The Videodrome is the Message

Hi, I'm Mick Garrison. You're listening to Movie Meltdown. The following feature has been rated R by the Motion Picture Association of America. It is intended for mature audiences and parental discretion is advised. It's showtime, folks.

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What's up and welcome to Movie Meltdown. I am Brian and joining me via the magic of the internet is... Oh Sam, you crazy bastard. You have returned once again. for some sick reason, you come back. Man, hell of it.

I can't help it. I'm addicted to like geeking out about things that nobody knows about anymore. Nobody cares about anymore. Nobody cares about this stuff. Except we do because this one happened last like Before last time, we were already talking about stuff, and I brought up the movie I had recently watched, and you were like, ooh, I want to talk about that.

And as I'm watching it, going, ooh, I want to talk to you about this. So I'm watching it, already planning the episode. I'm like, oh, we need to talk about this. And then you got excited, and so yeah. Even before Beetlejuice happened, we were already like, oh, we need to talk about today's movie.

100%. 100%. Because nobody's talked about it in 40 years. So.... Now, as usual, we probably, because we're going for a specific movie, we shouldn't get sidetracked on an opening topic or we'll never get.

To the movie. Yeah, no, no, no, no. But I thought if we wanted to ease our way in with something slightly related, I think both of us, as we sort of discussed a long time ago when we started talking about this, we both, I think, have the same super deluxe version of it. We certainly do. I've got it in my hand right now.

Yeah. On that super deluxe version is an interview with directors that I thought maybe would be an interesting way to break into ease our way into the discussion of these type of movies. Absolutely. So absolutely. So on, on this super fancy disc version that I guess we're not promoting cause they, they're not backing us.

So screw them. But if you go find yourself a special edition of it with lots of extra stuff and commentaries, you're, you're probably holding the same one. That's it. But, On the special version, there is an interview that takes place. It's in 1982 by a young, scrapping Mick Garris.

Friend of the show, Mick Garris. That guy's super awesome. And he's sitting down in 1982 to talk to John Landis, John Carpenter, and David Cronenberg about horror films. It's almost looking at the evolution of... merry chart of man looking at that looking at that panel because. You do have well it's like it's like every version it's like horrible human being mystery and weird dude.

And then just like overthinking smart guys. And they all are trying to do the same thing, but they're doing it from three different directions of like, I'm going to make a silly comedy and also do gross things. And then he's like, I can't believe middle chair is not smoking the whole time. He's like containing himself as best he can. And just trying to be like, yeah, this is how you make horror movies.

And then you've got the far chair that's just like spouting out the most cerebral, elevated, super intelligent thoughts, but also being kind of creepy as he does. So like it's three chairs of like approaching horror from the most drastically different areas. And yet they all have come together and put good things together. Two of them are awesome directors. One of them is a horrible human being.

Yeah. So what was your take on it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Okay. So yeah, you've got, okay. So, so what I love, okay. What I love about this interview is yes, you've got three, like it would be, that would be just the greatest sitcom, you know, of those three guys, like, like. Living together, renting a house, Santa Monica, you know, uh, uh.

I see the opening, the opening credits with John Landis on roller skates out on the beach. falling down as he's looking at other girls, you know, exactly. And then you, you just see him roll past John Carpenter with standing outside with a cigarette, just shakes his head. Is that idiot rolls by and, and then Cronenberg like rolls up in an electric car or something, you know. I don't know. I don't know.

I mean, Cronenberg is like a lizard person. I mean, it's just, uh, you know, uh, him on that side, I've, I've just go like, uh, for him to make such fun. I mean, for me, his movies are fun. I love his movies. And, uh, and, but he's like just the most humorless person, uh, that, and, and, you know, for him just to like, you know, it's just like, he's some, he's got like, it's like some guys just like, he's just got this, uh, he, he sees the deep meaning in like looking at somebody's chewed up food, you know, he's just like, he's just like, I.

Mean, he is watching that, that, that, conversation with him and then listening to the commentary like he is like the smartest freaking person out there but at the same time he is like he's barely seems human yeah as you said he is very. It's like a replicant or something. It's yes well it's almost or just alien like he's looking at humans yes in quotes like these humans i found and i'm trying to study them and figure out how they work. And like, he's almost looking at it from a distance and be like, because I'm not one of you, I have to try to study you and figure out what, how, what, what makes you work as people and as a society. And like, what are all these weird pieces and how do they fit together?

And like, that's how he seems to be approaching like people and also making film. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think the humor and his movies don't come out in his personality when he's talking. And I don't know if it's, Like he's just such an intellectual or, or what it is.

I mean, Carpenter said in one interview once that he goes like, compared to Cronenberg, we're all just bums. I mean, he's just like operating on such a different level, you know, that like Carpenter felt like, like, uh, you know, my stuff just isn't as good as Cronenberg's and it could never be, you know? And, uh, and so, so what I. Love, I argue it's just a different style. He has his masterpieces there.

Don't get me wrong. He has a few misfires, but no, no, no. At his finest, he's equally as par with, with Cronenberg. No, no. I mean, I, I prefer Carpenter movies, you know, on a whole, but it's, uh, but, uh, cause I'm not an intellectual, but.

Uh, No, not quite. Landis, I have always felt weird that he has been given this master of horror type thing because basically he made one movie. Yeah, he made one that people care about. Right. And everything else he's made is either a comedy or crap.

Right. Pretty much. Pretty much. I mean, he had those early 80s, late 70s, early 80s golden period that those guys had. you know, uh, uh, you know, uh, car, uh, Landis kind of fizzled out, you know, of steam about the same time Carpenter did. I mean, about the same time he murdered.

Aside from that, Carpenter actually went and got, I would say up until mouth of madness is pretty strong stuff, you know, with, uh. He was still trying like even as he did some of those weirder wins towards the end there it's like he was he's still putting an effort it's just like i feel like he's getting further and further away from what people were looking for well like somehow like he accidentally found it with like halloween you know it's like he he hit it with the thing and like even like your big trouble little china like he found a more populist version of how to do what he does But the further he went along, the more it's like, he's still trying to do that same thing, but it's just not finding the audience.

Like they just don't mesh anymore. I don't know exactly what happened from either end, but. I mean, people are filmmakers of their time and sometimes, you know, public taste change and, you know, and the interest change and the way films are made or changed and, and the collaborators they have around them change. And so, you know, I really feel, you know, Like with, like, like all these directors, when they had their core group. group of people that they made their first three or four movies with, even Landis, with his producing set and, like, the Elmer Bernstein music and, you know, the font, you know, right down to it, there was a certain. That's what's important.

That's it. There's a certain quality that came out when they had the same DP and the same producer and the same. Little group around them. They kind of made movies that kind of had a good similar tone. And then when they changed.

All their collaborators... yeah the movies feel different you know they just do and uh and and i really like those early landis films i mean i think blues brothers has just like a such a feel to it that you know blues brothers 2 you know has. A completely not quite like so what happened you know i mean landis you know uh I think just land has disappeared up his own asshole because he's just. Like, was so like, Oh yeah. Beard as like a comedy genius. And, uh, I, I mean, when meanwhile he's working with genius, like you're capturing lightning in a bottle, like you're at the peak time of like somebody like, uh, well, I mean, I've come to appreciate Ackroyd, but like what Belushi is doing is just raw energy.

Like it is, it is something that is insane and can't be contained, but you can film it. And like, if, if you piece together the right movie around what he does, yeah, you look great, but really he's just there doing what he does. And like, it makes it work. And then later, for some reason you can't work with him anymore. And then you're working with other people and like, it just doesn't come together.

Like even if you're working with talented people, it was that time and that place. And he just happened to be filming the right couple of things that make a couple of good comedies come together. But like, yeah, I don't know that he was doing anything behind the scenes that was any more impressive. Like you don't look at it and go, Oh, look at the visuals on this movie. Like, he just set up a camera and like had the right connections to make these things come together.

I mean, I think blues brothers is a pretty stylish movie and everything. It doesn't seem like hack work around it, but I mean, he had like the resources because of those two being in it and of the time and place it was in, you know, and, uh, it, they were, he was really able to, they were able to like have the push and, you know, kind of lightning in a bottle. Right. But no, as a good point, uh, That, you know, his work, like, Coming to America maybe was the last decent John Landis movie, you know? But again, you're, like, at the peak of, like, one of the most, at the time, people considered the most talented comedian in the world, you know?

It's true. People loved him as a stand-up, and, like, he translated really well when he switched to, you know, from SNL to making movies. Like, he immediately became huge. He became one of the biggest... highest highest paid actors in the world like almost immediately as he started making films and like so again like all you have to do is point the camera like this is kind of true like that one you've got him playing half of the cast like him and Arsenio are half of the cast like you're it's it's their show you're just there to kind of keep them in frame and keep it rolling. And, you know, I don't want to totally belittle the role of the director, but again, I don't feel bad belittling him.

Cause well, it does not seem like a good person. Yes. If it, right. It's interesting. Yeah.

He seems kind of like a conceited jerk. And, uh, and if you watch that Vic Morrow, uh, uh, uh, uh, speech he did at the funeral, uh, the twilight zone funeral, uh, Yeah, definitely. That was definitely disturbing. And did you see that? Well, that's the part I didn't know about.

Like I just recently in the last year, that's why I think I'm putting a little extra fuel on the fire for this guy. Cause I didn't, I only knew kind of bits and pieces of the story I'd seen. It's disturbing that there's multiple versions of the footage of it happening. Not just one shot. He was rolling so many cameras.

You can get different angles, which is disturbing. Yeah. But that aside, I didn't realize, like, on top of him just telling them to do this when they should not have been doing it, period, he then had the audacity to show up at these children's funerals and be the speaker for them. Like, I don't think he was asked. I think he showed up and was like, well, obviously you want me to conduct this funeral for you.

I'm like, dude, you're the reason they're dead. Like, you don't get to come here and act like you're a big shot. Like. yeah man that was the part i was like i did not realize like it's bad enough if he goes to vic morrow's funeral but these kids had nothing like they weren't even supposed to be there like they legally shouldn't have been working at that point and he got them killed so it's like you don't get to show up at their funeral dude like no no like that is uh i don't know i i had no respect for him i don't think but i lost yeah he just fell so many levels down as like below being a human being at that point Yeah. It's, it's weird. It's weird.

Yeah. I mean, his stuff at Vic Morrow saying like, Vic Morrow will live forever due to him being in films, you know, and making a. He would still be alive now if it wasn't for you. Yeah. Right.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was really, it was really like, uh, you know, I feel like he got, you know, uh, he probably already had trading places and, uh, the pipeline, uh, but I don't really know if he ever really quite recovered from that career. Good. I mean, he got Coming to America out of the gate and everything, which was a huge hit, but I know one of his movies got released by Troma.

I mean, it was. If. You want to see what a great director he is, go watch Beverly Hills Cop 3. Yeah, dude, dude, which was. That's him at his finest right there.

Yeah, there was a lot of... That was back when I was working at a movie theater. I was going like, man, the early 90s is really just seeing all these great directors just shit the bed. Cranking out shit. Even Carpenter came out, which was a finely entertaining, but not his best work, like Village of the Damned and stuff.

I'm going like. God, man, why am I working. That's the one I was thinking of earlier when I was like, he's still doing it and he's still trying to do it his way. It's just not clicking. Like, people are watching it going, wait, what is this?

Why are we making a remake of Village of the Damned? Did anybody ask for this? I don't think so. So, yeah, it's like that and Ghost of Mars. He's just.

He's trying, but. Yeah, it's just like. But see, what's so funny, going back to that interview, I mean. He seems pretty bitter then, you know? Well, he just seems out of sorts.

It's like you see these other two that are so composed and seem like they're already kind of artists, you know? It's like, not to be pretentious about it, but even Carpenter, who doesn't take himself that seriously, is still sitting there like a calm professional that can talk about his work. Right. where Landis is like a spaz who's like coked up. Cause he's probably coked up and he's just like, Hey, and he's like asking more questions than Mick Garris who's hosting the show. So it's like, he's just like, well, so, and like challenging them, like, cause Garrett, Mick Garris is talking about like, you know, movies that scared you and like, John Carpenter's maybe being a little too cool for himself, but he's just like, ah, movies don't scare me.

And Landis all of a sudden spazzes out and like, never, like you've never been scared. And like, who fucking asked you, dude, first off. But then like, he's like, well, you know, as a kid, sure. And like, he very calmly responds to his spazzy questioning, but I'm just, it's so obnoxious the way that he conducts himself. Whereas the other two are so reserved and like professional about the way they're sitting there.

Can you, conducting themselves and talking about film. Whereas he's just seems like he's out of his mind already. He seems he's kind of like the Ashton Kushner of directors. Kind of. Oh, poor, poor.

I don't want to make that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sorry. Sorry.

No offense to Ashton Kushner. He can. Yeah. He conducts himself a little better these days. Well, yeah.

That video he released aside. But as a person, he seems to be a little more calm and reserved these days. Yeah, yeah. I mean, if nothing else, Landis brought us his kid, Max Landis. Max Landis did write.

One good movie. I liked American Ultra with Eisenberg and Stewart. I thought that was a fun movie. You know. Yeah, I.

