War

Weird in wea. Hello everyone, and welcome to the Bollywood Cinema Club, a show where we take a look at Indian cinema every other week. I'm your host, Christashue of the Culture Cast, where this show spun off from. On this episode of Bollywood Cinema Club, I am joined by my good friend. He joins me for the action movies.

It would see him or the action Jason movies, the Indian cinema action movies. It's quickly becoming an Indian cinema action movie expert. Your friend and mine, Mile Pale Dustin. Yeah, I can't get enough of it, Jans, I get it man, like we you know, before and after we do these episodes, we normally watch trailers to figure out what the next thing we're going to talk about is. And most of the time we're watching trailers for movies that are all in the same vein of again, like the movie we're about to talk about, twenty nineteen's War, because it's just I don't know, it's you and I seem to gravitate towards Indian cinema action movies.

And hey, that was kind of my intention with this podcast was to find each person maybe a little bit of a lane that we can kind of stay in but move around a little bit in. So we are finally at the end of what is currently all of the why are f Spy Universe films? We're gonna be talking about twenty nineteen's war So. The film is directed by Sidard Odd Non. It is based off a story by Aditya Chopra and Siddart anan Oh Sidard odd Und Jesus Christ Sidart add And it starts her Thik Roshan and Tiger Shroff as Cabir and Cadill Cadell Jesus Christ.

It's still oh man, I'm fucking up tonight with all the pronun Jesus christis in this movie. Yeah boy. The film stars her Thieque Roshan and Tiger Shroff as Kabir and Khalid, two men who are raw agents, or maybe they aren't, or maybe they are. There's a lot going on. We're gonna spoil the hell out of this movie.

I say that now because this is a movie. I think you would agree, Dustin, go in knowing as little as possible, possibly even don't watch the trailer because it's an action movie. But it's an action movie with a lot of twists, and there are some actually, let's walk this back, not a lot of twists, but there are two or three twists that are pretty good and they're not given away in the trailer and at all. And I think knowing less about this movie the better. So all that out of the way, because again, spoilers at the front here, Dustin, what did you think about twenty nineteen's war?

So you've heard of from like United States television, Mick Dreamy and mc steamy right from Gray's and Adam time about Patrick Dempsey, Yeah, and the other dude. I was sure, but this was basically Gamy and mc steamy of the spy universe. It seems like not that they're short, that there are more of them obviously, I mean sarcas im Bo, Daddy of my dreams. Yeah, but these two guys are gorgeous and there are lots of fighting, lots of shirts off that aside, the action was good. It was very Jean Claude Van like where there's a lot of flair, kind of almost dance to the fighting right which it has its place at work.

I was fine with it. I enjoyed it, but you kind of said it at the beginning there they're these spy universe films, and maybe it's just the Yashroj films in general. They love a good twist, they love a good double cross, they love a good triple cross, and I am starting to expect it now, but I don't know who to expect it from, so that's still the question mark for me. So I enjoyed it. Yeah, I think I'll say this much about the movie before we get too far into it.

This is with Patan as probably like my favorite of these movies. I think this might be my favorite because it has everything. It literally has everything, and there's one thing that maybe doesn't work and feels a little rushed, but I'm kind of glad it is rushed because I don't need another twenty minutes of a movie that's already two and a half hours. But oh yeah, all of that aside, this movie is a lot of fun. That's all you need to know.

All right, let's talk spoilers. This movie has the like two crazy twists in it, Like it's like there's no telegraphing the twist at all, like almost to the point where I was shocked. One of the twists, one of the twists exists to set the other twist up, the twist of Oh, this guy isn't who he says he is, he's somebody else with a new face that is meant to, I guess hopefully inform you that it's gonna happen again. Obviously I'm assuming for neither one of us did. But holy shit, the twists in this movie are insane.

Yeah. Yeah, it, like you said, it has everything and like it it's like a face off with John Travolta, Nick Cage and it's you know, did not see that coming the first time, didn't see it coming the second time? And this. Yeah. So, so we'll break down the plot a little bit because I think this movie bears a tad explaining.

So the film opens with Rithique Roshan playing Kabir, who is just like Paton, just like Tiger. He's a raw agent and he is tasked with killing a terrorist. Turns out, he doesn't kill the terrorist, he kills the person who is his handler. Instead, his handler is another raw agent, and that leads us down the path of Kabir is a trader. We need to bring in, bring in the team to take down Kabir, all right, who is that team.

Well, Tiger Shroff is part of that team of people. He plays Khalid, who is a man whose father was a trader who for Thique Roschan had to kill. Then for Thique Rochan trained him because hey, we get a two year before flashback. Lots of flashbacks, lots of actually flashbacks are one thing. Well, he intentionally leaving shit out is what this movie does with relish and I feel like it's almost cheating.

At some point we'll talk about it, but we have Kabir being chased by Khalid. But it turns out that maybe Kabir may be doing things for reasons that are more altruistic than John Abraham in Patan, but in a very similar vein as to the quote villain's motivation. In this movie, it turns out Kabir's not actually the villain. Kabir is has gone rogue essentially to root out the moles within Raw and it turns out in the twist of twists, and I can't even believe it works, but it works in a way that like it's earned, and it's beyond earned. It turns out that Tiger Shroff's character dies halfway through the movie and is replaced by the traitorous character who is the actual mole in Raw, because they disappear together halfway through the movie because Khalid chases him down and we don't see what happens, but we just see his body wash up and he comes back and this guy was part of the original Raw keem right, Yeah, But it turns out that that guy had similar surgery that we see later in the movie that the main villain would end up having to change his identity just like and die another day, which is totally what it reminded me of.

I mean, it's that same like Kinky Science, where it's like and you've got a new face and it doesn't better in whatever, Like this movie. Again, like this movie doesn't get weighed down with that, which I appreciate, but again, like it's drawing from things we've seen before, and wouldn't you know it, we essentially get a Crithique Rochan versus Tiger Shroff as a villain movie in the final act of a four act movie. But through the first, second and third act we're under the impression that Critique Rochon is the villain and Tiger shrop is the hero. And in the halfway through the third act and the fourth act. We are following critique Rochan as the hero.

