Radio Star. There was a few wires that we had and the but of the fifteen or so videos that existed, Nestmith and I had done four of them, so we decided to put elphin parts together.

Now, we decided, why don't we try to sell pop clips in America as what became MTV, And we were a year too early. We had Norman Lear, who was hot as a firecracker, trying to sell it, and people said, nobody's going to watch music on television, and then Warners, Bob Pittman at Warners got MTV running and got up and running and this was a terrible irony. Couldn't meet their schedule for their start date. So they hired us and we used our pop clip set. We tried to sell this pilot a year ago and people said, no, you're never going to do it, And we made the first one hundred and fifty shows up in Monterey and our little garage where we shot alpha parts.

We made the first one hundred and fifty MTV shows right there, using our pop clips set, so certain ibnies happened. Yeah, yeah, but we won the Grammy first ever video, so that's nice. That was sure a good time. And then Bill Martin was one of the writers and performers in it, and he was just a reconteur of the ridiculous amazing Commy usually the original writers on Harry and Henderson, real azing comedy writer. Just on his own, he would just start telling stories.

Just amazing guy, crazy, crazy, but wonderful. What was Mike Nesmith like to work with? He was good, He was smart, very very smart. And I think he's smart because he was smart, and he was smart because he had been through the up and down or deal with the monkeys, you know, being such a success and then him trying to make it. Let's be a real band.

We ball play into them, Let's be a real band, and everybody saying, no, you're ersatz Beatles. You all you are, that's all you'll ever be. And so he was very conflicted and he really wanted to be on his own, so he he when he and I met up, I think that he saw in me what I saw on him, and that here's the other half of this link that maybe we can do something. You know, here's here's a guy with And he wasn't that he was super rich. For the monkeys running.

That was again they were they were performers hired to do a job, and then later they wanted to become a band, and they did become a band. So it wasn't that he was flat out rich. Then he got rich later when his mom he inherited the liquid paper for she was his mom invented liquid paper. So we were just eager to try something. Where did the idea for Time Rider come from?

That came from me that I had an idea for a movie called The Bike, and the movie the Bike was a guy on a motorcycle rides into a time travel experiment and it's thrown back into the Old West with one tank of gas. Now Nesmith, I told him the idea. He liked it, and we ended up writing the screenplay together, of course, and him producing it. He said, and he knew more about this, and I didn't know there was a thing called the Baja Race, the Baja five hundred. He said, what if then they have a motorcycle race and a car offer a vehicle race?

He said, what if he's in that race and they went and so it developed that way, and I thought, what I liked about that is that because he was not just a motorcycle rider by Happenstance who wrote into a time travel experiment, because he's in a race, I could really control his costume and his look, knowing where he was going to go. So that's why we gave him a tire red uniform and a red bike. And so in the West, to me, the use of red in the West is mostly good for blood, you know, ella pecket paw and all that stuff. And so the only red in the movie is fred Ward, the motorcycle and the blood. That's the only red.

And that's a subtlety and uh, I don't spake anybody go wow, But it just was a visual sort of motif that we stuck to. But having him be a part of that allowed me to a normal guy just wouldn't be all in red clothing going up for a ride on his motorcycle. So it allowed me to enhance the character of blau Swan and it just it just grew from from there. I means, with had he always had this kind of bizarre look from the other side, take on thief, which is good. Like when they when Peter Coyote and them first confront that old coadure that they end up killing.

Usually it's like, give give me the gold you've got in them saddle bags, you know. And Michael says, what if it's silk, What if it's reams of silk? Oh, I never would have thought of something like that, because he said silk had a value back then, And so again he would open things up, you know. It gave us a little thing where Peter Cowdy could wave the sale can shoot through it and stuff. So it was a real good relationship as far as he would put out an idea and I might tweak it or I would be in evord it turned the direction of something we were doing, and vice versa, and we had a wonderful kind of creative compatibility.

Plus in like you see in the silly bits in the elephant parts, we never lost that love of the silliness. He had an expression back then, and I've always remembered it. You could make someone look silly in a movie, but you can't make them look stupid, you know, And so if an actor was sire, well, I wouldn't do that. It's really stupid. If he had a point, you really just to listen to that.

But if it was silly, we were going at times for sil The elphin parts is full of silly. But that was a good note, just a little side throwaway note. But Michael was always smart, always an artist, always smart. The thing I can't get over is the cast. The cast for Time Writer is just fantastic all the way down the.

Line, and I am so thrilled with That's why I first met Tracy Walter. I had seen him in other things a character actor. I put him in five five of my movies over the course of the years. And then Richard Major playing the two brothers Claude and Carl shot my nose off. It's just I love Tracy.