It's, I'm still so hit and miss on Stewart as a person. Like, I see, and I'm trying not to be, like, everybody got so, oh, Twilight, and they wanted to, and I'm like, but I've not done that with Pattinson. Like, I watch him and stuff, and I'm like, dude's a good actor. Like, I'm not gonna knock him, because he made, he made a payday, you know? He's like, he got paid for, like, five movies.

Good for him. But, like, you watch him in other stuff. and i'm like he's actually a good actor but like with her i like it's like she needs just the perfect director to steer her away from the stuff she always does like i feel like even whatever that weird underwater movie was it was like it's she's pretty good in that, but I still feel like she leans on the things that she always does. And it's kind of distracting. The personal shopper is like my only go-to of like, that's a good movie in spite of her, like regardless of whether you like her or not, if you haven't seen that, like it's so not what you expect. It's almost weird art house type of stuff, but like, it's such a well-made movie that like, regardless of who's in the lead role, it's impressive.

And that's about the only go-to I have for her. Like everything else I've seen in her, I'm like, she just distracts me. I get you. I get you. What's funny is I don't really know.

You know, it must strike a nerve with you. What maybe I'm not impressed with her about is just I don't really know any defining thing of Kristen Stewart, you know? I think that's part of it. I think she doesn't... I mean, even in Twilight, I'm watching what little I watched.

I definitely watched the first one. I can't remember if I got through any of the others. But even then, I'm just like, what? Why? Why are these two dudes fighting over you?

You're the most boring woman in the world. This kid. brings nothing to the table. She's like, eh, she's attractive ish. But I'm like, other than that, like she just seems like a dorky girl. Why are we, why are we all watching her?

Why are these two dudes fighting over? And then when I watched her in other movies, I was like, she just seems like kind of barely showing up to make the movie. Like even, even like American ultra where she's got to be the action star of the team. Like, eh, like she seems kind of, half phoning it in some of the time. I don't know.

Like, I'm not trying to just bad mouth her, but like, I don't know. I just never really get like, she's putting in an effort on most of the things she's doing. Even when it physically seems like it's a movie that requires that of her. Sometimes, I'm just, I don't know. Something about her style.

Interesting. Interesting. Yeah, yeah. I get it. I get it.

Now, I hear that Love Lies Bleeding movie is really good, actually. So, maybe I'll check that out. Haven't seen it. Yeah, I feel like it's one of those. There's a bunch of hers I still haven't gotten to because I know I'm crazy. it's it's an uphill.

Battle i'm like not a ultra fan yeah i got it oh new kristen stewart movies joy right right um yeah yeah well we're done so uh yeah but i find carpenter of just being he's like i mean he's just like a pro and he's like there and yeah he's nick fitting and uh he's uh But I feel like he just seems like he's always been kind of over it. You know, I mean, you see that interview during... Yeah, I. Mean, this is early. This is before The Thing came out.

He's promoting The Thing and he's still like, ugh, movies. yeah can you believe people have to make these. Things yeah yeah exactly it's kind of like as a job as a living you know it's like he he always just had a very unpretentious view of it all and uh and you know but yeah the thing you know broke his heart i mean the thing is kind of like the the hearts the the apocalypse now of uh john carpenter's career you know. Pretty much i mean and and Is a masterpiece. Like, so it's, it's only ironic that like the thing that probably should have got him all that notoriety, like at the time, nobody cared about. And then only in retrospect, a bunch of nerds talk about it.

Like it's a masterpiece, but like he never got the recognition for that, that he should have. I guess Halloween's the closest he got to actual recognition in the moment. But it still burns him. If you listen to his interviews now, whenever the thing is brought up, it's just like. Yeah, look, I.

Made the best movie I knew. Stupid E.T. Best movie I knew how to make. And you guys, all you horror fans out there didn't show up. And then you gave me shit about it.

So fuck you guys. And, you know, I mean, I don't know how to make a better movie than the thing. And then you guys didn't care about it. And then it kind of like, you know, sidelined my career. And so, yeah, you know, whatever, guys, you know, I'm glad you like it now.

It doesn't do me any good now. OK, enjoy the ward. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. It's like this is what you guys deserve.

All right. I gave you my best and you didn't show up. So. So, fuck you guys. Here you go.

You know. Yeah. Yeah. That does sound like him. But meanwhile, next to him on the couch, like at that point, like Cronenberg still seems really interested in it.

Like, again, he doesn't show any excitement because he might be a robot. But it's like he seems like such an artist in his approach towards film. Like he genuinely is like interested in. what he's trying to do and what he's trying to say with his movies. And like, you can see that in the films and you can see that in the, the way that he talks about him in this interview. And like, he just genuinely seems engaged in film from like an artistic perspective.

And that's a totally different take than the other side of the couch. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cause Carpenter, I think is just trying to make scary movies, you know?

Yeah. And he, and he, he likes that concept and he's fine with that concept, but, That's totally different than what Cronenberg's do. Exactly. Cronenberg is looking into Freudian philosophy and all this stuff. And I don't know.

If you watch that commentary on the DVD, he seemed to be obsessed with this guy who was intellectual in Canada who made the term, the media is the message. And I still don't. Know what the hell that means. Marshall McCruin. I don't know what that means.

I thought I was getting. I had to double check. It's Marshall McCruin was his name. Right. So he was...

So his big inspiration for Videodrome was this guy, Marshall, and this phrase. And he started thinking about it and technology. And what's cool about Cronenberg, he really does think in sci-fi terms in a science fiction term. And like really thinking about people's relationship to technology and evolution and what are we becoming and how technology changes us. And like with pharmaceuticals and scanners and human potential.

And then in this with like how media affects us. And, you know, it's like even like shivers that come from within. Just like how. How, like, I don't know. It seems like that apartment complex and just, like, modern life and how that has changed us or how that changes people.

I mean, it's just real weird. Yeah. There's so much here. Since we're already rolling into it, I guess we should technically throw out the intro to the movie. Oh, right.

I think we've spilled over into the movie itself now. It's time for Sofa Theater. Why did you watch it, Max? Business reasons. Sure.

What about the other reasons? He's a victim. I woke up with a headache. He has been exposed to Videodrome. I've been hallucinating for a while, ever since.

What? Since I first saw Videodrome. His brain is all. I think that massive doses of Videodrome signal will ultimately produce and control hallucination to the point that it will change human reality. Electro-slave!

That's what I pray! Soon, his visions will coalesce and become... Now. Come take it. And Max Ren can do nothing to stop it.

What makes you think I need help? None of our test subjects has returned to. normality. Television can change your mind. Videodrome will change your body. Long live the new flesh.

It will shatter your reality. Videodrome. Videodrome. Starring Deborah Harry and James Woods. A shocking new vision from the creator of Scanners.

Coming soon to a theater near you from Universal Pictures. Death is the motion, can't you feel the thrill? Looking for the action, as we move through space. Total satisfaction, in this virtual maze. Living in the future glory.

It was Tyler, but you're like a knife. Did you know? This silver theater feature is Videodrome. The year is 1983. The director is the previously mentioned David Cronenberg.

And the plot, according to IMDb... A programmer at a Toronto TV station that specializes in adult entertainment searches for the producers of a dangerous and bizarre broadcast. Kind of. I mean, as much as you can encapsulate what's going on in this movie, I guess so. Spoiler alert, we're going to ruin the hell out of this.

So, yeah, hopefully you've seen it before. If not, go watch it. And I will say that's how we got to this point is it's one of those I kind of thought I had or I knew I knew I sort of lumped both this and scanners and the same thing of like, yeah, I watched those years ago. And then I found this copy of Videodrome and I was like, Ooh, this looks super deluxe and cool. I probably should go ahead and get this.

And I got it and was like, I don't know if I'd sat down and watch this in its entirety. And I was just amazed by it. I was just loving it for all the weirdest reasons. And yeah, I was so immersed in this movie that I was like, okay, I want to talk to you about it first and foremost. And then we probably should also just make an episode out of it.

So, Yeah. That's how I got to this point. Videodrome is so loaded. I don't even know if we can even get through it all because it's like, uh, and if you, especially if you go segue from Videodrome to Cronenberg's movies in general, and then just, uh, Like what, what, you know, and like all the different things that touches and what his career became and what, who he is as a guy and what his kids are now doing. I mean, it's just so much, Brian is too much to talk about.

That's what I realized. Like this morning I was putting together, like I had, I had notes from when I first was going to talk about it. I was writing that stuff down. I was making more notes. I'm watching the thing again.

I'm like, I'm getting all this stuff ready. And it's like, right before we're getting ready to record. And I'm like, man, I do not think we're going to do this movie justice. So fair warning to anyone who has decided to listen. I'm not giving this as an overall view.

That's really gonna put a pin in it and encapsulate what's going on and really pin down what this guy's going for. I'm like, I think our best bet again, knowing the two of us is just to have a conversation about it. So we'll go ahead and throw out that. Yes, it's about Videodrome and, But I don't think it's elevated thought. I don't think it's going to give you any insight into anything, really.

It's just going to be two jabbering monkeys. That's it. Talking about David Cronenberg. That's it. That's it.

In our usual monkey style. That's what we do. It's basically the monolith, and I'm a monkey coming up, and I'm just trying to observe it. And you're going to crack me over the head with a femur. Yeah, exactly.

This is not... going to be the definitive discussion of videodrome because it's just too big and you need you need a smarter guy than me talking about this movie and. That that from the get-go like as soon as i was like we were getting ready to record i was like i want to get us out of this it was like from the beginning i want to put a fair warning at the beginning this is not really yeah gonna be smart it's gonna be us talking and that's what we do it's like as long as you're cool with just hearing jabbering monkeys you're fine exactly there's. Gonna be a cronenberg like expert listening to this and he's going like you guys barely scratched the surface. Barely got his name right you. Barely understand anything you're not you're not qualified to watch or talk about this movie but i'm just saying it's it's uh it all right i'm just gonna say Let's start.

I'm trying to put myself back in the headset. If I was 22 in 1983, and did you see. Your head would explode like scanners when you watch this. Did you see the weird trailer for this movie on the disc? I don't know if, again, I was watching the other stuff, but I don't know if I watched the trailers yet.

The trailer, number one, is the most 1983 MTV thing you'll ever see in your life, okay? Awesome. It's in the top trailers of my life, okay? Because it's kind of a teaser trailer. It's all, like, really cheap animation and just flashes of, like, publicity stills from the movie and it's got like this new wave kind of song going on and it's like, uh, and it's got this guy like, uh, uh, it's a great film, uh, is a great trailer announcer guy going like, uh, you know, just reading weird abstract, like Videodrome will control your body, you.

Know, and stuff like that. And it's just like, I don't, you would watch that trailer and not know what the hell that was you just saw. Well, I mean, you can watch the movie and get to the end. And I feel like a lot of people will not know what they just watched. Yeah.

That trailer, had I seen that at 22, I remember seeing some stuff when I worked at a movie theater and just go like, this movie's going to change my life. And I seen that trailer at the right time. I would have thought that. And then I'm thinking... So the movie didn't make any money.

All right. It bombed. I mean, outside of one movie, most of his haven't made real like Hollywood money. Like he had one peak hit as far as money. Yeah.

And everything else is just him doing his weird Cronenberg stuff. Yeah. Yeah. The fact. Okay.

Yeah. So I guess you're thinking the fly. Yeah. That's his only real like mainstream breakthrough. Eventually he got taken seriously by the industry and made way more reserved movies. professional movies, but they still didn't make money.

Like they still weren't like a hit. The fly is pretty much the only thing he ever had as a financial hit type of Hollywood movie. Yeah. Yeah. I will, I will say, or I will give you up to, to scanners, which is probably my favorite Cronenberg movie.

Honestly. I mean, uh, but, uh, uh, scanners was like the first Canadian number one movie at the block box office in America, like ever. Yeah. I don't think it made, it wasn't like a huge hit, but it made, I mean, those movies were made so cheaply, you know? I found Scanners to be underwhelming.

And I don't mean that as a slam. I liked it. But I think it's one of those, I think I've described it. It's another one of those I thought I was familiar with it. I certainly knew about the money shot.

And then like, I didn't realize it's like the first thing you see. So then as you're watching it, it's like, Well, it's all downhill. Like you've blown your wads. Right. And like the rest of it is just kind of like a standard sort of action movie, sort of wrong man type of, you know, mystery figuring things out kind of thing.

Yeah. And it's good, but it just doesn't compare to what you were hit over the head with when you sat down. And so the whole rest of it's like, well, they're going to. Are they going to come back to something like that? And it's like, no, they can't really do anything more than that.

Like you just saw your head should have exploded too. That's it. You can't do anything more crazy than that. Yeah. So I feel like the whole rest of the movie just doesn't quite reach that peak ever again.

I hear you. And it's fine. I like it. But again, I was way more impressed and sort of overwhelmed by the goings on of, of video. No, no, no.

Definitely. Definitely. I hear what you're saying there. I hear what you're saying. I mean, they're two totally different movies.

I would say the thing he learned from Scanners was hire a real actor to be your lead. Because Stephen Lack appropriately... Yeah. That guy didn't help either. He did not help Scanners.

He was so not engaging, really. Like, where is Michael Ironside when you need him? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Please bring that up. Yeah, Stephen Lack in that movie doesn't really...