So if that sounds confusing to you and you haven't watched the movie yet, shame on you for listening this far. Because this I can't I can't warn people enough that this movie is a movie you need to not know anything about it when you go into it, because you will benefit as a viewer from knowing nothing. Yeah, if you try to explain like we're doing now, trying to explain what's going on, you sound crazy, You sound like what were you smoking when you watch this, because there are that just many twists about it that kind of just make it seem a little chaotic. Well, it gets when we watch it. It works, like you said, it gets wrapped up in itself with all the twists and intricacies of what's going on, right like it really does.

And there are some parts of this movie that feel like cheating, like when we find out that caud Beer Couper knows that there are moles in the organization. There are conversations we did not get to see that are essentially taken out of the movie so that we can see them in the big reveal see and I kind of feel like that's a little bit of cheating. They do something different later with Khalid, where it's oh, you know those things that we're seeing, they like the character understands that there's a problem with them, but one the other character doesn't. Because they planned this seed of Khalid is unable to see out of his right periphery because he was injured because of his father being a trader, so he has a blind spot.

And later in the movie, the fake Khalid, so Rob turns to his right when he throws in the gun, and the movie to something interesting. It really focuses on that for a second, him turning, but it doesn't focus on for Thike Groshan's reaction. But it's insane to me how well the twist works, because it really feels like if they had done one more twist, I would have had a problem. And the amount that they did in the movie is as far as I was willing to go with the movie, do you know what I mean? Yeah, But when they kind of revealed the him turning to the right or like noticing the thing to the right, like that was kind of like me watching him, I'm like, uh, oh shit, did you read was that the scene where you realized it, uh no, is when Kabir like announced that.

Like when he announced that, like you know, you react to the thing and you're right, gotcha. I'm just like, oh, dang, what a callback. Like that's that's pretty good writing. That's a nice little detail. Well, and I like I like that they go out of their way to again like give you as the viewer.

They give you as the viewer enough to pick up the twist if you're being an active viewer. I didn't catch the twist because I was fully I fully bought into the movie, and so I wasn't sitting and like thinking, oh, there's going to be a twist, because that's the other thing the movie does a good job of like hiding that there is going to be a twist. I mean, there's the moment where Khalid is gone and he comes back. But again, the movie leaves certain things out intentionally that if they showed it, you might have a question. True, like Khalid breaking into raw to get the t tt X neurotoxin, Like they leave some of that out, but they could have shown it to kind of oh what's he up to?

But the fact that they leave it all out and he's It's played straight up until that moment is just it's a it is a masterstroke. I know that it does feel a little overwrought at this point because Tiger had it, Ton had it, this movie has it. It is a little played out. It's part of the formula for these films. It seems right.

Like I said before, I just don't know where it's going to happen. I'm expecting something. I just don't know where, and that leaves it leaves it fun well and it and again it makes it where I'm not expecting. I mean, I wasn't expecting a twist. I wasn't expecting the twist that we got where he had been replaced.

Like, it's just yeah that I didn't. I didn't expect that that was going to be the twist, right, because it's not that it's not a It is somewhat a sci fi movie, I guess. I mean that kind of technology is science fiction adjacent, but it's not a sci fi me. It's not face Off. I mean again, in face Off, that's the conceit of the movie, is that they're switching faces, but one of them doesn't know the other one does like and that here.

It's it's that's that's the secret is that he's not on the level, and we never see him not on the level until that moment where he hands him the drink. Yeah, but if you go and rewatch it and watch those scenes where he's interacting with Critique Rochon and uh and the little girl that's orphaned by Rochean Rookie, I mean, really, I don't know all to put it. I did not expect her to get thrown from the top four of that building. I mean, I mean that's I mean that's the first twist, right, I mean, that's the first twist of the movie. Is the main villain is the guy that Crithie Grochan sends his girlfriend Vonni Kapoor to go and get the information from.

And it turns out, oh, you're actually you know, the the main villain of the movie who the actor who plays him is given nothing to do, which is so hilarious. Rizwan il Yasi, like that character is like it's like a very it's either a light skinned Indian guy or a white guy, and I guess he's an Indian guy and like he just they don't he doesn't do anything. He just like looks e yeah, I not even like he looks like a dope, Like I think Rashawn would kill him in two seconds, Like you know what I mean, that's that's why Tiger Shroff's character had to do what he did, being a killed off halfway through. I will say though, because I mentioned to you before we started, like I have words for this movie. I don't like what they did with Tiger Schroft's character, like after he turned the fact that that's a component of the movie.

I just wasn't a huge fan of I was expecting more of a butting of the heads of the two of them, and it ends up being that sort of there's more going on. I mean, it more feels like they could They knew they couldn't sustain that the entire movie, so there had to be some intricacies to it. I just it feels like a little bit of a cop out, you know, to go back and be like, oh, well it was and him the whole time, even when you think it is like it's a it rings a little hollow, but it as a storytelling device, they landed it well enough that I am willing to just be like okay, fine, like give it a pass, but they had to land the twist as well as they did to really earn that kind of pass. The thing they got me was so the dude that was on their original team.

He was the mole and he's the one that switched faces with right, y y Yahsraj saying yes, so and so. Then okay, so now he's got Khaled's face, but it's still Sab right right, it's still Serbs training, it still Surrobs technically Bysique, just new face and he turns into this like ultimate badass at the end throwing Kabir through columns of concrete. Oh where was Sab before? Yeah, the like, all of a sudden, he's got super power. Yeah.

That the climax of the movie is just all over the place. The climax of the movie is strange because they're yeah, all of a sudden, it becomes like a superhero movie. And I'm not saying Baton was it, but there was some overwhelming strength happening into that series. Yeah, I think Rashaan getting thrown face first through like marble columns is one after the other. Yeah, I think I said to my wife, I was like, he'd be fucking dead.

It's like it's like brain in head would be essentially like goop. It would just be like, I don't know, like there'd be nothing left that could be put it this way, the columns would be cracking the way that they were in the movie, and following up he'd run them into the first one just be like yeah dead the end, like I don't know it. And that's the thing, like the way the movie, I don't know, Like I like, I say that this is my favorite of the movies, but then I think about the climax of the movie and I didn't like it. Yeah, I mean it was badass fight scene in choreography, I'll give it that, but it just took a weird tonal shift from what it was to kind of this like gritty kick you know, kick people's assing type fighting to whatever that was at the end.