I'm just And fred Ward was introduced to us by I think Harry Gettis, our producer, and introduced us and to fred Ward because we wouldn't we weren't. We didn't know who we were thinking of, and fred Ward was perfect for it. It was just there was something about Freddy was such a good guy, such a really good guy, and Harry Gettis had produced that kind of I think it's a noteorious drug fueled Western the Nicholson had directed down in Durango, Mexico, Going South. Harry Gettis had produced that and and the character in Chinatown that Jack Nixon plays when he plays Gettis the detective. He named that character.

He had that character renamed that for his friend, Harry Harry Gettison. So Harry had a certain movie cachet about him and which helped us at least get entree to approaching cast members. But he also he wielded that sort of I know more than you do authority at times. And that was okay. I was I was getting to make another movie.

I was happiest I could be. And I had I had some guys on The Wild Budge and I had l Q Jones, and I was such a fan of the Wild Bunch. I went to see it on a sleek preview in Michigan. I think he was a motorcycle movie. Wow.

When I got there, I remember biting. I remember something was hurting after the first bankrubb receveing, and I realized I was biting my finger because I had never seen that kind of blood splattering all over the screen. Yeah. L KU Jones was always such a treat whenever he would show up in things. I loved his voice so much.

We had a million dollars to do that movie. I remember sitting there one day and in one of the scenes and he goes, now, Sam would have six cabras here. You know, I think I'm lucky I got one mane dam would do. This is what Sam would do it. I was bblad.

I was so happy to work with those guys, so happy to work with them. And Belinda, Belinda Bauer, she was We didn't know who she was. She was just introduced to us. And and like any movie, I look back on it now and go, oh, why didn't we Why didn't I? But we do that with any any movie.

I look back and why didn't I change the script here? Why didn't I do a certain thing? Here? This and that? This is?

That's an age scrivelet. But again, it was a great time. And like I said, Nesmus was smart and he was savvy, and he was a good producer. He knew how to manipulate the money. He had really been in the I'd been in the hands on set up to set, you know, hang the drapes, hook up the electric, you know, set the lights, you know, paint a set would and he had come out of deal with the producers, deal with you know, all the shit he had to deal with.

So we were great because we had two sides of a coin in the same coin we were that we were trying to mint, and those two totally different sides bonded by a creative kind of union between us. Where did you extra shoot it? We shot in Santa Fe, just outside Santa Fe, New Mexico, on what was called then J. W. Eve's Ranch.

And I have been back to Santa Fe since and I've tried to find J. W. E's Ranch, and I think they had a fire years later, so someone was burned down, and I know that. Driving to work, I had a driver and we drove past like a two million dollar western town set on our left, which was the town they built for the Lone Ranger, the one the kind of failed Lone Ranger back in the early eighties where they had trouble with their star and it was there was a production was I read something that someone was trying to defend the Star for being a bit of a jerk, and they said, part of his problem is that the boots they had made for him as a Lone Ranger costs more than he was making. However, that converts.

That's something I never forgot either. Okay, I could fuck with your head. Yeah, you didn't have a ton of money. You had a fantastic cast for this. What were some of the other challenges that you had to overcome trying to make a movie with this scope and size.

I was like wide eyed in a novice as to the racing side in the beginning that launches Laos Swan into the into the adventure. But once we were in there making it, it was what can we do? I remember we say it to Hilton and in Santa Fe, and I can remember that we were talking that we had too few talents people. We needed to somehow get more townspeople. And that was no problem because we get lots of people come out, I want to be in your movie.

You could really strike a deal with them. But then the wardrobe said, every time you do that, we don't have that budget for another costume in a period costume. And I always remember one day going to set and I think we had four more Mexican women in the town and a couple of more guys, and the guys were much easier because of a white shirt and all that. But these women had these big skirts, you know, and they were kind of tattered and everything. And I thought to myself, I asked that.

I said, so where'd you get over aw come? How where'd you get this all of a sudden? Because we talked about this two days ago, and now you got all these costumes. And he says, when you eat the dining room at the restaurant today, don't expect the tablecloth. That's filmmaking.

I love that even some of these smaller parts are played by people that would go on to be big actors or people that I reconize even today with Miguel Sandoval. Yes, that was his first role ever, first role ever. Ed latter was a bit of a season to Vetroan. I don't know. He got mad at me once and I don't even know about these kind of things.

I said. We were probably twenty thirty minutes from lunch. I mean, you had to turn around in the in the cab when he comes into the to the Claire's cabin and is starting to accuse fred Ward of whatever he's accusing him of, and I said, guess turn around, we'll get we'll get to get your close up. He said, I get the lunch shot. What does that mean?

He is, you're gonna rush it so you can go to lunch. I were learning things that I was streeting the lunch. I said, no, one do it that after lunch if you want. But but he was. He was a good guy to you.

You know, I didn't have any problems with any any actors on that. That was That was That was a joy. That was a joy. Here's something that I should show a shout out to a guy named Randy Nolan who shot the opening sequence in Time Writer. We rigged.