He was just out of his depth, you know? And I just recently read the novelization of Scanners, so. Yeah, you're cool. I am, I am, yeah. You're super cool.

Super cool. And I was going like, oh yeah, I could see like what maybe the character was supposed to be, you know, that he just didn't know how to bring to it. Or it kind of gave me some, oh yeah, if you read the book, you kind of see what maybe he was trying to do, but it just didn't quite have the chops. But anyway, but then you get James Woods in his next movie. What I'm trying to say is, Oh my God.

So much to talk about. Yeah. I am trying to imagine myself in 22 in 1983 and like, taking a date to go see Videodrome. Yeah, good luck with that. Unless it's Debbie Harry, you're in trouble.

You're in trouble, dude. I just don't know. Now, if they enjoy it, that is the person you marry because there is just going to be no. Or be afraid. You might not make it through the end of this date.

You just... I don't know. I just don't know. I think that is like a very... I just think that is probably the first...

That is the date that starts like a whole new relationship that you'll be in or you'll know that person the rest of your life or that is the last time you see that person. I mean, I've had. that experience. I did someone that I was involved with. I did the second for real date we were ever on the first one we met at a movie. So it was like, that's the first time I'd even come in contact with them.

The next time we ever went to go do a thing together, uh, We went to a John Waters movie. Oh, right. And I feel like that says a lot about a person. Yeah. Yeah.

Number one, they liked it. Number two, we were together after that. So I was like, yeah, I kind of get it. It bonds you in a way that you're not prepared for if you were a normal human. So if you're a weirdo, you bond over that and you're bonded for life, more or less.

Yeah. That's pretty much it. That's pretty much it, man. It's like if you're a weirdo and you go see a weird movie with another weirdo, it's a great thing, all right? If you are a weirdo and you take a non-weirdo to a weird movie, it is the most uncomfortable 90 minutes of your life.

You'll never see them again. They hate you for ever making them watch that, and they don't want to be near you because you're creepy. Yeah. And they're not wrong. I mean, they're not wrong.

I mean, a movie can really just ruin it. It's actually not a good place to take a date. Certainly not someone you don't know. It's different if you have been together with this person. You kind of know their taste.

You've decided together you want to go see it. That's a fine thing. But just sort of blindly picking a movie to go see as an activity for a date is a terrible idea. Yeah, because you're basically going into like a virtual reality kind of dream state with them. And if they're not digging it, I mean, it's just like, it's like a.

It's like the brain waves are just like. You can feel it. You're sitting next to them and you can feel how much they don't like what's going on on screen. It's the worst. It's the worst.

And I've seen movies that I love and then I'll see it with somebody who isn't on the vibe and I go like, wow, this is like physically painful to them. It's bringing me down. Yeah, yeah. I'm going like, huh, this is really weird, man. Movies are like this weird catalyst that just like.

It. Bonds you if it works, but if it doesn't, it just drives a wedge between you. For real, for real. And yeah, yeah. So I'm like, it's amazing.

So I was just going like, how many last dates was Videodrome? Yeah. Probably a lot. Probably a lot. Well, for the minimal amount of people that saw it at the time, a good portion of them never saw each other again.

So you go like, you know, had those people stayed together, had kids, I mean, had Videodrome been a different kind of movie, there would be a whole different group of people out here in the world. The world would be a different place had they not gone to Videodrome. They would have, they would have like, like, gotten with that person and had kids, but they didn't, so they found somebody else and had a completely different group of people. Yeah, yeah. This is the world we're now forced to live in, a post-video dream world.

Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. Well, you know, they talk about COVID babies and, like, whatever, blackout babies and that kind of thing, you know, it's just like, yeah, there's, there's, what was weird was we're also living in the world where, People went to go see Video Droop with somebody and they dug it and they. Had little weirdos. I mean, I appreciate that, but I think most of society would be afraid of those people. I think that explains the spike in autism.

Actually, kind of makes sense. Now that I'm doing the math here, yeah, that might make sense. Somehow we're pinning that on Cronenberg too. Way to go. I think I believe in the Videodrome factor much more than, like, the vaccination factor.

Yeah. Oh, the flesh gun's the one that did it. Yeah, I think so. Not the needle. Oh, my God.

Yeah. Now, did you know, like, before you saw the Rick Baker interview on the features, that that was supposed to be a tumor gun shooting tumors into that guy, and then the tumors breaking out. Of his body? See, I don't think, again, to put, to go from your trying to experience it as this 22 year old to me, like thinking I knew about it, kind of knowing a few of the things, but not really. And then just being immersed in it this time.

It's amazing because I was like, I think what won me over so quickly was is that it's such a vibe. Like it's not even because the story itself for you, the viewer doesn't necessarily make sense. But at the time, like if you're listening to him talk about it, he didn't even have the entirety of the story as he began shooting. Like by the end of it, it was still getting pieced together. So it's not like you're coming in with this overarching, amazing story that's going to, you know, as a screenplay, when you over.

So what you get is just this thing that he created at this time and place. And again, talk about lightning in a bottle, this weird version of the world that he captured with a camera. Is what won me over. I just, I'm just fascinated by this. Again, it technically is the 80s, but it feels like such a late 70s scuzzy world that he's living in.

Yeah. And then like all of the locations, all of the visuals are just so visceral. And that's before you get to the gross body horror. Like just the walls in these grimy places. Yeah.

They're so skeezy. You just want to go shower. It's like cheap sweaty leather pleather couches and shit. It's just so nasty. Just like stained paint on the walls peeling behind them and shelves full of crap falling on the floor.

Everything is just grimy and cluttered and a mess and gross and dated and old-timey and i'm like i love this like it is so weird and i can't get enough of it it's. Like science fiction as told behind the beaded curtain you know. It's just well it's like it's the future world but it's like you know back in the 30s through the 50s when they were like in 1980 when we have flying cars you know they would always make those weird predictions but this is like this weird bastardized Canadian vision of like Here's what science fiction future is going to be like. Like a sweaty 70s room. It's just going to be a grimy, gross place that you go and watch porn.

Right, right. You insert videotapes into your chest cap. What? Listen. Well, again, that's before we even get to that.

I'm like, just the first half hour, I'm already like. This is so weird and gross and I love it. That's it. That's it. Which says a lot about me.

Well, it's one of those movies. I've heard like this described by some movies where you go like, uh, where you're a kid watching it and you go like, oh, this is probably, I'll probably understand this more when I'm an adult. All right. Cause, uh, or like, this is like what adult adults are like, you know? Um, Like, when I saw Videodrome first, I was probably, like, 13 or something, and they showed.

No. No wonder. They showed it. Now it's all making sense. So they showed it on, you know, here in Atlanta, we had 2, 5, and 11, which were the networks, and then we had 36 and 46, all right?

And then we had 17... which was the Turner channel. And then we had 69, 69. Okay. But it's 69. That was like the lowest rent of the UHFs.

All right. That was like Weird Al was running that one. All right. Oh man. I'll take that.

Yeah. Yeah. And so no, so this was like probably shown on like channel 46 and cause channel 46 would like have like these, these theme months, you know, like they would have like uh, hot cars week on 46 where every night at. Eight o'clock Corvette summer. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Corvette summer, Mad Max and like dirty Larry, crazy Mary or something like that, you know, every night. I mean, it was great, but when you didn't have video stores, I mean, uh, uh, a movie every night on the UHF channels was freaking great, you know? And, uh, yeah.

You know, I mean, they would also do boring crap like Elvis week, you know, or something, you know. Hey, those are amazing in their own weird way. It would fill up time. So I saw a cut version of this on. that's what I'm trying to picture is like, how do you make this palatable for television audience? Well, uh, I mean, it can't make sense anyway, but on top of that, when you start taking pieces out of it, I'm like, what the hell are you left with?

There's so much not cut in the TV cut of the movie. Well, again, because the weird stuff isn't the kind of weird stuff you're normally forced to cut. So it's like, well, we can show this, but, Why would we? I can't. It may have been the only time they ever showed it.

I taped it and everything because I was like, ooh, David Cronenberg, Scanners. But it was like, but yeah, no. Videodrome at 13. Where you don't know what S & M is and you don't know what this, you know, you're not like a 13-year-old nowadays who has like 10,000 hours of pornography piped into their head. You know, you just don't.

Oh, if only to be that teenager. They'll be fine. Little did we know what we were not seeing. That's right. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So it was like, I was going like, ah, dude, so this is like what, this is what like getting it on is. An electrified clay wall. That's what the adults are into. Beatings next to a clay wall. That's what they like.

When a man loves a woman very, very much. He burns them with a cigarette. He burns them with a cigarette and then whips them against an electrified clay wall. Hot. You're getting me going now.

And then babies. That's how babies are made. Yeah. That's how they spit out of your stomach in the shape of a video tape. That's it.

That's how babies are made. I mean. I learned the birds and the bees from David Cronenberg. I mean, the way, like, pornography is, like, so, like, everywhere now, you know, that really changes the scene of him, like, sticking his face into the TV and everything. What seemed like to be all the interviews and all the smart people talking about this movie is just how it predicts, like, interactive culture with.

The internet, you know? Yeah. I mean, it does do a lot of things before it's a thing. Yes. That became just normal parts of our lives, but wasn't even dreamed up by anything.

Even most science fiction didn't quite pin it down the way that things are going on in this movie to some extent. Absolutely. I think the concept of just him being able to talk to the TV and it talking back, and that just by itself was... like, like such science fiction, you know, but interacting with a television show or interacting, interacting, having a one-on-one, uh, relationship with media was like, was so like, you know, 20 years away that, uh, it, it, it just seems like a weird dream. It is, uh, Well, it's also weird, like, the, again, the general griminess of that beginning that I like so much, and that this part is based in reality, the fact that this weird, again, talking about your cheap little station there, this cheap little station in Toronto is based on a real station in Canada, and they were playing softcore porn on TV, on TV.

I guess it had a loophole that it wasn't broadcast television, so it had different rules as a newfound version of what would become cable television for most people. But they also could skate by on different rules because it was cable and because it was Canada that they were playing softcore porn on what would have been regular TV for most people. So that part seemed really weird to me too when I realized that's not just a weird thing in this movie. That was going on in Canada in 1983. Yeah, maybe that's...

That was crazy. Like the more I got into that part of the world, I was like, this is an odd version of this, like normalizing porn in a way that like people weren't doing. Certainly not in America. We're still to this day. We're still so weird about, you know, nudity in general and adult themes.

Parents get super creeped out by that stuff. And I'm like, To some extent, I get it. But at the same time, like when you take all of the weight out of it, you know, you look at is Canada the most laid back place on earth? And like they're playing this stuff on regular TV and like kids aren't losing their minds or. Right. all of the horrible things going on in this country aren't going on there and they're letting their kids watch porn so maybe they know it's something that we don't know.

Yeah they probably didn't let them but i mean can you imagine being a 13. I mean i think about the stuff i watched once we got pay cable which we had the most basic version of cable out there but like i got to the point where we could watch the movie channel and it was pretty exciting because you know boobs and stuff And like, I think about the stuff I was watching that I shouldn't have been watching at that point, let alone if you were just free reign to go flip the channels and who knows what's going to be on your Canadian TV. Oh, hell yeah. Hell yeah. And we were talking like those movies seem real.

I mean, that was just like, I mean, probably just the way I was raised, just like, you know, very, it was all very repressed and pushed down and, you know, just a kind of a puritanical view of it all. You know, it was like, we were saying like when we did slave girls beyond infinity, I was going like, this movie is like, so innocent about its whole sexuality comparatively it's whole is nothing it's like you can watch this with your grandma it's just like uh it's like i mean i mean it's just like nothing you know and but it was like seen as like such a taboo like oh you're you're going to hell basically. If you watch these movies. Cause you watch this dirty movie. Yeah.

And then you're like robots bringing this girl a towel. This is gonna break my brain. And I'm going like, yeah. And I'm going like, well, you know, video drone, you go like, you watch that and you go like, Oh, this is like, I don't even know what the, I don't know. I feel like I should go hose off, but I don't even know why exactly.

I just feel dirty. I mean, watching this, we're trying to rewatch this nowadays when I've got like, you know, basically teenagers in the house and everything. It's just like, don't come in. Dad's busy now. Don't come in.

Like what the hell is dad watching? Cause if they see what you're watching, you're going to have to explain it to them. And good luck with that. Because I can't explain it after watching it repeatedly now. I know.

I know. So the whole thing just coming from... And I thought I had a handle on it. The media is the message. That is what somebody who is smarter than me is going to have to explain.

Because I really still don't understand what he's talking about. What the philosophy of that is. Other than... Like, media just changed. Well, I think it's the medium.

Yeah, the medium. Which, again, is just delivering your message through a different way. Yeah. Which, again, we got. Like, at that point, it was TV.

But shortly after that, when the internet came about, like, think about how much life as a whole on this planet changed once the internet connected you to everything else in the world. Yeah. Both good and bad. Like, you now have... Access to every smart thing you ever want to see, but also the depths of humanity are waiting for you.

Go to town, children. Yeah, I mean, you can go and do a virtual tour of the Louvre, or you can go on 4chan and see, you know.... You can watch some snuff films if you find the right avenue so like yeah it is i mean it is one of those that like i i don't know that that's exactly what he was talking about either of them the the original guy or or cronenberg but like it's where it led to like it really is like you didn't know what what was waiting out there for you until this new medium came about and was just like oh The message is whatever the fuck you want to find because it's all out there. So now that like... I think it's more of like the shackles are taken off of you.