It was just way over the top type fighting. And it's like in the WWE fighting games, you can turn on Finishers Unlimited and it's just two dudes hitting rock bottoms and a pile like tombstone pile drivers on one of the and then motherfuckers just stand right back up. No selling it. That's what it was like it And again like Paton wasn't like that. At the end of Paton, like there were stakes.

They're in that house, they're fighting on the cliff. He's getting stabbed with the knife all like any again, like a little more grounded. It's a little more grounded, we say about the movie where they were flying on jetpacks fight before, a little more grounded as they're fighting in the house sliding off a cliff, right, like we say that, but like even now saying it out loud, it's it's like the how, how the fuck is that more grounded? But it is like and I I feel like, for Yeah, as much as I like this movie, and as much as Yeah, I think I enjoy this movie overall a little bit more than Paton, primarily because we have two leads that are both very good. I feel like I like the second twist, It's totally earned.

But I don't like the way the second twist mutates the final climax of the movie, because I think everything past that final twist feels really rushed too. It's and here you go off the boat, and then the next scene we literally see Rathee Brashan show up and it's like whoa, Like he shows up before they explain or even give a glimmer of an idea that he could be showing, because the way the previous scene left it is he's dead. He's dead. Yeah, unless we know he knows that the poison is there, He's fucking dead and he just shows up with no fanfair. It's like they were missing maybe and look, I joked about cutting ten minutes out of the movie, but honestly, like the climax of the movie could have used like ten more minutes, one or two more scenes, just something to give us an idea that there is a threat and her deep Rashaan's not coming to say well here, I thought like when he was going down after drinking that I was like, oh, he's he's going to have like the anidote or he right, he lined his esophagus with something that's protecting him or something like Homer Simpson, he lined it with wax.

Yeah, and then he goes down. I'm like, oh, okay, maybe not Yeah, I thought he died too. Well again like not saying that the movie isn't doing the twisty thing, because it is. It's it's twisting and turning all over the place. But I don't feel like past the second twist.

The movie really lives up to the second twist real yeah at that so good, like and then it just kind of peters out. It's like twenty minutes of kind of Die Another Day. Yeah, this movie really coughs a lot from Die Another Day. They have like a if they have a chase on like ice, like just like Die Another Day, And before they reveal that it's not Khalid, I mean, I don't know if this is happening for you, but going through my mind, I'm like, oh, he he really is just like picking up his father's legacy being a trader, Like, oh shit, honestly, like it had me going, can I be honest with you, I think that would have been the better twist, So hear me out. So, if Khalid is the bad guy of the movie, he Forthique Rochewan makes a decision at the end of the movie to preserve the legacy for the mother that he was the hero, and it's you know, oh, you know, because again, let's let's play this out mentally.

He you know, has a moment, a redemptive moment right at the end, right right as he's dying, you know, because again we see this moment where Herthie Rocheam looks at him and he's on the ground and it's not him, but he sees these kind of like moment flashback moments of like what what Khalid was like in life when it was actually Khalid. That I mean, there's a moment where you can do with him just being the trader. It feels like, you know what, it feels like. It's like, you know the old joke of how do we get you know, like the house is locked, how do we get in there? And there's you know, we got the guy with the lock pick and he said, they're picking the lock, picking the lock.

Then motherfucker throws a rock through the window and opens it from the That is what the second twist feels like. It feels like they they it feels like they thought they backed themselves into a corner, but they didn't because I mean, they keep they keep sowing seeds that he is the trader. Yeah, that was leading me on. Well, the movie is leading you on, like it's intentional, and it's weird that that in and of itself is kind of a twist that that's not the twist, that he's actually the trader. Yeah, I think I think it would have worked better if he had just been the trader at the end of the movie, yeah, and just been like, oh, you know what I mean, I don't know what justification he would have.

What if you write that version, it's after he gets shot, takes the bullet for beer, and the bad guy you know, gets a hold of or whatever. Maybe you know, I'll save your life, you join me, or I'll get your money or whatever. You know, your dad's not really dead, he's my buddy. Oh yeah, you could have died. Well, I mean, you put two bullets in the guy's eyes, one blind, I'm dead dead, right, But but again, but again, you could have had it be where like his dad disappeared or something.

Oh that wasn't your dad. It was somebody else with his face. Oh my god. Yeah, throw that fucking thing in there again. Look, I I you know, we've we've spent a lot of time talking about the spoil the spoilery twist of the movie, and I think that in and of itself, like kind of should inform you how we feel about the movie in a lot of ways, because it is a big part of the movie.

Yeah, yeah, it is, like it is a huge part of this movie in a way that like twists tend to not be in movie anymore. No, it's a backbone of the movie until it happens. It's like, oh yeah, like in an m Night Shamalata movie, I expect it, like I know it's coming, and this I was genuinely shocked, Like it was. It was so insane that I I kind of I'm glad that I never perused this film's Wikipedia synopsis because if you scroll to the cast it says Tiger Schroff in a dual role, and like it's like what fucking what fucking dual role? Like what wait?

What role? So, like what the twist? Acide? This movie is so much fun? It is.

There is so much. There is so much really well done action in this. I like the fight scene towards beginning, when Khalid's like on his first mission with the team. There's that big dude that they're fighting and nobody can bring him down. Correct me, It's like Indiana Jones, like it was funny.

Well, and the fact that we have Kabir and Khalid fighting him and Kabir goes down and he like looks at Khalid looks at the guy, looks at Khalid looks at the guy and he's like, you go, you go. I love that there are those little moments in this movie because again, it it makes the twist hurt that much more because you get to see these, like, really the genuine moments of chemistry between for Thique Rochan and Tiger Schroff, because hey, they cast for Thique Roschan in this movie, and you know what, he said, I'm not gonna be in this movie unless he cast Tiger Shroff in it. And boy like yeah, because guess what, I've never seen before a Tiger Shroff movie. And holy shit, man, I'm kind of bummed. I hadn't up until this point.