We welded a seat onto the front bumper of a four by four vehicle and we strapped him in with a steady cam and he just sat there holding on and that car was, you know, catching the air and racing through and uh, but he's still working. Today's a good man, Randy Nolan's. I was curious about the bikes, like, how many of them did you have? Did you have any mechanical problems with them? We had a moorcycle guy and nsmth had done some more cycle racing.

Again, there was another side of the coin that no I had done a moorcycle movie. But you didn't want to touch their Harley's or you would, you know, touch their Harley's, so he knew about that stuff. We had two bikes. We had a hero bike and a backup bike, and then we had a stunt bike, and then we had a throwaway bike, which we eventually dumped over the cliff. But that's that's what we had in the We really didn't have any breakdown problems.

When I think about that, that was pretty good. I seem to recall that there's a different ending that you can get depending on which DVD or if you watch it on TV. Can you talk a little bit about some of those. Yeah, it's not a different ending in the context of the story. And I didn't know about this.

I didn't do two endings. What it was is that we had when Peter Coyote gets killed by the rear blade on the helicopter when it comes around and it chops him up. We had a shot. And I always read of this shot because my fechts guy and my prop guy affects guy was really a good guy named Robbie not and but when he cut the boots as if they'd been cheered, they were cutting strips almost like like pasta, you know, and it was blood all over them. That's all you saw was Pierre Cawdy's boots.

And I think the different ending one has the boots, one doesn't have the boots, and I think that's the only difference in the endings. There's no difference in her holding up the medallion. I honestly, I didn't realize this when I was writing it, but I remember one review, you know, that was really kind of like you always get those, you know, you get good reviews and bad reviews, and I've learned it. Yeah, I don't give a shit, you know, I love good reviews, but in bad review I'm not gonna. I got to make the movie.

Screw you, you didn't. I don't care what you think about it. La Cisco Niebert hated Harry and Henderson's and they said what I would have done? I thought, fuck you. If you would have done it, then't do it.

Don't give me what I would have done. Anyway. I remember this review. The guy says their time right. He says, yeah, this guy finds a way to go back in time so he could screw his grandmother.

And I think I started to do the wath on that I go is that right? I mean someone else a review of Angels in the Outfield guys said, oh yeah, little kid, praise to God to help the Angels cheat to win the pennant. That's the story, Jesus, we ever thought of it. What are you some of your favorite memories for making that movie. Well, we told Belinda Bauer to get used to Claire is someone who's very used to handling a gun, and a gun like that, even though we gave it was a real gun.

Back then we did there was not a lot of duplicate guns, but they're heavy and for her to wield it around. So we told her that we gave her one to take back to her room. I don't think I had a firing pin in and everything. We take back to a room and use this gun and hold it and feel it and get used to it, so when we see her on camera it felt real. So we're having dinner one night and we're sitting there in a restaurant and someone says something, and the waiter comes over and says something, and she goes, well, puts a gun on the table, and the guy looked at us and we're like, remember Harry, get us quote She was carrying the gun around with her a little dicey after you hear things about like rust and everything.

But yeah, there was a there was. It was I'm trying to think of other other fun other funny stories. We didn't have a lot of. I mean, I've been on movies where you know, the cast was having a good time and there was a lot of you know, shit going on, funny stuff at night and stuff, but this one was kind of tame. Everybody was kind of on it.

Everybody knew we didn't l Q Tracy, Richard Major, all these people. They knew we didn't have a lot of money. But I think they saw that when we were there, as we shared the shoot. We only shopped for maybe four weeks for the whole movie, I imagine maybe six tops, and they saw that everybody was really trying to make a good movie as best we could make, and so they all put their best into it. This is a little coal tell us quick.

As off the subject, ritrud Mazer told me a story he had been in Heaven's Gate. The movie A Great Excess, which I loved, but it was even I thought it was too long, but I loved it. We would do a bullet hits and he said, oh my god. He said, how many times get shot? I said, I mean you get shot once here and he said, Heaven's Gate, I had eight hits on me.

You know, you get shot off a horse. He had eight bullet hits and he said, he said, then we do it. It's like an hour setup for the hits. Tremino wants to do it again. We do it again, another hour set up all the hits and everything.

He says to the to the the fects. Guy says, how many sets of these do you have? And the guy says eight. And they did eight takes and then the movie he gets shot twice on both off his horse. So until it's just the nature of movie business.

But that was a mitrud major story about Heaven's Gate. How was the movie received when it came out? Not so good? It was okay, it didn't break down any doors, but we didn't have much promotion. I know that Michael Nesmith went on.

I think it was David Letterman. I'm having to remember back in nineteen eighty two or three, who was a late night host. And I remember Jane Eyre are publisher, a great woman who's just a great publicist, had a lot of people. She was with Michael at that time in New York publicizing the movie, and she said Michael got off that show. She had never seen him that mad because David Letterman had a clip for the movie but didn't play it.