Like before you were into your little school and your dumb teacher taught you these things and like you were exposed to a little bit of this at home and that was pretty much it. Like your whole life was pretty shackled to this one straight and narrow way of doing things. Yeah. And once you're opened up to like they start making crazy movies in the 70s and then you're TV, they start showing whatever the hell they want in the eighties. And like, by the time you get to the internet, like shackles are off.

You can go do whatever the hell you want. You can watch whatever the hell you start meeting other people, even not in the real world. You start talking to a screen and the screen talks back to you either in text form and then later video form. And like, it really is like it opened up a whole new world that like we didn't know existed. Like we couldn't have, comprehended how much was going to be thrown at our feet in a span of 10, 15 years.

Yeah. It's insane, really. And the fact that we haven't imploded already is kind of amazing. Yeah. No, no.

The fact, I mean, it is really like the technology came and I think our brains are still trying to catch up with all this connectivity. You know, like, uh, I know my brain is. Well, again, I don't think people realize like what it did. Like the first wave of us that came about when it were, we're straddling a line. Like we're kids that didn't have it.

And then we were like, just after teens you're thrown into it where you have access to all this new stuff so you kind of see both sides of it but then so we're still trying to catch up like we've never been able to catch up really not to mention every kid that came after us us that's just thrown in. You're in the deep end the second you're a kid. Every little kid I know has a... my pad that they're carrying around in a big, soft, squishy thing that they're poking at from day one. And like their entire life is now channeled into their brain through this screen. Like that's insane to me.

Like that I didn't have. And now watching kids grow up like that, I'm like, how much is this affecting the way that they're developing what they're learning, how they're going to turn out? Like, I don't think we realize it yet. We're not going to see, uh, the effects of it for another 10 or 15 years, like. Bringing it back to the video drum.

It's very much the image of him putting that videotape into them. It's really like the, the technology. I really see it as like nowadays as like people are more, they're kind of like cyborgs. We're kind of like augmented cybernetically by things that aren't in our bodies, but we carry them everywhere. You know, it was like, I know my brain, uh, does not work as hard as it used to, basically because everything has been offloaded into my phone.

And I don't have to really remember anything anymore. Well, you definitely don't. And it almost annoys me the people that don't accept that. Like, the people that are still dragging behind. And they'll be standing there, like, because their brains don't work anymore, they're going... what's that one, you know, that thing.

And like, by the time they've said the sentence, I've already gotten my phone and looked it up. Right. And I'm just like, why just, just accept it. You don't have to wonder what's the thing that had James Woods in it. And he's in a thing.

Like you can look it up. You already know the answer. If you get your phone, just like, it's almost more frustrating when they won't just, Just give in to the technology. Shove the videotape into your chest. Just accept that you're part of this thing and like you need it for your information now.

Yeah, yeah. And then like his body starts changing because he's got the technology in it. So it's like, it's that fear of like, what are we doing to our bodies by accepting technology? You know, like what the tendrils coming out of his fingers and everything. And I see that totally as, and what, really blew me away about seeing Videodrome again now with, like, the way the internet is and YouTube and how it indoctrinates people into certain mentalities and certain teams and, you know, become radicalized on one side.

I was like, if this movie has nailed it on anything... It is like how, you know, like, we won't even say right or left, how people will watch, like, Al-Qaeda videos and then go and join Al-Qaeda, you know? They go down these YouTube rabbit holes. What also I thought was amazing about the movie is that and how... it nails it also is that James would change his sides halfway through the movie where he's on this person's side, but then he becomes radicalized on the other side. And so it's just like, however, these people, people can be programmed by the media.

I mean, everybody, yeah. People want to get on, on the media today and then complain about that all the time, which they do. But you did like that. I was looking at these, the different things, because they even say these lines on the menu when you put the disc in. The battle for the mind of North America will be fought on the video arena.

I was like, yeah, that is our life. Like, everything that happens today, we only know about it because we're seeing... Like, now everything is recorded. Everywhere. Everywhere.

So like every time they do a news story, if I don't get video footage of it, I'm like, what is this? Like, what are you telling me something? Show me the footage. Like that plane went down. Show me the footage.

And I've seen six of them this week. And like everything that happens, that's a news story. You're immersed in it. Like the country's on fire. I'm watching a guy stand in his kitchen while fire surrounds him.

And I have a firsthand POV shot of this horror going on. And I'm like, that's where we are now. Like, we can't hear a news story. We have to experience it. Like, we have to be part of the media that then captures it and shoves it into our brains.

Like, that is how we experience news now. That is how it works. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then the other one that it says is your reality is already half video hallucination.

So that's the other one. It's like, okay, well now we're talking about the manipulation. Now it's like, especially in our new CG world where like AI can create whatever the hell it wants. Exactly. At this point, you don't even know what to trust.

Like you don't know they're getting to the point where they're faking news and they can put it out there and people will buy into it. People will argue it. They like it is immediately taken as a serious thing. Even if people doubt it, it becomes a topic for conversation. It becomes something that.

Could be real just by putting it out there. No matter how fake it is. Like it doesn't matter. You put it out on the internet. It now gets just consumed by people.

And that's what's important. That it's done its job. Whether it is factual or not. People have already taken it in. And it's part of their lives.

And, like, that's the scary part. And when it's believed and they start acting like soldiers for it, you know, I mean. Oh, yeah. Which happens. We've seen firsthand.

Which would happen. Like, the guy going to the pizza place to, like, rescue the QAnon kids, you know, from the. Yeah. So he's basically James Woods. Well...

I mean, yeah, it gets to that point of very quickly he becomes radicalized enough to start killing people. Because that's the other one I was like, this is 83. And we got a guy that goes to his job and shoots people. That didn't used to be a thing. When he made this, that was a crazy vision of the future.

Now it's a Tuesday. Now you are lucky to go a week without somebody showing up on... their job, their school, their wherever, and shooting people. Like, that's just the thing that happens. And then we're watching, like, after he does that, like, jumping way ahead, but like, After he does that, I was watching it today, and I'm like, the point where he's out on the street, and they're running his picture on the TV while he's walking around. Like, he is news, and he's still walking the street.

I'm like, we just had that. We just had a guy execute someone on video, and he took off and is walking around the city while everyone in town is watching the video of him murder someone. I'm like, this just happened. Like, this exact scenario is our lives now. Yeah.

That is weird. Yeah. It's, it's, it's a lot to process. It's a lot. Yeah.

Cause like when he first gets into video drum, you find out it's like this, I mean, it's basically the conservative side saying, like, we need to get rid of all the sex perverts out there who watch this smutty shit. It's like luring you in. Here's the bait of, like, look at this. You know you're into this. And then once we get you, like, we can start weeding through all these people we don't want.

That's it. That's it. Yeah. And then, like, the girl who runs the. I love the homeless shelter giving people.

I was just going to say, I was like, that was my, that was maybe the most sci-fi thing of it. Like this vision of the future where it look, everything else looks like your standard old building where they're bringing people in and giving them soup and blankets. But instead it's them giving their, their fix of television because they don't care about food anymore. They don't care about clothing anymore. They want to connect to the TV.

What would be the internet? Like they need their feed of the medium and that's what's going to get them through the day. And I'm like, that's maybe the most profit. That is what, you know, you can't imagine that being a real thing. And now it is like, it's so impressive.

If can you imagine if, internet became like rationalized, rationed like that. And you had to go to an internet. We would fall apart. But can you imagine the lines of people going in and like just to get 30 minutes, like a methadone fix, you know, of internet, you know, of that kind of connectivity. The internet cafe, if it weren't a novelty, if it were like government sanctioned and like you were paying like 75% of your income every month to go get your fix of internet. like that that's again a shade away like if things shift a little that's where we'll be like we're already that connected and like we spend how much on our internet and our wi-fi and our devices to hook up to it and like we already shell out a good amount to make sure we are always connected so all it takes is a little tweaking and like we're at that point uh.

My kid uh my oldest one, we're having some phone issues right now that I'm fighting you know, the big evil corporations on. But there was about a, you know, she had to go, like, about, say, like, well, her phone went dead. She couldn't get into her dorm anymore. She couldn't contact anybody about it. You know, it's like everything is now through your phone.

It's really like an extension. It's like basically how you interact with the world now. But it was like she had to go like 12 hours without the phone functioning. And and it was like, wow, I got so much done. We're like, we'll see.

We'll see. I went the other way. I just had this like mine. I've had, again, I'm not the person who buys a phone every year because it's the new cool thing. Like I'm like, whatever this works.

It's mostly a camera for me anyway. I'm just taking shots of inanimate objects. I'm a weirdo. What do you want? So it's not like I'm making phone calls all day.

So, like, as long as the camera works and I can use it for maps to get around, I'm good. Yeah, yeah. So, like, mine finally got to the point of, like, it started doing this... It was almost like snow, but it was, like, on old TVs. But it was a multicolored version, so it was, like, red and blue.

But it was, like, this weird set pattern of snow that would come up and just lock up the phone. And I'm like, well, this isn't good. So. At first I couldn't tell if it was dead altogether. So I had that day and a half of dealing with it.

And like, you don't realize how, I mean, we do, but like until you don't have it anymore, how many times I reached for it and went, ah, damn. Or I'm driving and I'm like, I can just go over. I just got to figure out how, ah, son of a bitch. I don't know how to get anywhere anymore. Like my phone tells me everywhere to go.

I don't. Think i don't need to know how to go anywhere that's what my phone's for so like the basic versions of being able to like oh i need to look this up oh i need to take a picture of this i need to get somewhere like everything is on our phone so like as soon as you lose that you realize you're helpless like our society is but all you do is take away our internet and our society falls. Apart it's like you realize i am just a ape i am a monkey i am just a hairless monkey running around and really it's my connection to infinite information that makes me smart by myself I'm just a monkey that's what. I'm saying I mean we found the monolith that's our cell phone right the cell phone tower is the monolith we sit by it and go oh praise be you give us our information yeah Yeah.

I mean, that's what. Worship at the tower. We're like... I mean, it really is like... And so, like, yeah, I mean, our...

This book I'm reading about just, like, the AI that's coming down the pike is just basically like, look, man, it's like you're... If you do not accept that, like, you know, this. Our connection to the net is going to be like... Our brains are going to be hooked up to the infinite world knowledge and our brain's processing power is going to be so manifold expanded to certain ways that we can't even comprehend because we just have never experienced it before. We just can't comprehend how... how our brains are going to be expanded by locking into the net, uh, that, uh, to, to basically everything that it's, it's, we, if you don't, you're really just going to be like, you're really just going to be like a monkey.

Well, again, it's back to me not being able to function. Like you have to be connected to, I think we're just going to get to that next step, which is the Johnny Mnemonic jack in your neck. And like, you just get immediately hooked into the internet. You don't need a phone anymore. You're just hooked in.

And like, that's the only way you function anymore, which again is very Cronenberg. Like to have physical pieces of equipment stuck into your body. And then you're connected to the system that runs everything. That's, that's where we're headed anyway. I mean, I thought that for, for a while there, like, it, the novelty went away, but I think now it's just been replaced with better technology.

But when Bluetooth became a gimmicky thing and all the cool people and the rich people had this electronic device sticking out of their ear all day long, walking around talking to themselves, I was like, what sci-fi world are we lit? Like it, it is like everyone's a fucking cyborg. Like you're walking around with this thing sticking out of your ear. And I'm just like, this is weird. And like, again, better technology already took its place because all it takes is about 15 minutes now and better technology comes along.

So yeah. But to me, like we're already kind of at that point, it's just gotten to be better technology, but like we're already like now we're Google glasses. So we're like, we're blocking out the real world in front of us, but we're putting the world of the internet in front of our eyes. So you can, again, take the blindfold example there and like, Hey, do you want to look at what's really going on? But I mean, it doesn't, it doesn't matter because that's going to be like, now again, it's still silly novelty item, but like, we're just a few steps away from that being a regular everyday thing.

So much so, again, look how ahead of it is when he puts on the giant VR helmet in this. It's big and clunky, but it's that same idea in 1983 when we weren't doing VR or anything. And now, kids are hooked up to it playing video games all day long. So it's like, it's ahead of its time, but at the same time, it is where we're headed. It is what's going to happen.

I would say, if you could put put in some contact lenses or put on glasses, and then you can re-skin... your environment to make it look like Blade Runner or make it look like whatever, like, you know, IP that, you know, you want it to look like. I mean, we're pretty close to that, right? I mean, you're, you're kind of doing that at this point now when you're, you're getting to the point, you can just ask AI to, uh, make me a new Blade Runner movie. And I want it to have, uh, you know, Harvey Korman is the lead. Like you can just like throw together a random stuff and like, Just set the parameters and go.

And then seconds later, it will deliver this into your head. You'll be watching it on your Google glasses. And it's like, we're not far away from that. And again, I think it's amazing how much was going on in this movie that, again, is a big clunky 80s version of it. But the idea is already there and already playing out like it's a normal thing.

Yeah. And we're seeing it happen. I mean, it's just like we're seeing... I was. Just kind of shocked.