He's he's a martial artist. Yeah, with with flair. I mean like he there's performance to his martial art. I said, he doesn't film. It's it's very visual and it works really well.

One like you said, I mean, it's it the the only kind of And again I'm not comparing his acting ability because I mean this he blows Vandamn out of the water. I mean most most people do. I mean, John Claude van Dam has a thing and it's not it I think it's I think John Claude ban Dam has gotten better as an actor. I don't think he's particularly known for his charisma. But Tiger Shroff, on the other hand, good lord like just a again just like Christique Roshan, just a very charismatic, genuine feeling to his performance in this movie.

And he's and and when he and he's menacing when he needs to be. But he's also very kind of down to earth when he's playing normal Khalid, not you know, dark evil on the face Kalid his better way of putting it, he did a good job of like they really sold the fact in the first part of the movie, Khalid revering Cabir, like he just looked up to him and like what he even says at one point like you're a god to me, and so you're kind of like sold on that fact and you're you really buy into it. And then when he does shift, like like you said, menacing in his face as his actions they all change like this pretty good job shifting the way the character did. Honestly, you know, even thinking about it with with the like you mentioned that the kind of shift in his performance in the final act of the movie.

Would it have been better if the movie had had him survive then and now he's just the villain in the next end the movie around, you know again, let him get away, and then we've got a villain for her, Thique Roshan in the next movie. Again. I know that's a little antithetical to Indian cinema because yeah, it's always around, right, I mean again, like, you know, the issue is the movie wants us to think it's Khalid who's evil at the end of the movie, and it's actually not. Yeah, but he acts like Khalid. Yeah, that's the tough part too.

He acts like him, and it's like, that's not he wouldn't do that, keeping myself that that was not and he keeps he keeps acting like him even though he's not him, and it's like, that's not how this worked. Not at this point, Like there's no point at this point for this to be the case. He should be doing something else, something more akin to how that character was Surab before he turns. But again, like honest, menacing, I mean, the question becomes then, is it would it have been better to have three big actors in this movie and one of them is the one who turns and then takes the face of the other one. I mean imagine someone like you know, aj Devgan, Amir Khan even like I mean again, or I mean again if you want to talk South Indian actors, I mean promise or somebody just somebody else.

So you've got three actors and one of them is going to replace the other unknowingly. But at the end of the movie, we have an We now have a character that has a distinct personality connected to it that makes sense that they can then go to as opposed to just kind of be him being evil Khalid. But that's not what's going on, and that's how it That's why I say it feels kind of like a cheat. It's a little bit of cheating, the cheating the logical nature of what you're trying to present. And it's hard.

I mean, I'm not sitting here and saying it's easy because you have an actor playing a character playing another character. I'm just a dude acting like the dude who does another dude like, I mean, that's what it is. I mean, that's what we're talking about here. That's the that's the level you would go to if you were writing the script. I don't know, I don't know.

I don't. I just it feels like a little bit of a cheap I do like the idea of him surviving and carrying on, because even it sounds like these Spy Universe movies are going to come to a head and you're going to have all these the hero characters all in one movie. Got three, right? How cool would it be if some of the villains were all in one movie too, Like, that'd be awesome, especially when you have ones like Khalid and well, Jim didn't make it diddy Jim less Jim had. There's less of a way out for Jim than there is for anybody else that we can see more or less, so he wouldn't be there.

I mean, what they're probably going to do is they'll cast another big name opposite them to be the ability. Yeah, maybe they're saving Amir Khan or you know, a J Dutt or I don't know. I mean, there's plenty of actors play of big name actors. Yeah, even get like someone. I mean, I don't know how believable Omi tab would be, like seventy year old man, but I don't think you would have him doing the action scenes.

I'd think you would have him as like the mastermind, veeled type, right, someone who doesn't have to get his hands dirty, he just pays other people to do it for him. But yeah, you know that's I feel like. And you know, again, we have a movie with a twist in it, and movies with twists in them are unique case. They always are because a movie like this, the twist is everything. It informs everything else, and so it changes, like we've said, changes the way the action breaks down, It changes the way you have to perceive the character when you watch the movie again, because I would like to watch the movie for a third time and focus on some different things that I did in the first two times.

But I do appreciate that we get an attempt at a one shot at the beginning of a movie with a tiger shroff that's total. I mean, you can stare there's a moment or two where you can see, yeah, there's a column or two that's put intentionally so that they can use that as the opportunity to cut it and you know, again cheat a little bit. But it reminded me of the Transporters so hard. Yeah, I picked up on that too. I was like, yeah, I like that, Like it just makes fight scenes seem a little more I don't know, visceral in a way because you have to.

You just have to keep going, and things just seem a little more aggressive when there's no cuts. I don't know why that is, but it just does. Hey, I mean it forces you and as an audience member, you have to focus, like you have to keep constant watch on the screen because it's not it's it's there is an intent behind what's going on, but it's a different kind of intent versus where you're having a you know, multi shot action scene where you're getting you know, close ups of the fists. And because again that's most of the movie, right like the dude I have thought about it a few times since watching the movie. The dude that hits his side of his head on the corner of the pool.

Oh, oh my god. Yeah, that first fight scene is so good. I mean, again, Tiger Shroff, not seeing him like I've mentioned, not seeing him anything else. If you watch that scene, you get a pretty good sense of what his gimmick, what his thing is right then and there, because again it's you mentioned trithik Roshan and I think I think there's more ballet informed fighting to his style than to Tiger Shroff. Tiger Shroff has some of it, obviously, but he is clearly gifted with martial arts and mixed special arts.

But like that scene is such a good way to inform you as an audience member if you've never seen a Tiger Schroft movie, this is what he's bringing to this equation. And it's every time he's on screen doing something, it's just he's he's so good. He's such a I'm so excited to watch another movie with him, and it I really am. Like he's he's so charismatic, and he's such a young dude too. He has such a long time to keep doing these kinds of movies because he's only thirty three.

He's literally the same age, and he's got like parkour stuff he's doing in the movie. And as long as that's him, I think it is. It looks like him. Yeah, maybe maybe they're not having him to do his own stunts, but like I kind of feel like they are. If you're that if you're that athletic and physically gifted, like as long as you've got a good insurance policy and everything's safe on set, Like why not, what did you think of for thiqu Groschan, this is the first Forthique Roschan movie you've seen.