So all Mike was the one was sitting there blowing air about some bike movie and they never showed a clip or anything. And that would have been a great moment of national exposure for us. Yeah, so we didn't really the movie did not get itself out there, and there was no We didn't have any star that would draw fred Ward he got right stuff after that, he got that Elmo Williams after Time Writer. So fred Ward he had done a movie called Ufo, I think before Time Writer. So we didn't have a lot.

There wasn't a lot for them to publicize except I liked this is just personal That fed my ego at the time because of what who I idolized as filmmakers. But when the review they put on the back of the VHS box and the laser discs and stuff, it says take spiel Spielberg and Peck and Paw and put it on a bike. I was done. I was happy, and nobody ever saw any money that came down later. No, he's one of those, you know, it's one of those movies.

But we're all glad we made it, very glad I made it. You directed one of my favorite episodes of Amazing Stories, Mummy Daddy, And how did you get that gig? I got that gig, and that is what this led to Harry and Henderson's I got that gig because as a commercials director Alan Davio, who was Spielberg's guy at the time. Between movies were two commercials and I did a couple of do you remember Vincent Larry, the Krish Stummys who would tell you to buckle up? We did those.

I directed those for eleven years and they ran for fifteen years. When he was available, I'd have Dabyo shoot those, and we were later inducted into the Sithsonian for that series of spots. Well, it's the only spots I've ever done today. I didn't feel I was like selling sugar to kids or something. I felt I was really help them save lives.

It sounds a little corny, but it's true. So I met Allan, and Allan had heard about Amazing Stories and he said you should. You should get your name, get your agent to get your name in front of Stephen for these amazing stories. So I read up on what they were doing and everything, and I don't remember exactly how it happened, but my agent got them to consider me and send me a script. And what you had to do is you would get sent a script, then you'd go in and you'd meet with Steven Spielberg and tell him as a filmmaker what you were going to do with script.

So I was like, meet Steven Spielberg. So I read a script and it was good, and I thought it could be better, so I added the second mummy, so it was only one mummy, the guy in costume trying to get to his wife and labor in the hospital and bumping into a bunch of rednecks on the way. But I set the myth up of raw Aman Karr, the mummy that had escaped from a carnival years ago and rumored to be looking in the bogs. And I remember pitching this to Stephen and there's a big table in the conference room and amblem and I'm telling the story. I bring in the second mummy and I can see the just body shifts of people, and I bring in the whole thing and I get done, and I go to find the final scene with the cigar in the real Mummy's mouth, and said, let's get you out of this.

Let's get you out of this costume. They start trying to wrap the real mummy at the end of it, and Stephen's the end of the meeting. I said that that's my take on it, and Steven said, well, I didn't like it, and my heart just so and he said until you got to the end, he said. And then he says, when do we shoot? And I was like, shoot and I think it is with maybe June or something, and I said that one shoots August sixth.

I think that what happened is too far away. It will never happen. He just said when do we shoot? And this guy just said two months from now. But sure enough, we shot two months from now.

So then I'm in the editing room on Amazing Stories at Amblem and Stephen comes by one night. He said, show me what you got, and I says, it's pretty cruze. He said, show me what you got, okay, So I showed me, I guy, and we look at the episode and he says, this Gid's coming. It's good. He said, you got a movie you want to do, literally, he said, And I said, I do.

I have a movie called Harry and the Henderson's and I'm about five days away from finishing the screenplay. I really literally was, and I would love to show it to. You said, tell me what's about. I said, I'd really like to I'm so close to finishing. I'd really like you to read it.

He said, tell me what it's about. The whole story of Harry Hendon pours out of my mouth, and he says, coming into my office tomorrow, he said, we might be able to make this movie. I know some people, that's exact quote. These are the lines I never forgotten all my life. And that's that's literally how how Harry.

That's that's how I got amazing stories, and how amazing stories led to Harry and Henderson's. I know some people. What an understatement from Steven Spielberg. That's so funny. Yes, the special effects in that movie are still just killer.

The mass, the everything that, all the articulation, it just is so good. And all these years later, it still looks like a billion dollars. Yeah, that was Rick Baker. Yeah, his second Oscar. No, he was.

I remember knocking on his door. I had forty pages of Harry. I had a little sculpture I made of Harry and had a growling face on side and a smiling face on the ear. I got all the hand over to be happy or be angry because he had done that grilling movie. I said, you're the guy to do my bakfoot movie, and he said, you can never afford me.

I'd a kid with forty pages in a plaster sculpture. When I got Stephen to do the movie, well, I got Stephen to do the to okay the movie and say we're gonna do it. I told him I wanted Rick Baker. And they had had some I don't know the details of it, but they had had some movie I don't know, but they had they they had a conflict and I thought, oh, I'm not gonna be able to get Rick Baker. Whatever it was.