I mean, I don't think... I think when I originally saw it, it was like, ooh, it's weird and gross, you know? But it's like, you know, it's like sex, but it's not like what they talk about in health class at all. It's not normal sex. I mean, sure, it's hot.

I'm into it. I don't know. It's not how they said in gym class. It's not what they talked. About in gym class, you know?

And. But, no, it's, like, crazy how much, once the internet, at this point that it's in now and how it influences, like, thought, it's incredible how precedent, how, whatever, how it foresaw that, you know? How accurate it is. Yeah, yeah. Well, and so much so, what's funny, listening to the commentary on this, the commentary on this is really old.

So it's like, he's already talking about how much, like, it's like 90s. It's like, he keeps referencing, like, DVDs as, like, the new technology. Yeah, yeah. So, like... It's like he's already talking about from the 80s to the mid 90s how much things have changed.

Yeah. But like the ridiculous amount of things that have changed since the mid 90s to now is insane. So listening to Cronenberg talk about how much things have changed and sort of come around in the 90s is like amazing to then put it on fast forward to where we are now and be like, oh, 90s, you had no idea what was in store for us. Or maybe it did. Because you called it 1983.

Yeah, but it was just seeing it through, like, an analog vision. I mean, the way media can, like, you know, galvanize a public on a certain ideology, that's like, you know, World War II, you know? I mean, you think, like, that's like, you know, propaganda films and all that stuff. I mean, it's, like, such a powerful way to get everybody on the same page, you know? But it was...

It used to be, like, almost... like obvious and heavy handed, like again, maybe people weren't quite as sophisticated, you know, at the time when you're showing it to people that barely have like a high school education at the time. And you're like showing these sort of overarching stories that are trying to warp their brain into coming around to somebody's point of view. But like, I think the scary thing is now they may be a little more educated, but they're also better at putting them together. So now you can do people in a way that like, they don't even realize, like maybe before they knew it was heavy handed, but they were like, yeah, but the message, and I want to get behind what they're saying now.

It's like, I don't know that people realize they're being duped. They're just, it's gotten so good at what we can manipulate and what we can say that and how ingrained we are into the media that like we just accept things that I, yeah, I think like now there's, there's an even scarier version of the propaganda idea that like it can happen and people don't even know that it's happened. Yeah. Well, the underground fringe, you know, is now just so all over is so accessible, you know, and any crazy thought you have, you can get an army behind it and like, you know, flat earthers and stuff, you know, it's just like. The internet connects people that would have never had anything to do with each other.

Like it's a, it's different when it's you trying to get six people together in your same city. But like when you have a net that you can cast out across the world, you find a lot more people. Yeah. It's like, You had, like, a village idiot. But they were isolated.

Now the village idiot has a platform and can address the entire village the world over. Well, he can now connect to all the other village idiots. The network of idiots. A network of idiots. And they....

With numbers, there's strength. There's strength in numbers. Yeah. Anyway, so yeah. The movie's just crazy.

And James Woods is so good in it. And even. Even the DVD I got is an older thing, but I guess the remastering they did on it, even on standard definition, the movie looks like a million bucks. Again, that's why it's scary. Because you feel the griminess of not just the location...

But when we get into the gross visceralness of the... Again, what is all practical effects. And you feel how amazing these... Again, for me, I love this. the practical effects of it. Oh, yeah.

Even Cronenberg's talking about when they do the gun hand thing, and he's like, well, now, in the 90s, they would probably use CG to do this, but we didn't have that option. I was like, yeah, and it feels so much creepier, and the visceral nature of it is because there's a hand in that prosthetic, and weird puppeteers are jamming metal pieces into that arm, and it feels... Like, you feel the grossness of it. Yeah. And that's why it's so good.

Yeah, well, yeah. The first time I saw that, I was like, that looks like the most painful thing I've ever seen in my life. And I think about how much you wouldn't get into it if it looked like a fake cartoon version. A bad, like, a bad CG version. You'd be like, ah, God, this is dumb.

And this may, again, not necessarily look real, but it looks... gross enough that it like sucks you in when it's a practical effect so especially for body horror like he does i'm like practical effects are just it's what makes it. A thing absolutely no no no no it's like why i've never seen the the thing prequel i'm just like what's the point you know but. I've seen it but again that's the the hobbling of it because there's good performances in there there's good effects that got covered up like there's a lot of great pieces and then studio involvement came along and screwed everything up and that's what killed it. Yes. What I would like to say is, is, uh, that period of filmmaking where like the Rick Bakers and the Stan Winston's and the Robbo teens were seen as like, uh, you know, rock stars is what's so as they should be.

So interesting is there was that feeling of that time, uh, uh, through these practical, through these guys that there was nothing you could not do in filmmaking where like, but what was interesting is it was limited to, if you wanted to show something really wild in a movie, you got to get one of these guys, you know? And there was like five guys at the top of their craft that could really like, uh, uh, realistically show some crazy wild out, you know, things, you know? And so now, you know, so it was just like pushing the limit, you know, uh, of what you could show in a movie by these, by the skill of these guys. Now you can show anything in a movie, but it's like, Hey, it's not like one guy, you know, it's like, uh, It's.

A team of 500 people to do the same thing for some of those bigger studio movies. Yeah. Watch those credits at the end where it fills the entire screen with names of people around the world, all working on subsections, sub companies, sub contracted out jobs that all have to come together to do that idea. Exactly. And working terrible jobs. you know, 80-hour weeks sleeping.

In their cubes. Terrible conditions. You know, to get these movies done by the deadline. Yeah. I don't know.

I don't know that it's better. No, it's not better. In a way, you're like, oh, it's giving all these people jobs. I'm like, yeah, terrible jobs, which is what we have now. Terrible jobs.

There's no advocacy for those folks. There's a really funny HBO show that just came out called, oh, oh, God. The franchise. And it's a really funny, but it's about making one of these, you know, Marvel esque superhero movies, but kind of like a, like a, kind of like an Ant-Man sequel, kind of second tier. No, I mean, I, I like them more than some people, but even I'm like, yeah, some of these are second tier or third tier.

Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, and the funniest, one of the funniest characters is the, uh, visual effects guy. You know, they say, like, don't worry, we'll just fix it in post. We couldn't have, we need, like, we could only afford two mole men in this shot, so I need you to do, like, 7,000 mole men.

And he goes, like, I have not slept in four weeks. Ah, you can do it. Sadly, it's all kind of true, I'm sure. Yeah, yeah. But so soon.

It's not even going to be a legion or a, what do you call it? An army of. Yeah, you won't have an army of badly paid humans. You'll have one that pushes go. Yes.

And like, then all the AI kicks in and does it all on its own. And it will look equally as bad, but no humans got paid. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, what is going to be...

I mean, I think things like Netflix, it's not going to be like they make you shows. I think you're going to subscribe to Netflix to get an algorithm where you can just speak out your stuff. As I said earlier. Yeah. Make me a new Blade Runner with Harvey Korman.

It'll do it. I want to watch the Maltese Falcon, but I want Madeline Kahn in the lead. And it can do it. That's it. It's going to everyone will have six fingers but like other than that they can do everything else they just don't know how to do hands and feet to save their life everything else can be made pretty accurately sometimes it's disturbing some of the stuff you see that like how did where did you even come up with this but like it it sometimes is frighteningly well put together in a way that you don't expect from AI.

And then other times it's a horse. Yeah. For real. See all our monkey artwork. That's why I started doing that because all, everyone I know, like I, again, putting all the things I have together over the years, I know a ton of artists and I know people that that's their livelihood, you know, is like physically creating artwork.

Right. And so many people are really upset about, you know, the, the ease and accessibility of AI artwork now. And I'm like, yeah, but it is what it is. Like there's a, there's a, a wrongness about a lot of what it does. And even when it does it, what seems to be well, there's also a soullessness to it that you can feel.

So I don't know. Like to me, I'm like, I, have started to make use of it only for the, like, I don't even do anything else with it now. Like I only put together dumb monkey images for these episodes. But other than that, like I look at it and I'm like, yeah, that's all I see is bad artificial intelligence artwork. And like, the only thing that's interesting to me is how wrong it gets things sometimes that it doesn't understand.

Like there's no brain telling you not to do that. So it does things that make no sense. Yeah. Of humanity like what are you left with like when it's just putting together random parts and it doesn't really know what they are it just knows something told it to do this kind of like this and like it doesn't know what it is and it doesn't know how wrong the finished image is like you need a conscious there to go whoa whoa whoa what are you doing like that's not how that goes like when you take that out like what are you left with so again I don't feel like it's I do feel like it is taking away jobs to some extent. I don't, I don't like that part of it, but at the same time, I don't feel like there's any genuineness to most of what I've seen.

That's AI. Now, again, it's going to get better. That's the scary part. That's the downward slalom. We keep coming back to you with this technology.

You're like all of this technology. is that it's getting better to a scary algorithm. So, yeah, the artists, though, they're used to living a freelance lifestyle. I mean, it's not just AI taking away their job. It's going to take away everybody's job. Pretty much, yeah.

Yeah, that's where we're headed. So, I mean, it's not like we're just picking on artists. I mean, the guy who can't, teenagers aren't going to be able to work at Burger King anymore to get their first. I mean, I think that's the front line. Like, the first thing you saw was artists are like, hey, nobody's hiring me to do these jobs anymore because they're just typing in and getting this, like, AI garbage and instead they're doing that because it's cheap.

But, again, the next level is, okay, now this robot's making my fries for me and I don't need your dumb teenager anymore. Like, so it's, it's getting better and by better, I mean worse, but the technology is getting better, which is the scarier part. Yeah, no, it's going to give it another five years. I mean, I just don't even think, I mean, I got somebody who works in the, uh, you know, I got a friend who works in the, you know, the film biz. I mean, he quit cause he was, he was like going like, God damn, I haven't seen anybody at my family and you know, I'm about to have a stroke.

Um, but, uh, Don't worry, robots will revive you. Yeah, right. They can keep you alive forever. Come put yourself on the machine. Yeah, yeah.

But no, he just says, he's just going like, man, I think we're watching just the death of, you know, the industry, basically. Or the birth of a new one. Like, again, I don't know that it's, again, it's all in how you look at it. Cause I've looked at some of these things and I'm like, we've seen it go through waves before. Now, granted this is hitting a new level, but like you look at like, again, we're talking about practical effects before.

And it's like, then that era of CG effects came in and you saw a bunch of movies latch onto that. Studios loved it. Cause it was cheaper. And again, but but there became like a bad version of that that no one liked anymore and then you got this resurgence of like a bunch of geeks like us that were like but but practical effects is where it's at man and like sometimes there would be movies that would like no we're going all in on practical so like there's more of an appreciation for the better version of these that's true that comes about and then eventually i feel like a lot of the, the crappy, nothing but CG stuff started to die off again. Some of it's because the technology got a little better, but it also like the novelty war off too.

And eventually we went back to like, eh, whatever you need, you can use this or you can use this or, Whatever. You're right. It was. I think it'll change depending on... Again, now it's like everything is getting worse at an accelerated rate.

So I don't have a hope for the future, but I hope at some point... it doesn't like the novelty of the AI stuff wears off and like, yes, we will make use of a lot of what it's going to do. Right. Hopefully for better reasons, hopefully in better ways, probably not because humans are stupid, but that's my only hope is I hope we, because we're going to be, taken over by the technology one way or the other so we can either be victim of it or hopefully someone finds a way to use it constructively creatively like in some way that doesn't just kill us all which is yeah more than likely what's gonna happen there's my cheery outlook on life. Oh my god that's crazy. So all of them i mean we get caught up in the bigger picture here but Also, just like the real world-ness of some of these things, I at least wanted to address.

I know you. I know the kind of guy you are. So you are probably many a night sitting around shirtless, wearing only your shoulder holster. Yes. That's the way I picture you at home most.

Nights, really. That's what I do. That's what I do. Shirtless, wearing your shoulder holster, hanging out in your place. That's right.

A little paranoid. I just love that image of like, who is this crazy man? Like, why, why is he, what is he doing now? Like there is sort of a weird journey of like, what the hell is this guy up to now? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. If you take out all of the bigger imagery, like you get left with, look at this crazy dude. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. No, the, the first time me seeing that, uh, that, uh, I, uh, what should I call it? The, the chest, uh, gap, The chest slit. The bearer of the slit, as I think he referred to himself. Yeah.

And Debbie Harry was like, yeah, welcome to it. This is how it goes, dude. Welcome to it. Some of us have dealt with this our whole life. Hilarious.

Yours just takes videotapes. Sometimes you shove a gun in there, you know. But some of us are bearers of the slit all the time. That was such a mind-blowing... moment uh when i first saw that i was going yeah i. Mean even now it's weird but like to be in 1983 and see that like how does your head not explode like scanners pretty much i keep coming back to that because i'm like he pinpointed the response that you should have to all things most of which are contained within his own movies like you should watch that and your head explodes.

When the slit close up and he goes like oh shit where's my gun where's. My gun Like he's looking in the couch like he lost the remote. Where the hell did I? I swear it was right here, which this is me with the remote 78 times a day. I just had it in my hand.

How is it gone? So I guess I should start checking my chest slip now because I swear it disappears on a regular basis. So that's pretty much what happens with the gun. It's hilarious. And then I like that later, even Cronenberg's like, well, and it's not like it went away.