Yeah, well, like I said beginning, like an Indian cinema does this really well. Anyway, everybody's just so hot. I like, I like, I I like the honesty guest, but like they are, yeah, and it's just like, okay, they had to downplay how hot for Thique Roshan is Enkoy Milgaya. Like they were like, hey, you need to like lose some weight. We'll give you baggy clothes so that the moment you flex your gun and your biceps pop out, it feels earned as opposed to you're just a giant, adult, ripped, yoked man, which he is in this movie.

Yeah. I mean he pulls off Knada, the war hero type guy. But he's also got perfect hair and you know, chiseled cheek bones and his eyes Oh my, oh yeah, man, dude's captivating. Yeah, he's he's my favorite of all of these Indian cinema actors. Like he's the one I gravitate to the most.

He has he has I don't know, like I like that, I you know, as much as we and we kind of haven't even mentioned the the Fani Kapoor character other than kind of cracking cracking jokes because we're little dickheads about it. As father Malone would say, but I like that he's the one who has a kid and he's a single dad. I like that. It's like it didn't makes sense. Like for whatever reason, it's like I see for thik Roshan and he has that energy and it totally works like it would it if it were some uncan it might feel a little contry because uh, it did kind of feel contrived in the last movie.

We talked about it with Tigers and Dye. It's like, I don't believe that these people like have a kid or need to have a kid and then adopted another one. But sure, oh right, oh my god, what the fuck? Man? There?

This serious all about adopting wayward children or killing their parents unintentionally. Yeah, it's he totally has that single dad thing going on, and like he could use that going to a park and like meet a new chick. Right, Hey, you want to meet my daughter who whose mom got murdered because of me? Yeah? God, I or should be fine, but she fell off a roof, right fell I uh I you know I mentioned at the top.

I was like, there, you know, there's one part of this movie that I feel like I could have done a little, Like I think it's the perfect amount. I wasn't even saying like a little less of the romance stuff in this movie is just the right amount. It's like fifteen to twenty minute. Yeah, and like he no bones about it. He straight up just treats her like an asset.

Yeah. Yeah, he's kind of like even if he did care for he was like, dam just doing my duty. I really just need to kill this one guy. Yeah, and that booty is part of this duty, so I need your hill. He gets hurt killed in a really like it's just like I don't know, it's we're laughing about it because like again, like he's like, I'll save you and he shows up and she's just dad like yeah, like okay movie.

I appreciate that about these movies though, that they have no qualms about just killing characters. Yeah, like even even ones that like again, like Tiger, the only other movie that you would have seen in this universe up until this point, Like in Tiger, it's like, no, you know he did she Katrina keV survives the entire time like not, it's not even a question, but here it's like never mind, so and hey we get to see uh, speaking of movies in the universe, uh, Ashutosh Rana is in this movie? Who plays Luther in Patan Oh yeah, yeah, yeah or Luthra, I guess he plays a Yeah, plays Colonel Luthra in this movie. He plays Colonel Luthra in that movie. So finally at the beginning, yeah, finally some connectivity, but no mention of Tiger.

They don't mention Tiger, which is funny. I was expecting like a mention of Tiger, just like an offhand dimension of Tiger at some point. Yeah, even at the end when he's kind of like positioning himself as like I'm not going to be in the system, but I'm going to be I'm going to be Tiger. I'm going to be doing doing my thing. I thought there'd be like this, like oh yeah, like like Tiger, you know, like you and Tiger, right, just like our well I was he expecting just like just like one of our other assets, like yeah, yeah, yeah, because I mean they've clearly established that this is part all part of the same thing, because now we have Salmon Khan and Rithi Groshan and s R K and who they add.

I'm maybe Ron beer Kapoor, Uh, the guy from Brahmastra. Maybe he'll be the next Maybe he'll be like the young because like Tiger shroff Is was the was like the young gun. Like that's the thing, like all the dudes in this universe are like established dudes. Because it's for thik Roshan, shah ru Khan, Salmon Khan. Like maybe it'll be like a Ron beer Kapoor like a younger guy.

But is that a little on the nose because he is the Bramant. I guess he's the Astra, He's the Agniostra. The big b is the bramanch. They need to bring him in as like a bad guy. I think Ron Beer KAPOORI is like that energy.

Yeah, I mean he kind of had he kind of had in that uh that romantic comedy we watched. He kind of had villain energy in that movie. He could pull it off. I yeah, I would be. I'm curious where they where they go from Tiger three and then Patan two and maybe even you know War two, because you know, for me, I what I enjoy about these movies, isn't the interconnectivity.

The interconnectivity is a bonus because we get to see other actors from other movies that are big name actors working together as these action hero characters. That's the that for me. It's not like, oh I get to see whatever the fucking Marvel stuff at this point is where it's like one minor thing from a comic book from forty years ago that only ten people care about is put in something. It's like, I'm more interested in the broad stroke stuff at this point, and I want to see big name Indian actors fighting other big name Indian actors in what is quickly becoming a very solid and I think quickly becoming I think it is a very solid action Felm cinematic universe. Yeah, and I am digging it, and they all feel very totally consistent.

I think the only one that sticks out is probably the last act of Tigers into Hide. Yeah. Yeah, like even it was like a bridge too far maybe, yeah, it was a little too sitcomy well, and it was also like it was also a little it was also a little too like attempt at being gritty, but oh yeah, the gritty card. I'm not begetting everybody's a happy family. Yeah, I mean I kind of could buy that because with the end of war being what it was, where it's kind of like schmaltzy and cute.

Yeah yeah, but that's a I mean, that's I again, I don't believe Salmon Khan and Katrina Keff, like those two having kids, Like, no fucking way, Like, I don't believe. I just don't believe it. Not that they're not good actors, not that they're like the move, not that that movie isn't good, Like it's just like, why does this need to be a thing? Like it just doesn't doesn't add anything. It doesn't add a dimension to the characters in any believable way.