They they shook hands and worked it out and we got Rick Baker, and that it had to be Rick. It just it had to be reckoned. I remember one thing that during Harry, when Harry was getting more and more complete and Kevin Peter Hall, who played Harry. He was seven foot two to begin with, and we could really get the height of Harry up there. Rick Baker said, I developed these amazing mechanical eyes, and I think are going to be really good.

I said, I were not even looking at him. Reck I said, I can't have mechanical eyes. I said. The suit has to be designed so that I have his realize. I have to have Kevin's realize because I don't want some ride of Disneyland where the bears are rolling their eyes at you.

It has to be real. And Rick, of course he went along with that and agreed with it. And it was really that's to me was what all the magic that Rick did with the servos in the face to create expressions. You go back to those two holes in the suit where that actor's eyes can come through. To me, that's what gave Harry the life.

In the studio they wanted me and this wasn't Spielberger anything. This was like the higher ups in the studio. They're wondering why I wasn't using Danny de Veat instead of John Liftko, the Bayfoot and the little guy. And because I said, this is about the humanity lithgo six' Four kevin As harry is about eight. FOOT i want eye to.

EYE i WANT i Want john to face this, creature AND i want the creature to face a man who is, not you know. NOT i don't want it to be a one note comedy Gag harry and the and The Little. Guy and there's, no, no no disparity Of Danny. DeBrito he's a, fine fine actor. Everything BUT i really fought For John, lithgow And steven supported me in that fight For.

John he is so the heart of the film and just that relationship between him and his. Family it's so crucial and and so well. Played and it's a it's an anti, gun pro animal, movie you, know as old as as it. Is that's the. THEMES i am curious what you're up to these.

Days this is a, strange a strange time for for people my age in in the directing. Business unless you are a real hit maker and you've got some hundred million dollar hits under your. Belt they're looking for the new. Guy they're looking for the new. Deal it's like they're looking for new.

Technology everybody is afraid right, now a very high because of what it's going to. Do AND i think the fact is it's it's like a fancy ass new. Camera you got to embrace it or you're gonna fall behind. You you can't Say i'm not gonna use that. Bullshit it's gonna it'll find you go.

Away we're gonna USE ai because studios are going to go. There it's going to take movie costs. Down everything's changing and not for the. Good right, Now i'm trying to re engineer a movie that we a friend of, Mine, robert who also was way back and he's the guy who had the eight milimeter camera WHEN i first moved To. Michigan he wrote a movie Called Red.

Eye he AND i and his partner Text, ragsdale and and it's about a very young, woman a college, student wins an award for a book she wrote on how vampires can exist among people in. Society and she's flying To paris to win an award and she has to take The Red eye and there's vampires on the plane because they don't like how her book is. Exposed then that's the whole gist of the. Story it's Called Red. Eye so we're actually, thinking, now how do we maybe because we've been trying to Sell Red eye since nineteen ninety one he made a movie Called Red, eye which was not about our, Movie and so now we're actually thinking about trying to make it as AN ai movie because it's going to.

Happen someone's going to make AN ai. Movie but instead of relying ON, ai the WAY ii exists right. Now we have a theory that if we feed THE ai only our, information then WHAT ai can pull on is we feed them who our actor, is scans or whatever it would. Take we feed them what our airplanes. Said is we feed all, That so THE ai has to draw.

On AND i may be being totally naive in the tech world of, this but this is. How this is what we're trying to do on one project right. Now i've GOT i did one horror. MOVIE i don't want to do another horror. Movie it was just too.

Gruesome i'm more of A i like to make people laugh rather than make a. Scream did a movie A Chrispin. Glover it was fun work on The Chrispin. GLOVER i don't if you ever saw, it Called simon, says but it's my son directed all the kills and they're just outrageous. Kills but, again there was too many body parts and blood for me to go to work every day and do.

That And i'm writing A western a SERIES i don't know if we'll ever get if it'll ever get. Done And i've just thought of a new idea for a feature Which i've been making notes. On But i'm not talking titles or anything, now BECAUSE i JUST i have such limited access to the business being as old AS i. Am and WHEN i work on a lot of kids movies and sometimes the kids, say Mister, deer how old are? You AND i, said, WELL i was born in the first half of the previous.

Century and they, think, well the fight for the north or The, south it's a. Struggle LIKE i, Said i've fallen back into my, painting WHICH i really really am having a good time. With And i'm you, know And i'm. Writing i'm trying to do. Stuff we do little kibbitzes.

Ourselves there's a we were writing a script my writer, friends my son AND i Call Getting Dad laid and there's about a guy who has lost his, wife his. Kids this you, Know dad is never getting out of, this paulk unless we get them, laid you. Know so that's the whole gist of the movie And i'm writing that and all over my son and this Guy mark when the writers came over AND i, said waterboard, shots waterboard, shots and it was waterboarding was in the, news and jello shots were in the, news and they, thought what a peculiar. Thing and then we thought we could do something with. That so we actually wrote like a two, minute three minute, skit built a.