It was incubating it to become the flesh gun that we know and love later. Yeah, it's... Oh, my gosh. It's such a crazy... I don't...

It's... I'm kind of like... My brain is getting hemorrhaging trying to think of. It's going to explode. Yeah, it's... that scene.

And, uh, Brian, I, I'm, I'm just kind of like overwhelmed by the movie. It's, uh, well, okay. We have again, before your head explodes, we, we also haven't gotten into, because first off, I want to say, I might have to change my name because Brian oblivion may have to be the way I'm addressed at all times from here on out, because that's a pretty bitch and ridiculous name. Yeah. But I like that our character is named Brian Oblivion.

But the fact that he isn't even a real person that we know of. We assume that he is in the beginning. And then as time goes on, he's just an assemblage of videotapes. Which, again, when you're fast-forwarding to now, you could have digital version of videotapes. And then fast-forward to... the AI version of Heldas.

And like, you can easily create, it's, it's again, it's an avatar before we knew what that was. And like, now you're not only create, because I mean, we all kind of do that. Like we already have this alternate universe that is the internet. And we, we create this version of ourselves that we present to other people that we put out on the internet. So like the person you are sitting at home shirtless, wearing a shoulder holster is totally different than the presentation on your Instagram feed.

You know, it's like you create the person you want to be for other people to see. We all kind of do that. I mean, when I drag myself to work, it's, it's a, I'm forced to put on some sort of, I don't know. It ain't a happy face. But I at least present myself in a way that, like, is acceptable slightly, barely, to humans.

So, like, we all do that on a day-to-day basis. And then it became, like, a hundredfold on the internet when, like, you could sort of hide your real identity and create this fake identity, this avatar version of yourself. But, like, when you get to the point where you can 100% create, a new entity, it doesn't even have to be a real person. You can create it and manipulate it and make it say and do whatever you want. That's a weird alternate thing that, again, was fictional and isn't really.

I can hear you. I can hear you now, yes. We're having some... technical issues here and everything. Well, did you insert the antenna into your chest like you're supposed to? You have to feed the technology into your chest.

Shove it in your slit. and then shove it up through the window, because you've got to get it out like old-timey rabbit ears, but you also have to be physically connected to it. I was getting what you were saying, though. It was cutting in and out about Brian Oblivion being just existing on videotape and how people now curtail their... It's basically that warehouse of videotapes where he interacts the world with is kind of like an Instagram feed. And I think that's...

That's a very, very true statement. Something I hadn't thought. Or just bits and pieces. He was all of these videotapes put together, made this person more or less. But now, digitally, all of that is a real thing.

You don't have to insert a tape in. You can bits and pieces your way through whatever you want on the internet now. So when you put all that in an AI program. You can create an entire. different human and soon soon we will all be max headroom is what i'm telling you talk about profits looking into the future max headroom was way ahead of the curve uh just saying you're scary also drink pepsi don't forget to drink pepsi. But dystopian future and drink pepsi thought sat and actually thought about how creepy there is this cyber doppelganger of ourselves being grown and nurtured online.

That is a different us. That's weird. I mean, I thought that as soon as like you, you started seeing like the very first version of social media, I started to realize that because like, Because everyone, again, everyone I knew at that time was a creative type. So like, they were all like, here's my best work. Here's my best photos of me.

Here's my best, like you're just creating this idealized version of yourself. And like, that's what you put out there. So if everyone just becomes that, like if you're, again, if all we do is sit at home, if we don't even interact in the real world, because we don't have to, because AI took our jobs. So we don't have to leave the house. Like you just sit in front of your computer all day, The only thing you're interacting with is what you're putting out there.

So if none of us are out there in the real world being the horrible, gross humans we are, it's just avatars talking. To each other. Like, you're just the creation that you want to be, more or less. You're basically just feeding your avatar to do all your interacting for you. And you're just like this weird troll thing that's, like, you know, serving the avatar.

Really? Yeah. The Avatar is having a much better time than you are. Was it surrogates? Was that the one with Bruce Willis?

Did you ever see that? Like I felt like it did not get the recognition. Like as a story, it's a really cool idea. Like whether or not it's successful in its movie-dom, who knows. But like as a concept, like it was surprising how well that came.

Idea yeah well i'm just thinking about with the and again where we might be headed like you know isolate isolate in place or whatever you know stay in place or whatever they was calling it uh shelter in place you know that that didn't that didn't help things with like just you know i live my life online and yeah no that's real creepy. I think it opened up those doors. I think people were already very comfortable staying home and doing everything they do on the internet and like creating themselves as an avatar through their social media. Yeah. But like then when like the government came along and said, Oh yeah, don't go anywhere.

Like you, you need to stay home. It's like, well, that just unleashed that in everyone. And they're like, Oh, well wait. So like then we had like when it's time to go back to the world and people didn't want to go back to work. Like you had a lot of people that were like, well, I can work from home.

So why don't I? So, cause I was one of those going, I didn't get to, and I was kind of annoyed. I was like, well, can we change things so I don't have to go to work? Cause I don't want to have to go out into the world and see you people. So I didn't get that chance, unfortunately, but there were a lot of people who did and they didn't want to go back to it.

And, like, I still think it changed things so much that, like, the fact that people, like, almost everyone I know doesn't go to the grocery anymore. They just don't. At best, they might pick it up themselves. But even that, half the time, it just lands on their porch. Like, you don't even have to leave the house.

Like, you can just... sit in your house and play on your computer and suddenly groceries come to your house and you don't die like it's taken a basic like the the foraging part of your survival skills is now gone like you don't even have to do that anymore you just sit at home and if you have the money to pay for it it shows up on your porch so it's finding that dynamic of like how do i sit at home still make money enough to pay for the groceries that show up on my porch like it's like a weird thing that shifted even more. So like we're already on that road, but like. It just weird. It's even further into that mess. I was one of those people who got to work from home.

All right. And I know I'm not, no, I'm, I'm not, I'm not bragging because in a way at first I hated it. I was like, Oh, I'm, The whole point of the job is the whole only thing I like about the job is the people I work with. And now you've taken away the people. And so now it's just the job.

This sucks. Yeah, I don't want to do the work. I say something stupid and I have to laugh at it. But then I got used to it. And then I like now I'm like going, that's the only way to do it.

But let me tell you something. It's been five years. All right. And I have found. The last couple of times I've left the house...

I've... I mean, I've always had some kind of social anxiety thing. But not like now. Alright? It's...

I've... It was like... I feel like... In Iguana... In a terrarium...

And when I leave my terrarium... It's. Like everything is so big. And. Moves so fast.

That I, that. Things that I, you know. Where's my rock I usually hide under? Yeah, right. Where's my warming rock?

Yeah. That's where I hide and no one can see me there. That's it. And so it's, I think over the long period of time, because there will be times where I go like, you know what? I don't think I've left the house in three weeks.

Yeah. Thankfully, I don't do that. I still go out on a regular basis. Again, mostly to look at crap. If I wasn't busy trying to buy more crap, it would probably lead me more to that life.

But I enjoy the looking at crap aspect of life. Going and looking at crap is important. It kind of is. It's not the same on the internet. I find a lot of weird shit on the internet.

Don't get me wrong. But it's not the same as physically seeing it in front of you. It's just a different experience. No. No, I didn't realize how it was impacting me until probably in the last two months or so where I was going, the world is so big and overwhelming when I'm outside.

And I'm going like, that's not happened before. I used to be annoyed with people, but the world wasn't overwhelming. So I'm going like, dude, I got to get out more. And I feel like, and you were at least... whether or not you were an adult, but you were a grown man at that point. But I think about the way that it hit with kids and you will have this window even more than I, but I know several kids that like so much of their life was spent learning quote unquote at home through the internet that like, when it came back to time, they like it, it changed the way they dealt with school.

It changed. I'm like, their grades has changed. Like everything was different when it all got shifted and, And like that, we definitely had a whole generation of kids that came about in that era when you just sat at home and like little kids didn't see the outside world for the first part of their life. And older kids got so used to being home all the time that when it came back time to go to school, they were like, wait, what? What?

We still do that? Like it just changed the whole process of like you being forced to go out and go to school every day so much that like, Again, that's one of those I don't think we'll fully understand for a while when it kicks in. Yeah. If you talk to any teachers about how the pandemic screwed things up, I mean, they will go off. I mean, it's truly amazing.

Yeah. No, it's crazy, but no, no, no, that was really good. Uh, oblivions, you know, videotapes being like this person that exists only on the media. And that being like the influencer culture. I mean, that's really true.

And people value more how you, You know, that's what's depressing the kids is that they only feel like value about how many clicks and likes they get, you know, for their online persona, you know, and the things that they do online is more important than the things they're doing in reality, you know? Oh, yeah. Well, and that is the only way that you have value now. Yeah. There is no, like, you being a good person or the things that you do in your real life every day. those don't really add up unless maybe if you shoot video of yourself doing it and then 10 million people like it, well then maybe it was worth doing.

But otherwise, why would you do a thing unless people are going to care about it? But I don't know. I've gone the other way because no one cares about the stupid things I do, even when I try. So I'm like, I, I don't, I don't know. Like, what am I supposed to do when no one cares what you do?

What are you left with? You know? So, You know, but on the other side, I mean, it maybe saved your soul that, you know, you've got, like, a niche thing going on here because, like, people are, like, so obsessed with, and especially, you know, people with developing brains are so obsessed with, like, getting likes. And, yeah, and really, their real life is just a way, as we were saying with the surrogates, their real life is just a way to feed their feed, you know, so they can get that. that dopamine rush of getting likes is really powerful for people, man. That's where I ended up because I don't have that.

So I'm just like, yeah, no one cares what I do. So then I was left with, well, then why do I do anything I do? Like if you're not getting that feed off the internet, like, It's like if you're left to be like an old-timey human being who just has to deal with their day-to-day life, why do you do anything you do? And I think it comes back to that. That's the core of anything, whether you're feeding it through the internet or whether you have to physically deal with people all day.

You have to kind of take away, why am I doing anything? What is the point of all this bullshit? And you better come up with that answer. If not. you're left with nothing. Right.

You're this dude at the end of the movie who's ready to kill himself because that's what you're left with. He's like, I don't know. There's nothing left for me. This is the way. I guess that's him going like, I'm going to be.

Yeah, it's always been a downer ending, but I mean, it's really him A, like, you know, you know, destroying his body to become part of the... algorithm you know i guess it would be kind of like uploading yourself into the to the net you know becoming like lawnmower man. Well that's what yeah because even cronenberg says like a lot of people take that as more of a religious thing of like you know is there something greater out there with or without me And like, he's like, yeah, I'm not really into that part of it. Like he doesn't really see it, which I appreciate the fact that he's like, yeah, I don't really care about the religious aspect of it. It's more of the technical end of it of like, okay, you're putting yourself back into the universe maybe, or the, the machine or like whatever it is, James Woods thinks he's doing at the end of this.

Like he's giving himself up to something bigger, but does it matter? Like that becomes the question once again, like, does any of this matter? I don't know. If you take yourself out, does it matter? I don't know.

We'll see. Here you go. Go ahead and do it. Because Debbie Harry's character, she's kind of like part of the Videodrome at the end. So she's, you can sort of see it as like, you know, if you want to be like where it was foreshadowing something, you know, Debbie Harry's like part of the waves, you know, part of the, you know, the cyberverse or the Videodrome-verse.

You know, it's just crappy. It's just crappy. I believe beta. beta analog version. Of it, but it's so he's, she's kind of talking him through how to join her, you know, weird. Which also makes me wonder, as I watched it again today, I was like, is she, is this version of her that he's seen even really her did any of that?

Like was the only time we saw her on the talk show and everything after that becomes his manifestation of her, his, his, cause it's all kind of, as we go on in this, it all becomes his point of view. Yeah. So we see everything through his eyes, which is why when he starts doing these crazy drastic things from his perspective, it makes sense. If you take yourself out to the other side, you're like, this is a crazy person, but like from his perspective, he's doing what he thinks needs to be done. Even when it's murdering people, you know, he feels like, Oh, this is what I need to do.

But again, from any other perspective is any of this real is anything he's seen real. Once he gets sucked into that video drone world. So even because it switches from oblivion to Nikki, by the end of it, that she takes on that role, she becomes his, uh, his connection to the video drone. So is it really her? Is it that person?

Did she go become part of the cult or was she ever part of this? Like did, you know, did they connect after the show? It was that part real, you know, it's like, or was all of this like, I'm infatuated with this woman. And then he manifested it all into his head. And then as oblivion disappears, she takes on the role and, In his head of all of, you know, she's leading the cult now.

So I don't know. Maybe it is her. Like he doesn't, I don't think he wants to answer those questions, but it is, it is interesting to look at it from that perspective of like, he's just introduced to this woman that he's attracted to. And so does he just use that as like, he needs someone to be the face of the Videodrome more or less the face of what's leading him down this road. And why wouldn't you want it to be Debbie Harry?

You know, it's like, right. Why wouldn't you want to prove, you know, Brian oblivion ain't nothing to look at. Debbie Harry, on the other hand, it's a good idea. I think I want to see her every day. So it's a more seductive version of like leading you into the cult.