But Prithique Roshan's character in this movie having a daughter kind of does. But that all all I'm interested in are the broad strokes of having s RK and Salmon Kan together on screen, or s R K and Prithique Roschan together on screen, a K three G reunion like that would be. That's what I'm interested in. Give me a little bit of that. And that's what Paton did, and I bet that's what Tiger three is going to do.

And I bet that's what Paton two is going to do, because it's less about these like constant inward spirals on yourself into weird things like Marvel is doing, and more just putting people together in scenes and magic comes from it. And that the simplicity to it, I think I really appreciate. Mm hmm. Yeah. And it works well with this type of action format because you can get a little too out of control when you're involving superpowers and complicated backstories and villains from comic books and having to hew close to things that people have been expecting for forty years.

Yeah, that stuff's exhausting. So here's a question if so, like Paton was like a huge deal, right, I don't know how big of a deal, War was a huge a huge box office you know it was this it's the sixteenth highest grossing Indian film of all time. Okay, so these movies garner a lot of attention. So do you think there's any value, like if they're trying to beef these up even more, like bringing over any actors from Western cinema, do you think that would ever happen or would they keep it purely Indian cinema actors? Mike white of the projection.

But then I talked about a movie that him and I were kind of kicking around on that episode, which would be Red Heat but in like New Delhi or Mumbai where you have the westerner coming to India and all of the kind of not quote hijinks, but you know, cultural misunderstandings and all of that's that comedy stuff or funny bits as one might say, along with you know, all the other stuff you expect, like all the rush hour red Heat style action, and like, I would totally be into that movie. And I'll say this though, like Indian cinema is very popular in India. American cinema. Indian cinema is Indian cinema, and it's huge in India because people in India and love cinema. That's part of the culture.

The audience may not give two craps about whatever American actor comes over. That's I'm that's kind of what I'm alluding to. Gotcha. It might not move the needle the way we think it does. And I don't think we're trying to be I wouldn't say eurocentric, but American centric, because I'm not suggesting that it would make the movie any better.

I was just thinking of the tie in of as worldwide. I think it would help me. I think it would help me. I think it would help put an interest in Western audiences in Indian cinema, but for me, tie it over that direction. For me, I want people to get interested in Indian cinema, not because an American actor had to be in it.

I just like, look, Triple R is the closest we've gotten to like a mainstream Indian movie making it into mainstream pop culture in this country. I fucking hate the Oscars, but I hope to God having not to not to performed at the Oscars moves the needle in the a positive direction for Indian cinema in this country, because these movies are so goddamn fun and they're so different and exciting from what we're getting made constantly in this country that even to watch movies from last year or the year before or the year before, you don't have to go back that far to find something fun, novel and exciting. But the further back you go, the more you get of just this fantastic cinema that we we have our own thing.

And it's great too. I'm not downplaying how great American cinema is anymore than you would but this is so different and so unique lee Indian that you can remove the americanness from American movies very easily in a lot of ways. And a lot of ways, American movies are made to be enjoyed by everybody all over the world. I'm not saying Indian cinema isn't, but Indian cinema is so goddamn uniquely Indian. That's what makes it so fucking amazing is how uniquely Indian it is.

Like you said that one time, it leaves room to be fun and interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well here is my thought was for a movie premise. You know, so these big threats have been thwarted, you know, with like the virus and things like that in like Baton and whatever. But so what happens is like this westerner shows up in India and he's trying to like run some sort of deal with the military or whatever it is. But it's like Ron Pearlman, hmm, okay, you know it's not like some big name, but it's something recognizable enough, looks nefarious and like he's trying to establish some sort of crime thing or big threat thing really need to watch.

You really need to watch Triple R. I do you know who the villain in that movie is, right? I saw it on trailer? Yeah, Ray Stevenson, Yeah yeah, yeah yeah. Like, I mean, you know what's funny is they cast a lot of British actors in Indian movies because British actors can play the villains, because the Brits are always the villains when they're in it.

It sounds evil, but I mean a lot of Indian period films are you know, set during the occupation. It's true. Yeah, yeah, you know, not everything is Baja Bali. But you know again, we've got they were the bad guys, right exactly. Yeah, so and Triple R they are the bad guys Matt movie as well.

So I think for me, what I really want, as someone who is, you know again as in love with Indian cinema as I am, I really do want movies like Triple R to be successful, Movies like a War to be successful without the kind of actor, not the kind that you're talking about, but the kind where it's like a Tom Cruise or you know, well, someone who's like globally recognizable. Yeah, I'm surprised it hasn't happened. I'm surprised we haven't gotten a Indian angle on Rush Hour. I'm surprised in a lot of ways. I'm surprised that it hasn't happened.

But at the same time, I'm glad that it hasn't happened yet, because my hope would be if it's going to happen anytime after today and into the future, it's going to be made more respectfully than it would have been twenty thirty years ago. I could see Wesley Snipes getting in a movie. I just I don't know who I would want to think about opposite someone like Ami tab Like what American actor. I don't even I would worry about being an American actor opposite some of these actors and being able to hold your own Yeah. Yeah.

All you got to do is see one of these movies and then see the response that these actors garner when they're on screen or just from their fans, and you know you're stepping into something that is very different we have here in terms of how they're being treated and received, and even in just what we're talking about. To be able to like what American actor could come up over and be on the same caliber as like the men and women in Indian cinema. Not like I didn't realize it until I started watching these thanks to you asking me to do this with you. Once I start watching them, like wow, these hit different. I like these and I mean the performances that everybody gives are top notch.

Yeah, I don't think I've ever had an issue with the performances in any of these movies. Yeah, it's always always something else. It's normally the plot, just like the movie getting wrapped in on itself, because I mean this movie does get wrapped in on itself. And you know, they overtell a story sometimes, Yeah, they reach it and a half hours. Yeah, like that's the thing, Like they overcomplicate a seemingly i don't know, straightforward story that they set up a way.

They set this movie up to be one thing, and they they went a different direction. And you know this like weird sciencey stuff that's been injected into war is in Patan. I mean, the thing with the jet packs, the thing with the virus in that movie. It's kind of a sci fi e virus, right, get a where he kills you like immediately type thing. You know, I know it's supposed to be was it's supposed to be smallpox, I think, but it's like so much more than smallpox, Like it was clearly much worse than yeah, so much worse than smallpox.