Set i'm looking at the set right. Here it's like just a desk out of a. Bookcase we turned it into a. Bar we shot waterboard, shots and the next morning we shot two, reverses and then we were back writing our screenplay And i'll send you a link to what we got out of. That but that was just came up overnight and we filmed.

It but these guys ARE i wrote a lot of screenplays with these, guys and they're just wonderful comedic. Writers they ACTUALLY i was living In Studio city and my assistant On harry and commercials and, Stuff Julie. Larson she, said her husband's in a comedy group called The Riot, act and they really want to work with me and meet with. Me AND i was Doing, harry and you know the old expression what have we got to? Do camp out in your driveway you get a.

Meeting, well one MORNING i looked out my window and a guy sleeping against my. Garage AND i lived up in the hills a, bit AND i, thought this is a strange trek for a homeless. Person AND i look over and there's a campfire in my driveway and a. Tent they had camped out in my driveway to get a. Meeting we became solid.

Friends, ever so in a note On Julie, larson my, assistant she kept, saying you have got to meet my. Brother he's In New. York he's writing plays and musicals and. Stuff AND i went our separate ways after, that AND i think she Became David fincher's. Assistant but, anyway her brother Was Jonathan, larson who Wrote.

Rent so that was nice. Everybody and the comedy, group The Riot. ACT i use those guys and everything for. YEARS i put them in all my movies and we did all kinds of comedy. Stuff mister, dear thank you so much for your.

Time this has been so great talking with. You, okay thank, you mite. LOVE i. All, right we are back and we were talking about time WRITER i mentioned Before Ed. LAUDER i always enjoy seeing him show up in, things AND i just really like What deer brings to this as far as knowing how to cast these faces and especially knowing which faces look better in The Old west than in the nineteen eighty two part of.

This Western wise L. Q jones and he's A stackhle From Pecking plant, movies and he's got that kind of gravitass like he feels like it's time traveled for to coming to to make the move because he's got kind of old stem desert, sound sun blown face in a, way and the gruff voice and the gravity The shannoff. Well AND i Love Chris. MAULKY i always have enjoyed. HIM i MEAN i really got to know him more when it came To Twin peaks and being one of The renault BROTHERS i, believe Or Josie packard's.

Husband, YEAH i think he was A renault. Brother and then you, know he would just show up in rolls throughout the entire run of the, Eighties LIKE i think he's the first person that we see infected by the space alien In The Hidden and, YEAH i just really appreciate when he shows up and stuff AND i like how, yeah like you, said L Q jones and him do feel like they're from a different, era but especially L Q jones AND i love that whole thing Of deer talking on the commentary about How Elku jones would always be, like, well you, know it Takes Sam pick And paul three days to shoot something like this and just kind of like trying to direct from the sides and. Stuff it's, like, OKAY, lq you have settled, down like we don't really have three days to shoot.

This that was a different, era different, budget. And a different levels of drinking and. Imbibing because it feels the ultra low budget as, WELL i don't kind of budget that we're working, with but it feels like a couple of friends went in the desert and made A Western land is basically. Free it doesn't feel and even the special effects as. Well THAT i, mean the whole time travel part of it just feels like somebody's kind of just got stuff, together or you've got, that but a, Machine i'll do.

It you can do, that and it's a time machine bay and A Warder corman type production volues the control. ROOM i know this might be obscure reference but the control room, sequences it feels Like nuki the kind Of african cheap o et ripoff in a way we don't see. Much so that and also too when it comes to low. Budget if you're right at the, start they had the sequence with the black and the, audio and that's a very clear indication that they've no got the big budget to film the press launch different. Extras so there's a kind of like it feels like kind Of nickel And damon as you see over.

There, YEAH i get, that BUT i also AND i don't think you're going to disagree with. ME i also think that's a super smart thing to do to just have the credits rolling over black and you hear the, oh we're going to tell you about this time travel project that we're, doing like such a smart way of introducing. It, yeah, Definitely AND i obviously a smart economic that comes to storytelling because you get the grasp of what's happening through the audio and new. Audios it gets right tone and it's, like, oh you understand it's the press launch blah blah, blah and then you straight into swallow his. Bike, yeah punches you in the face with THAT pov shot of the bike going through the, desert which is so, cool and they use the the natural wonders so, well like when the bad guys are Pursuing swan and he's going through those caverns and, Stuff and just to again Hear deer talk, about you, know how they would have these spires with you, know rock sitting up on top of these and just like how important it is to find good.

Locations and, yeah they do a really smart job of letting you, know nature be the star of. This especially at the end when they're up on top of that peak and they're definitely up in the. Peak it definitely feels. High you can film with the, height and they're probably free as, well so you're getting gorgeous locations like that for less and. Cheap so, definitely and again i'd love to Hear deer talk about how, like WELL i should have been using a moving camera BECAUSE i can't really get the scale of this, place and how it keeps talking about the.