Like, Yeah, I mean, yeah, it's very true. His brain is probably just rotten from, yeah, the Videodrome signal by the end. But, I mean, that's sort of the point that the Videodrome is trying to do. It's trying to, I don't know, but it really is a very conservative view. And I think even Cronenberg even talked about him kind of playing devil's advocate for the side that media is rotting your brain, you know?

Yeah. I mean, he's sort of playing with that. It's the kind of stuff, even at that point in his career was being thrown at him that like, you're making this vile, evil thing, this horror movie. And like, you know, you're rotting kids' brains. Well, so he's sort of playing with that.

He's like, well, what if this moral majority was in charge of everything, which is kind of what we see these days of like, what if this group of people that decides what we think is right, is 100% in power and can do whatever they want. And, like, that's where we get. Like, this is the world you're left with. For real. For real.

No, it's crazy. It's... What I really like about the moves of this time and the rubber reality and all the latex and all the. I mean, it's basically. You got the Muppets on one hand.

And. It's like it's like it's a bunch of really cool like puppet movies around this time where you got Jim Henson on one end and you got Rick Baker on the other. You know, you got you got tumors breaking out of the guy's head. But it's like all puppetry, you know. And and then they got E.T. where it's like basically a Muppet movie where the Muppet gets cancer and dies.

It's OK. He comes back. He comes back. Resurrection is he comes back. He comes back.

Right. Right, but yeah, it's just real interesting how we were so obsessed with super realistic puppets back then. I mean, because I guess it got better. You look at the only thing you had, like 70s really, was your Muppet type stuff. You had Sesame Street already kind of kicking in.

But, like, we didn't really, like, you look back at the old sci-fi movies where they're trying to do that, and it usually looks pretty bad. Again, I appreciate those for what they are, but, like, it doesn't really, it's not fooling anyone. Whereas, by the time you get to, you know, Rob Bottin and the thing, I'm like, okay, that might not really happen. Like, this might just be a mutant creature that came from space, and we're just looking at documentary footage, because that's some gross, visceral stuff going on there. And like, so yeah, it's like, I think we just hit that new plateau in the eighties of like, Oh, this stuff looks maybe not real, real, but real enough to suspend your disbelief.

Like real enough for you to get into it. That might've been a disconnect before this. I think that's part of it is like, it looks real enough that you're like, Ooh, I'm kind of sucked into this and repelled at the same time. Cause it's super gross. But again, for the weird kids like us, we were like, but I'm more sucked into this.

I'm more taken with it than, than repelled by it. Um, I would like to say also that the fact that these Canadian tax shelter, uh, horror movies that Kent Cronenberg was working on turned out as good as they did really is just a testament to like how good he is because not, not that these were not as scanners was the same way. And I think all of these, you know, they describe it in the DVD of just the chaos of, you know, you all, you had to wait till the end of the year and then all of a sudden the money is available, but you had to spend it, you know, within. Like, Before the end of the year. Right, right.

Before that tax year was up and that dentist decides he doesn't need to spend money on a movie anymore for his tax write-off. And so these movies were like total rush jobs and shot in the cold. What's so great is all his Canadian work at the time was all shot at the end of the year. So it's all cold and overcast and miserable. And it looks.

All his movies have that feeling of like, man, you just need a jacket. And it's like just got like such a wet, gross feel to them all that you just go like, man, it just adds so much to the atmosphere of those early Cronenberg movies. But the fact that the movie was falling apart at the same time and he's kind of having to constantly rebuild it as it falls apart. It's just amazing, you know, that. I think it's just because he didn't like, I think because he'd already done that a few times, he wasn't as worried about it.

Like he kept talking about trying to explain it to the crew. Like, well, normally in a shoot at this point, you don't have to like. go through this entire recreation of the last half of the movie, or I was going to shoot this, but now I'm shooting this because we just came up with this idea. So I think it's like, he seemed at home with it because it's just what he had to do to make a movie. And this movie was still kind of coming together as they went. But like, he's just like, well, yeah, that's the system.

Like I can't make this out of pocket. So this is my only way to make this. So, again, I had a cool concept, but I didn't really know where it was a hundred percent going. And they're just sort of cobbling it together as they do. It's like a workman's version of, you know, creating art of like, okay, I'm immersed in the middle of this and I still want to get to this end point. uh, what do I do between here and there?

We'll figure it out. It's like an everyday thing of like, we'll figure that out tomorrow. But today we're shooting this scene. The fact that the movie turned out at all is amazing. Yeah.

That it's this good is like impressive because it's, yeah, it could just be a mess. And like, to me again, some people might feel like it is, but I think it's a masterpiece of like, this vision of the future and like it to, to come together when you didn't even have a good start at point, you know, you had a concept basically, and then you're piecing the story together as you go. Like it, it is impressive that he's able to do that. Yeah. No, no kidding, man.

I mean, it's just like, yeah, it's, it's pretty masterful, you know, and I'm guess the thing he did, this was maybe the last thing he did before he really kind of went Hollywood. I'm, I think he did the dead zone thing. adaptation, which was. Yeah, which is still pretty low budget comparatively, but it's still pretty Hollywood, yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's a good movie, but it's like, it's not Videodrome. You've got, yeah, but you've got real actors, you've got, you know, you're based on Stephen King, like, you're pulling in, like, pretty big names at that point, it's a studio movie, not just skating by on whatever Canadian funding you can get.

Exactly, exactly, yeah, yeah. And so, I mean, I think looking at his IMDB right now, just to see what he did after this. Well, it's weird that he went almost legit as time went on. Like you, I mean, he's making like talkie movies and Oscar bait kind of movies. And like, like he's literally nominated for Oscars later, at least people in his movies are.

So it's like, it is one of those things that like you, you sort of polish him up as time goes on with each movie, he gets a little more respectable and, And then eventually he came back like you, that last, you know, again, redoing an idea from his early days for that crimes of the future, which is very Cronenberg, like is massively old school Cronenberg. But like all those movies before that, not so much like there's, there's a touches of him, but as a story, they're way more polished Hollywood movies than his old time Cronenberg stuff. Definitely. Yeah. They don't have that.

Uh, they just don't have the, uh, you know, the scrappiness. Yeah. They were scrappy movies. Yeah. And the dead of winter, uh, Canadian tax shelter.

They just don't got that, you know, um. Weird side note. This is thing. Again, I, I watched a decent amount of those like earlier to middle winds. And then I, I, skipped a lot of the more Oscar bait wins and I had watched crimes of the future.

I want to revisit existence. I have not seen that in forever. I do feel like that was the last real Cronenberg you in until you get to something like crimes of the future. But, um, the one I had heard about, but I hadn't seen was, um, spider. Have you seen?

I try dude. That's the thing. Like I, it was like when I kept hearing people reference and I'm like, Oh, it's Cronenberg. I'm going to have to watch it. And I finally, again, much like this one, I found a cheap copy and I was like, Oh, I'm going to go ahead and grab this so I can watch it.

And after watching this, I was still on that high. And I'm like, cool. Now I need to watch spider. And I put it in. I'm like, no, what?

No. What? I was just like, I'm like, I'm not going to say this isn't weird. This is weird, but it's not the kind of Cronenberg weird I was expecting. Yeah.

It is weird, but it is not what I was expecting coming out of Cronenberg land. No, I got, there's sort of his movies that just, I have no desire to see, you know, um, you know, I, I gotta see crimes of the future still. Um, but it's, it's definitely cool. Again, it's, it's a little more convoluted than most people again for movies now. Like it's weird that he came back to this crazy, uh, weird cronenberg body horror kind of thing that like because he'd done so many like again by the time you get to like the cosmopolis and a dangerous method like again dangerous method is so not the cronenberg we know you know it's like it's like So it's interesting that he comes back to like total Cronenberg mode for crime.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool. You know, and there was something there, uh, what map to the stars with Juliet more or something.

I never saw that one. Yeah. I, yeah, I just, I'm seeing a few of these weird ones that again, he just kind of works on whatever he wants. So it's like some of them may have been, cause they're even listed as video for some of this. So I don't know if he's just doing weird shorts and, straight to streaming or something for some of these weird ideas that he's like, I don't care.

I just want to get it out there. So he never really, again, because he didn't know big time movie, you know, director releases kind of stuff outside of the fly. It's like, he probably doesn't care. Like he seems like he just wants to put stuff out there. So I appreciate that.

I kind of respect it, but it's a weird format for somebody with as big a name as he is that he still just kind of does like whatever the hell he wants. Yeah. This one here, I'm seeing The Shrouds. That's going to come out in April. So, I don't know.

I'm on board for this. It sounds creepy. I would say, yeah, Cosmopolis was a weird one, but it was pretty good. But, I mean, everything. I would say, you know, he gets these little sparks of great ones.

I mean, I love Dead Ringers, and I was the weird... person in my friend group that loved crash when it came. Out see i saw crash in the theater yeah and like i remember like thinking it's funny just like a few years later you couldn't reference crash because everybody thought you were talking about that other dumb movie that won an oscar but i'm like no no the sex and car crashes went It said that on the poster. That was as big as the title, Crash. It was a quote that was like, it's a movie about sex and car crashes. That's how they build it.

And it was like, at the time, I remember just being so impressed with how committed it was to this world. Like it wasn't, it wasn't like a weird, like, Oh, look at these weird people. Like he was almost on their side of like, no, there's a reason why they're into this. And this is the presentation of their lives. And like, it was very unflinching and it's like attachment to these characters, even though they're weirdos and we know it, but like, It's a weird way to get your kicks, but hey, you know, whatever you're into.

Whatever you're into, man. Well, I mean, it kind of goes with the, you know, because of its connection to the. Technology, you know? It's like bodies and their connection to technology and kind of like how the technology has uh, both traumatized them, but also bonded them together, you know? So it's, it is science fiction still, you know?

Not even as much technology as just the mechanical end of it. Like a vehicle being like an extension of your body and like the, the people that are in these car crashes then have this like mechanical brace on their leg that they themselves are kind of mechanical. And you've got this cyborg existence almost by the time you get so many pieces of yourself replaced with things because you keep damaging yourself. Like, I mean, again, think about how many people, even since then, how good the technology has gotten to replacement of body parts and like coming up with these new amazing versions of like, you know, you can excel and be a Olympic runner now with no feet. It's like, we've, we've gotten to a point, like our, our extensions of these mechanical replacements are like amazing now.

Like, it's still not what you're looking for. It's not idealized, but like, it is a reality that like, we've gotten these mechanical extensions of humanity that are just part of our daily lives now as much as a Bluetooth shoved in your ear. You know, it's like, there's all these different aspects of these different mechanical and technological things that are just part of our lives now. Yeah. Yeah.

No, I mean, it really just makes me think like it's, I'm kind of like thinking about human connection now is kind of like, like, like, like retro thinking about it. Like re like realizing before the internet, uh, I mean, people were kind of becoming superhuman by the event of, like. Through technology. But even, you know, just at a very base level, you know, civilization is kind of like a neural net of different expertises. I mean, this is me just being very obvious, going like, you know, huh. people working together is kind of like the internet.

We are the connection of all these people and we bond together to create stuff like the internet connects a whole bunch of random circuits and crap. And you know, that, that works too, but, but we as people can be that connection. I mean, we're not anymore, but we could have been. Yeah. Yeah.

But like people like, you know, you're, face is kind of like the interface of like, you know, you are communicate is real weird. I've sound stoned or something, but it's like, you know, my face, man, my face is moving meat around on a skeleton. And that like expresses emotions that other people like understand. It's pretty deep, man. It's crazy, bro.

It's also pretty creepy when you stop and think about it that way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just moving meat on a skeleton. You're like, oh, now we're back to creepy visuals. Yeah, yeah.

Visual grossness. Yeah. I make these weird noises out of my face and everybody goes like, oh, we totally understand what you're... Let me make a weird noise out of my face and move my meat around on my face. And then you have to have matching weird noises.

If you go to a different area, they have different weird noises and they're not going to know what you're talking about. You got to find similar people of your meat. Right. And then like they can't communicate in the same way. You're using the same program essentially.

Yeah. So you can communicate. Whereas somebody over there uses a different program. They do their thing over there. So we got to get all together in this World Wide Web, we'll call it.

And we'll all connect and everybody will be peace and harmony all the time. That's it. Yeah, that's what I think of when I think of the Internet. Peace and harmony all the time. Yeah, I agree.

Not the dregs of humanity and the worst parts of humans coming out. That's probably a little more accurate, but hey, whatever, you know. Well, there's just no ability to punch somebody in the face on the internet. That's the problem. That's part of it.

It's the hiding behind your avatar. It's the, yes, I can say all these horrible things with my textons and with whatever I want to put out there, but I don't have to physically be held responsible for it. Yeah, there should just be some equivalent to being punched in the face. Yeah, you just have a big, just like a boxing glove on a spring sitting next to your monitor. And if you say something stupid enough, somebody else can pay money to punch you in the face.

They hit their PayPal account and Venmo money towards something that punches you in the face. So that's probably coming too, I would say. I would think at least then it would keep people. I think if it's not, yeah, it should be like something that's implanted in you. And if you are an asshole online, uh, people can pay money to make you shit your pants.

Yeah. It just like, it's just like a, it's just like a dog. It's like a dog. It's like when you're barking too much, it buzzes. And if you don't cooperate, it jolts the hell out.