So it's interesting that they're injecting this kind of like weird science fiction y stuff or like heightened I guess, like science fiction heightened reality. Like it's it's not it doesn't permeate the movie outside of these like one or two little scenes or one or two kind of thematic elements, but it is there because we have a movie where a guy's face literally changes, and it's the explanation is more or less about as like lazy as the James Bond movie where they do it. It's like, well, something happens, but like it's not established that in this universe this technology exists, because you would assume if this kind of technology exists, there might be other kinds of things as well. But like this, this this universe, this spy universe, is more or less grounded in reality.

Yeah, and they just happened. The bad guys in this movie just happened to have the best plastics certain in the world on their payroll. What is it if god would make a mistake, but she would, and it's like, oh my God, yeah yeah yeah, with like you know again, like I think, outside of the twist kind of being this like big elephant in the room, you have the scene in Marrakesh that's really kind of tense and fun. You have the I mean, you have so many just like fun fight scenes between Kabir and a bunch of other people and Khalid and a bunch of other people, and then them together at the end of the movie where they're having the fight scene in the house. They're doing you know, they're doing a lot of really well rehearsed choreography.

And then there's the scene where Kaber busts into a plane and he fights people in a plane. That's like it's again, like such a crazy scene and it's a lot of fun. And you don't see that in Western movies very often. Like it's just it keeps going and going and going and going and going and going and breaking every convention of physics known demand over and over again. But I'm here for it.

Well, in in American movies, you see moments, so you're like, oh, it's bad ass. But then in these action movies, in Indian cinema, we seem moments and somehow they pull off bad ass better. Yeah, like there's such how they choreograph it or how they film it, or something about it's just better, the better ideas. I think it's the sensibilities behind it. It feel like I feel like in a lot of ways, the choreographed expectations of the dance scenes inform how the action scenes are shot.

Because you again, like with all these movies, well, let's take this back, maybe not all, but a large majority of Indian cinema have musical numbers in it, and those musical numbers are often very well choreographed, very well shot, very well blocked. I mean everything about them, you know, primo stuff. I'm thinking of this, the the the piano scene in DDOJ specifically, or so many. I meant, Hi has stuff, Kate three G has stuff. Plenty of Indian cinema films have fantastic musical numbers.

So wouldn't it make sense if they know how to choreograph that kind of movement, they might know how to choreograph action and and we see it because the choreography is dance like, you know, they're not actually hitting each other. So it is essentially dancing with a different kind of partner. But it like that, Like you were mentioning the scene where the two of them fight the kind of the big the big Nazi as one might call them for Mindiana Jones, Like that scene is so fun and so well choreographed and so hard hitting, and you're just sit and think to yourself, all right, like what do you got next? Like what are you gonna throw? Give me some melse go go into a plane and show me what you guys are gonna do with our hero inside of the plane, Like I just want to see more even what they do like and this is at the only movie that they do it.

In a lot of these movies, this type of scene has been there. In Paton, it was what the motorcycles on the ice? M oh yeah, here it was cars in the sand, I want to say Tiger one of them had a scene similar to that. Weren't they going down at I guess in the second one they were going down the hill on that thing well being chased in the wolves? Yeah yeah, yeah, but there.

But even those are danced like in vehicles and they do a good job with that. But even again with the vehicles, in Paton at the very beginning when Jim shoots the bazooka at the vehicle coming at him, rather than it hitting the hood, rather than it hit hitting the front of the car or anything, it hits the back left wheel, which is a choice, and it makes the physics of the car flips so much more violent, you know, a just normal like end over end. It's every which way. And it happened in this movie when after their race through the sand and kaber T bones into the church, like just the way it happens. It could have been through the front door, it could have been no, through the corner of the church.

Like it's a choice, and it just they make these choices of how these things play out, and they just seem more aggressive and more gritty. And and the thing is, I feel like, you know, in a lot of ways, the way I would describe Indian cinema to someone like an alien. If I were to describe Indian cinema to an alien, I would say, it's matter of fact, like in a lot of ways, it's just like this, you know, like you know, and some of the movies, like things just happen. It's like, well, what this isn't that kind of movie, and it's like, but does what does that mean? If what does that mean?

If there's not a meaning to this kind of movie or that kind of movie like and it's just, well, it's a movie that has action and romance and all kinds of things. We as Westerners have these narrowly defined rigid boxes. Horror cannot be horror in comedy. It gets to the point where on the Culture Cast, I've had the conversation about horror comedy and comedy horror being two different things, and it's like you're literally saying the same words, just out of order or in order depending on what movie you're talking about. Like, those rigid definitions seem a little less rigid with Indian cinema.

And you know what though, I love that about it. And you get audiences in American cinema that they'll watch action movie and if there's like too much of a romancy thing happened, that there's people like ah rash, too much kissy kissy going on. But Indian cinema has the gamut, It has the whole spectrum. It embraces it completely and gives the characters a scene together where they're able to profess their love for one another again in my and the next scene they're doing a flying knee into somebody's face, right, like in my mind, you can't. You can have both, you can have one and the other.

You don't have to just ah, it's just one. Oh, it's just the other. Like no, no, Like I want more than that this point. I want more than that as a film watcher, because I'm sick of these like narrowly defined expectations for a movie that I didn't come up with, that you didn't come up with. But apparently we're all so fucking tied to We're all so willing to give up our ability to be creative and unique so that we can fit into a box to find by somebody else.

And then other people tell you that that box is the only definition anybody cares. I don't. I don't think so. Skinnemer Rink was one of my favorite movies that we watched this year, and I have a hard time defining that movie to Peep this because movie to people, yeah, it's not a fucking horror movie, but it is. But it isn't, but it is.

And like the fact that something like that can exist in Western cinema makes me hopeful that we're breaking down the conventions of genre the way Indian cinema apparently did when the first Indian cinema movie came out. Correct, you know what I mean, Like, that's what it. It feels like cinema without limits in a way that all we sit and do is say, well, it's a it's the first Marvel horror. It's like there could have been horror elements in Marvel movies since the beginning, and we shouldn't have cared but yet but yet, nope, you know, my, my horror flavored ice cream doesn't mix with your action flavored ice cream or whatever. Like again, it's not even it's not even that one.