Horizon he's just, like whenever you can use the, horizon you do. That it's such a cheap special, Effect and so reminded me of that part of The spielberg movie where it's the Young spielberg talking With John. Ford now remember, This when there horizons at the, bottom it's. Interesting when the horizons at the, top it's. Interesting when there horizons and the, middle it's boring as.

Shit, now good luck to, you and get the fuck out of my. Office some MOVIE i have to. See, obviously The feeblman's seen a. Lot oh, yeah that scene is like the thing that sticks out the most for you with that. Film but it's probably because of Lyn.

Yeah lynch, god so. Yeah and they do smart things like you, know some hidden ramps and things in here to Let swan or the i should, say the stunt rider who is Playing swan uh do a lot of. This it's funny because we just talked about The mandalorian And grogu and how you've got you, know two guys that play the suit, actors so here having you, Know ward in certain. Scenes but it's probably the the stunt rider for what ninety percent of this, movie which is a really smart thing to. Do.

Nice some of the jumps in me is like whoa that spies has not got broken? Bones the way that that distances and hates he. Jumps oh, Yeah dede tells that story about how they were going to pull the stunt guy off with a, wire and they dug this trench and stuff to you, know make it easier for him to fall into. That and you, know once he fell off with the bike or they pulled him off the, bike and they're, like so we did all this work and then we pulled him off and he missed the mark and so he didn't even get to use the soft padding that they had put. Down but it doesn't sound like anybody you, know got seriously injured on this, one.

HOPEFULLY i like the kind of the cool visor with bikes is the vit he, had and it was like it's very Air wolf and far. Enough the lead woman she was in with Air wolf find she get killed off the start. Out it did take me a little while to realize IF i had the what they call the bloody boots cut or. Not apparently there are a couple versions of this. Film one has the shot Of Peter coyote's boots at the end where it looks like the helicopter has basically like torn him.

Asunder don't really get. Much it's just kind, of you, know a little implied kind of, thing and there's there's not a whole lot of violence when it comes to. This, yeah a sound effects and of shorty but kind of kind of look Like moccasin's the way they can have been. Shredded it's kind of. Weird BUT i fail off the sound effects OBVIOUSLY i said.

Before but it's a bit of Where king of the. End it's a bit kind of rushed and how WE i find. Too it's, like, OH i getting up to the top and then oh you are your, grandfather and then the whole thing with the Pia coty being. Killed it just seemed a bit kind of. Over we kind of get to the.

Point, yeah they don't linger for this. One there's no like welcome back to nineteen eighty, two Mister swan type of. THING i appreciate that. TOO i mean just in and Night we're. Ending sometimes you just want in a night them we look at Kry, kid look at all over kind of movies that just ended the point where the film naturally.

Ends, yeah it's so. NICE i mean ninety three. MINUTES i MEAN i miss movies that were about ninety minutes. LONG i saw a film recently and it was seventy nine. MINUTES i was, like my, god for a horror film that's only seventy nine.

Minutes it was hard to believe it was The Devil's. CANDY i watched you something AND i just it just came and, wins and it's pretty easy to digest in terms of. Movie it's Because warner films these days are usually overcut or over. Long oh one hundred. Percent, YEAH i mean even just good to go back to The mandalorian and GROGU i was, like really over two?

Hours like you did the Whole First Star wars in two, hours like that set up everything in this entire, galaxy and now it's going to take over two hours to do. This come, on, Guys DEFINITELY i should go back to the kind of nice minutes that it seems like a perfect lens tell your story In. Out No, worries otherwise turned into a television. SHOW i don't. Care, hey it was, It Jack.

Warner Jack warner said that if you had to pee more than, twice or the peach and the filmer was it one And clytie was watching, them this is you have to. Go it's a bad. Movie i'm Probably caughte not, wrong but Here i'm. Not in that documentary about one, inclade. And that's WHY i recommend that everyone used the run p.

App this whole episode has just been a commercial for. That you mentioned the control room, sequence so you mentioned what that reminds you of. It it reminds me of neither of The comet and when they've got the the doctors who are living in that underground bunker kind of thing or the bunker area where they're they're safe because they were in the lead lined. AREA i think it was What, Jeffrey Jeff lewis And Mary warnov are in that. Sequence just something about, that plus like THE i guess the, cheapness like you were, saying like the budget, definitely you, know do you see that they are trying to get every dime worth of their production value?

Here, yeah and it's also closely short as. Well it's just like extreams people's heads the, side blah blah, blah and it's just very. Economical there was no scote or. SIZE i mean the scoping and size was the locations that use for the western sequences and When libels on his bike bastar production design. And using the the main, scientist the bald guy who JUST i Know i've seen him a thousand times and other.

Things he just plays like that officious scientist so. Well and am. Also to think about the. Scientist the monkey's got a weird name at the end. Credits the monkey's called est on the, film but actually got.