I'm not going to, I'm not going to block you, but I will make you shit your pants. But I will zap the hell out of you. So if you're cool with that, keep. Running your mouth. Keep running your mouth.

That's right. I mean, maybe that's where we're headed since people obviously can't be held responsible for their own activities. So maybe you do have the internet police that come along and take care of all these problems. There's the government getting involved. That's what we want.

This is just becoming more. Overseeing our thoughts and whatever we're saying. Yeah. We've read all your search history. We're going to come put a collar on you now.

Thank goodness the moral majority is in charge and they will make sure you don't put that out into the world. We're back to the core essence of what's going on. Absolutely, dude. Yeah, no, that's crazy. The moral majority is going to take you down because you're just running your mouth about stupid things that they don't agree with.

Got to wait for the, yeah, you just got to wait for the pendulum to swing. And then you're going to talk about that stuff. And then we can shock the other side. You know, it's like, you shut up. You've had your turn.

Well, that's what it, that's what it is. And that's what, again, to, I guess, bring it full circle. That's what they were talking about in that 1983 interview is like, it's, it's them talking about who's in power at the moment and like what the majority stands for, what this moral majority in quotes stands for, because it's, before that, like they were all kind of complaining because they were showing too much violence and the violence was getting them like an X rating and like getting their movie shut down. Whereas, you know, just a few years later, the pendulum swings the other way. Then the nudity and the sex in their films was getting them shut down and no one cared about the horrible amounts of violence.

They were like, Oh no, violence is cool. We like violence now, but God forbid you show a boob. We're shutting down your movie. Like, so it's like, what? The pendulum is ridiculous.

Like, this back and forth is crazy. Like, we need to figure out something that makes sense in the middle. But, yeah, we don't really do that as humans. We're just running off gut instinct and fear and fear of loss of power and, like, fear that... I don't know, man.

I don't know. Society's gonna go flying off the rails for some reason. I don't know, man. It's... Pretty much, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, they're just... I don't know. It's just, yeah, whatever... Whatever you're getting in trouble for, give it five years and you'll be seen as something else.

It's not going to be a big deal. Yeah, if you get enough time, everything changes. That's true. That's what we've seen just looking at the amount of things that have happened since this movie came out to now. Look how many things have changed.

Come and gone and disappeared and new things taking its place. Yeah. New people with new thoughts and experiences and everything just becomes a big mess. That's true. That's where we are.

Just a big gory mess. Big gory gapping chest hole. Like the end when the TV explodes and goo goes everywhere, which did leave me to one of my, it leads me to one of my favorite parts of the discussion there when they're talking about the end, when they're trying to like, blow up the TV for the fake when he kills himself before he actually kills himself. And like the TV blows up and grossness goes everywhere. Of course they're shooting.

They're like the last day. They're like, look, we're shutting this down as of today. So whatever ending you're making, you're making today. And so the, the comment is, Where do you get innards at 3 a.m.? So like, we've got to load this fake TV with gross innards that look like human guts and whatnot.

So where do we get those in the middle of the night in Canada? And that these are the kind of professionals you hire to get you innards at 3 a.m. and make your movie. Guy goes knocking on the door on the slaughterhouse, right? Can I get some grossness things? Can you give me a couple of buckets of goo?

Because we're going to be slinging it all over the place. He's like, oh, Cronenberg, right? Yeah, I know that guy. Yeah, yeah. My mom lives next to it.

Yeah, I know that guy. He's in the neighborhood. We're all familiar. Yeah, yeah. Well, yeah.

I mean, it's just so funny. I didn't know you could go up and knock on the door of a slaughterhouse and they go, can I get a bag of guts? And they're like, sure. Give me one second. I mean, I feel like you can.

I feel like if you know the right person, it's all connections, man. You can get whatever you want. Yeah, slip him a Benjamin. You get a bag of guts. Ain't no problem.

And again, that is continued. Yeah. Just gotten bigger and more ridiculous. So now I think of the things I can easily access through the internet that I didn't used to be able to when I physically had to go get it. Yeah.

Versus now you can get whatever weird shit you want. You go on the internet within a couple of days, it shipped to your house. So again, we're watching this same idea just get tenfold of like weirdness multiplied. Yeah. Yeah.

It reminds me. Yeah. Now it reminds me of the, It was such a similar concept to the Day of the Dead scene where they had all the real pig guts coming out of the guy at the end who gets ripped in half. They said the smell was just terrible. Yeah, that's how it used to get done.

You just know a guy that works at the slaughterhouse. That's all you need. It's magic. It's movie magic. And that this is.

I feel like As much as we've dug into, we've barely scratched the surface on this. For real. It's a pretty impressive feat. I know plenty of people that probably would not even make it through this movie. So I get it if it's not your thing.

But if it's not your thing, I don't know how you made it this far anyway. Even if it's your thing, it's really your thing. It's really your thing. And you've got yourself a bucket of innards in the refrigerator right now. And you're going to go recreate it and videotape it and put it on the internet probably.

Again, there's this, now we can just find each other is the thing. Like in 1983, it was really hard to find other people that were into like buckets of innards, but now we can connect, you know, everybody can find their weird counterparts. So that's, if we've gotten nothing else from the internet, that's what we got. Yeah. Weirdos finding each other.

It's a good thing, people. Speaking of weirdos finding each other, that's how this episode came together. We would never have come in contact with each other had the internet not been invented. It would have never happened. Never happened.

And this episode and all of our other monkey jabbering videos would never have come together. Speaking of monkeys jabbering, I am terrified to see what the artwork is going to be. That's the thing. Because everybody hated it so much, I was like, So should I not use AI to make this garbage anymore because people are going to be upset about it? And I'm like, but it's the only thing I do with it is this one stupid project.

And that's the whole reason for it. So I'm like, I feel like I have to come up with something. I think some of them are pretty disturbing. And I think all we needed to add is like chest gaps. Yeah.

A nice slit. We all gotta have a monkey slit. Here we go. I don't know. You might get kicked off of Facebook after you post the art for this episode.

I don't even post them much anymore because nobody cares. So usually I just send it to you and go, oh man, look at this shit. You're like, oh god, I'm horrified. And you're like, yep, mission accomplished. Yeah, they're pretty cool.

So. It's mostly just for us at this point. Like our episodes, it's just for us. If anybody else wants to enjoy them, more power to you. But as we've realized, the internet's full of other people that don't care what you're doing.

We're just here to have fun and have conversations about weird-ass movies. I love it. I love it. It's good stuff. It's good stuff.

Oh my gosh. Cool. Cool. Brian, this episode needed to happen. I appreciate you pulling this together and everything.

And again, I feel like as a whole, as a real movie discussion, I don't know that we've done it. No. But as an overall discussion of what comes from this movie, which I think... again, for this type of movie is what it does. Like, it's not so much about what happens on paper. You know, it's like, it's not what you're getting from the screenplay.

It's like when you watch it, it brings about all these things in your head and that's the bigger thing. that's the bigger concept and what leads to all these kinds of dumb conversations. And again, I think that's, what's more important anyway. So that's what I was hoping from this episode. Yeah. Yeah.

No, definitely did that. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what makes it a great movie is that, you know, I feel like there could just be an entire ongoing podcast about Videodrome. And I also just like, also just like, I've seen it many times and I get something different out of it every time.

And so, because as the world changes and as you change, as you get older, you know, it is just one of those good movies that every time I watch it, it seems like I'm different and so the movie's different, you know? Yeah, I mean, from both aspects. Number one, it's so visually interesting. You could watch it and just find new things along the way visually every time. Yeah.

But even more so, it would be interesting to start with somebody in 1983 and then, like, just revisit it every five. 10 years and see how drastically different your take on it is just in that amount of time. And then fast forward to 30, 40 years and be like, Oh my God, like what has happened? So yeah, it's, it's that sort of impressive, you know, touchstone that like you can keep coming back to it and find more and more. Yeah, definitely.

Yeah. That's it. It's just, uh, it's rare that a movie can do that, you know, but, uh, the great ones do. So, uh, Yeah, man. This is up there.

It's an impressive film. Absolutely. Again, not everyone's cup of coffee, but hey, I'll take it for me. That's cool. It would be one where there's certain movies I love that I kind of got to know a little bit about the person before I recommend this one.

You know? Yeah. I mean, I do that with most movies just because I know my taste is different than the average weirdo on the street. So I'm just like, when people ask me about movies, I usually don't give my real opinion because unless they're my friends who I know their taste and I know that they like the kind of same weird stuff that I do. But if it's a regular old person and I don't know him that well, it's just be like, yeah, maybe I shouldn't tell you things to watch.

Like you just go find your, whatever crap you want. And like, leave my take out of it so yeah yeah i get. That yeah yeah you gotta gotta be careful sometimes. But i knew you were uh gonna be right on board oh yeah as i watched it i didn't even know that you'd seen it but i was like yeah we need to talk about this i'm assuming you have and i'm gonna find out as soon as i'm done with the credits here so yeah yeah yeah luckily you were on board and. Here we are here we are here we are yeah yeah absolutely i feel like When we did the Crow remake, we came to a good place, you know, but it was like pretty easy to digest, you know, and everything.

Because it was just like, is this movie as bad as everybody says it's going to be? And it wasn't. And so we're like, okay, that's the point of that episode. It's like, hey, maybe give it a try. You know, Videodrome, though, I feel like you're just kind of like a bug floating on the surface tension of the water.

And you just kind of make some ripples of it. You're never going to get to the bottom of it. This one is more of, is this movie as weird as everybody says? Yeah. Yeah, it kind of is.

And whatever you take from it. Is up to you. So you go and dig into it. And if it's your kind of thing, you'll know right away. And if it's not. you'll know right away.

Yeah. So I'm trying to think, yeah. What would be the point that, you know, this is a movie that we're not, I, it might be the chest slit. I don't know. It might be this, the, the video drone signal of like the one we get a whip.

You're going like, yeah, maybe as he starts watching that, you're like, I don't know. I'm going to watch this for me. It's like, I was, I mean, sure that Asian porn with the dildo was pretty hot, but now that we're beating people on the clay wall, I don't know. Yeah. I just don't even know.

Yeah. If you can make it past that, if you can make it past the first 15 minutes of the movie, you'll probably, you'll probably find. By the time he's like, stabbing her and piercing her ear and burning her with cigarettes if you're cool with all that yeah you know you might be okay with where it goes after that probably not but you know you could be. Could be i don't know i just don't know you know this crazy stuff you're in for a wild time. As was he that night on the floor that's.

Pretty much man pretty much jesus. Well, this has been a wild time. Thank you for coming along on this journey. Yeah, man. Absolutely.

And if anyone else out there joined us, hey, good for you. But if not, I enjoyed our conversation. That's all that's really important. Yeah, dude. It was great.

It's just what I needed. Connections made over the internet. That's what it's all about. Yeah. Weird.

Yeah. Thanks, internet. All right. Videodrome. Well.

At least this one we knew where we were going. Now we got to figure out what our next step is. Good luck to wherever the hell we end up next time. But for now, I guess we should wrap up the old. Videodrome.

Putting it back on the shelf. But I will revisit in the very near future, I'm sure. Because I've seen it like five times in the last month. It was for this most of the time and watching commentaries and extra stuff. But it is funny how many times I've put it in in the last month and a half or so.

So yeah, yeah, it's pretty impressive. So yeah, man, pretty good stuff, dude. Pretty good. Awesome. Cool, man.

Cool. Well, well, Brad, again, thanks for having me on and everything. I'm. Getting a, I gotta go make some waffles now. Well, I mean, that's what this is all about.

I think I'm going to make chili. Dude, chili would be awesome. Chili and waffles. Dude, chili. Freaking great idea.

Yeah, yeah. I'm going to make some waffles. These are the important things we do with our lives. That's it, man. That's it.

You watch weird movies and you make gross food and you eat it and it's awesome. Yeah, it's fantastic. It's the best thing in the world, dude. It's the best thing in the world. Alright.

So, hopefully you guys out there enjoy your own weird movies and go make your own weird foods. Yeah. We will return at some point in the future. Otherwise, that about does it. We will return next time.

Same geek feed. Thanks for listening. Thanks for listening. Behind the shutter door, between the tracks and the floor. I've been locked in and.

Alone, stuck watching video drones. Caught in a spider's web, hanging, whipping head. I've been locked in and alone, stuck watching video drones. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Behind the shutter door Feet retracting the floor I've been lost and alone Stop watching video drone Caught in the spider's web Hanging, whipping out I've been lost and alone Stop watching video. Drone Television can change your mind. If you're drunk, it can change your body. Television can change your mind.

If you're drunk, it can change your body. Television can change your mind. If you're drunk, it can change your body. Television can change your mind. If you're drunk, it can change your body.

We'll be right back. We'll be right. Back. We'll be right back. Your name on It's all so grimy.

It's all so grimy. I need some Purell. I need to hose myself off while talking about it. I need some antibacterial hand wipes. I don't want to talk about this movie.

And then shove them in my slit when I'm done. Pack it in. Pack it in. It's like a garbage disposal. Just keep shoving things in there.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, geez, man. That was fantastic. This episode is a production of Movie Meltdown, produced and edited by The Oddity Studios, with opening music performed by The Empires. For more on how to sponsor or support the show, email producer at moviemeltdown.com.

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