WEIRD i give him monkey. Almost sounds like the species you look. For, YOURSELF i. Am and then that's the weird our credits to at the end war it's like more than. PROPS i think it's just them having a wee.

JOKE i, Mean Mike naysmith had the kind of weird things of humor when it comes to you will obviously elephant and interested being as a. Monkey it was kind of an offbeat. Person it definitely feels like a, monk like a like A Mike naysmith. Touch and you mentioned the idea too of the low budget when it came to the special. EFFECTS i mean that just seems right out of you, know LIKE i think he was a fan of that because the special EFFECTS i remember In repoman were not very.

SPECIAL i mean they worked really. WELL i love the whole thing when they would open up the trunk and turn green and you, know like see the skeleton and all that. STUFF i mean that seems right in line with the way that the time travel is just like lights going, off. If you'd be short all and just do it for lights and spat and. Sounds all, Right we're going to take one more break and play a preview for next week's.

Show right after these brief, messages a woman searching for her. Husband he's supposed to. Be my wife finds him searching for. Himself what is happening? Here who are the?

City everyone in their experiments and make some match our memories as they see. Fit, no they must uncover a terrifying MYSTERY. I don't even ever happen of who. They once, were and SO i just wants to think it from the director of The Crown Dark city. Righted our Starts.

Friday that's, Right we'll be back next week with a look At Dark. City until, THEN i want to thank my co Host Aaron So, aaron what is the latest with? You? Sir? Right for.

Myself for a while, now for the, website The Film Collective, Scotland i've been doing something very interesting interviews Covering british independent horror movies and getting to interview guys That Nicholas farrell From tries To fire And Harry. Komel he's an interesting, person And Alex cox as. Well Alex cox was an interesting. Guy So i'm slowly kind of growing like kind of social media. Presence the last after, THAT i was lasting The booth twenty, SEVENTEEN i think it was talking about the Get.

AWAY i Interviewed Michael madson and actually got the interview BECAUSE i interviewed With. Michael BECAUSE i Interviewed, michael Interviewed Roger donaldson and and he, Said, Michael roger gave him my turns your, turn so he was a lovely. Man got read his soul To Michael, madsen AND i also WROTE i contribute essays to A bocome Team cigal putting his favorite friend Back, Atose Exit wounds And Pistol whipped BECAUSE i Had Paul caldern And Lanton. Nixon so but the one of the most interesting The Exit wins was Decent cigal. Movie but, No i'm just keeping busy with different writing and different interviews AND i love.

It i'm growing the page And i've got other projects on the. Go it could be working a short film during the. Summer so, Yeah i'm keeping. Busy where can people find all your. Writing it's on The funk colect Of.

SCOTLAND i have a social media presence On, Facebook twitter or X. Instagram instagram is probably the best, place almost on TikTok as. Well so just typing the phone create the skull and then that's WHERE i. Am. Well thanks so Much aaron for being on the.

Show thanks to everybody for. Listening if you want to hear more of me shooting off my, mouth check out some of the other shows THAT i work. On they are all available at weirdingmaymedia dot. Com thanks especially to Our patreon. Community if you want to join the, community visit patreon dot com Slash Projection.

Booth every donation we get helps The Projection booth take over the. World it sounds, FUNNY i, know. But it really. So oh, MoU i'm mown. Grandpa i'm my own.

Grandpa it sounds, FUNNY i, know but it really is so. Oh, now many many years, ago WHEN i was twenty, THREE i was married To Ole, witter who was pretty as could. Be This witter had a grown up daughter who had her of. Read my father fell in love with her and some they who were With this made my dad my son in law and changed my very. Life my daughter was my mother cause she was my father's.

Wife to comfort me the, matter even though it brought me, JOY i soon became the father of a bouncing baby. Boy my little baby then became a brother in law To, dad and so became my. Uncle though it made me very, sad for if he was my, uncle then that also made him brother of the wider's grown up, daughter who of course was my. Stepmother i'm my Own. Grandpaul i'm my Own.

Grandpaul it sounds, FUNNY i, Know, oh but it really is so, Oh i'm my own. Grandpa my father's wife and had a son who kept him on the, run and he became my, grandchild for he was my daughter's. Son and my wife is now my mother's. Mother and it makes me blue because although she is my, wife she's my grandmother. Too i'm my own.

Grandpa i'm my own. Grandpa it sounds, FUNNY i, know but it really is So, Oh i'm my own. Grandpa. Now if my wife is my, grandmother Then i'm her. Grandchild and every TIME i think of, it it nearly drives me.

Wild for NOW i have become the strangest case you ever. Saw as, husband my. GRANDMOTHER i am my own. Grandpa i'm my own. Grandpa i'm my own.

Grandpa it sounds, FUNNY i, know but it really. Is o, Ohh i'm my own, Brand paul