Don't put them in the same bowl. Yeah, fuck you. I'm so sick of it because you look at something like this and this has a little bit of everything. It is an action movie, but it does still have a little bit of romance, It has intrigue, it has a complex would I would say that the spy part of the movie is very much present. The spy part of the movie is where the twists come from.

I mean, the spy part of the movie is where the twist came from. In Paton and in Tiger, so maybe that's where we should be on the lookout for Tiger three and Paton two is it's it's only gonna come from like two or three possible characters, but it's gonna play into the espionage. Yeah, it's the espionage angle. Yes, I'm so glad, glad you're enjoying these movies. Me too, because there was a time when Bollywood first started being talked about, at least when I first started hearing about it, and I'd see like a preview of a Bollywood movie, like I'm not gonna like that, because all I would see is the dancing and singing, and I was like, I don't just I don't want to watch a whole movie of that.

But it's not that, you know, so anybody listening to this podcast right now, it's not just that they those those those moments in the movie actually become fun and are welcomed. I don't want to say break, but it's it's just kind of a diversion from what's happening, but still is part of the story. Like, well, the really good ones are the story, right there are some that are so again, like it's yeah, it's like anything else, like the American cinema. Not every action movie is great, and not every anything, and if there's no guarantees here that anything is going to be quality. So I'm I'm such I'm so glad that you are enjoying the as much as you are, because again, it's not that I worried, but I think everybody, at least in my mind, when they hear foeign cinema, automatically assume boring, Yeah, long drawn out serious even like this is this is more fun than a mission in Boscar.

Oh totally. And we've we've mentioned it before. I think people get turned off subtitles. But if you can listen to a book in a car, you can read your movie on your television, like, get over it. And I mean there have been plenty of movie directors who have said the same thing.

You know, if that little line of text at the bottom of a movie is with separating you from watching foreign and international cinema, you're closing off one hundred You're closing off ninety nine percent of the world and focusing on Yeah, like if you're if that's your focus is Western missing out on some good movies? Yeah, English only cinema, Like good you know what, if that's going to be your focus, then you deserve to miss movies like this or Patan or Tigers Into High or any of them. Orally, you deserve to miss out because if you're unwilling to make a slight compromise and I'll only watch it if it's dubbed, they're never gonna dub these movies. And they shouldn't have to dub a movie for you, as a Western for you to be able to watch it.

You shouldn't have to force people to do that. Sorry. And how many Western movies feature a Nazi speaking German that gives you subtitles, so you know what the nazis saying. Yeah, you know, yeah, people people like to people like to make make problems, people like to be paid. Yeah, but you know what, we went and saw Paton in theaters, so maybe there is hope.

Maybe there is still hope. So I guess this is this is it for the the YRF Spy universe for the for the foreseeable future until Tiger three comes out here. Now, yeah, my hope is that we get to see Tiger three in theaters. I think we might. I mean, if Paton came out in theaters, there is a distinct possibility that we'll be able to go see Tiger three and report back to the listeners all about probably yet another totally awesome wirefs PI universe movie worthy because even even with Tiger two, and I think you'd probably agree Tiger two is the weakest of the four.

Yeah, yeah, so far, even with Tiger two having its issues, I still enjoyed these movies a lot more than say something like a Mission Impossible or it's equivalent in the United States with Western cinema, Like there isn't really one yet because nobody's done that. But I guess Mission Impossible is as close as we have or James. But I mean, these movies have been a lot of fun, and I'm very excited to see what Tiger three is and Paton two and wherever they go from here. I'm completely on board, and we've said that so many times. At some point somebody's going to tell us we said it too many times.

But that is not today. So dustin final thoughts on War, I don't know what else their is to say, but yeah, it it hit like Paton did. Like you mentioned, it's got everything, It's got two new actors that I haven't seen in anything yet, and I enjoyed their performance and what they brought to it, and now I want to see you know, we talked about some of their movies that they're in before we started recording, and now I want to see those because you were so good in this. So it's just it's like every time we watch one of these we see an actor and I want to see what she's in or he's in, and just keep exploring more of these movies. So that's my thoughts on this movie.

It's I liked it, I would I'd probably watch it again, and now I want to see what else they're in. Yeah, I know, I'm I'm one hundred percent with you. You know, as as someone who has has seen for Thique Roshan films but has not seen any other Tiger Schroff movies. You know, he is a really interesting actor and what he brings to these movies is a lot of fun, and especially this movie. Clearly, like you said, we watched trailers for some of the other stuff and this seems to be his like his thing, So I am super duper on board for whatever comes next.

I think, you know, we've got possibly for Thique Roshan. Now how you've seen for Thique Rochan. For Thique Rochan is the actor that may play the big villain in Brahmastra. The guy who's teased at the end of the movie may be for Thique Rochean. That's who they were mentioning as a possible actor, which excites me to know when.

But now it gives you kind of a kind of frame of reference for kind of who he is in this world. But yeah, this this movie's a lot of fun. It's it's the most fun I've had in a while, probably since Batan in terms of like an action movie that kicks ass and just it go. Like you said, these movies just go for it in a way that is so refreshing and exciting and just makes me want to watch more. And I've I was talking with someone about this this podcast, like it might it's it's a bi weekly podcast.

I've recorded thirty episodes since October. Wow, I've spent so much time watching Indian cinema that it is more or less what I watch on a daily or every other day basis for the last eight months. So I'm in it, and I'm I'm not going anywhere, and I know that you're in it and you're super excited just like I am. So until the next time you hear Dustin and I, you can find us over at weirdingwaymedia dot com. We'll redo episodes of this.

Dustin provides the album artwork for the scary stories we tell show. He was on there once being a big old stick in the mud, the skeptic, but hey, I still love him, and so it's well, we all have our fault. But that's where you can find Dustin, And you can find me here and on so many other shows over at Weirdingwaymedia dot com. As for this show, Bollywood Cinemaclub dot com, Bollywood Cinema Club, wherever you can find it, like rate and review the show, Tell your friends, tell your family, because hey, Indian cinema's going to be a thing for us Westerners. It should be already.

I'm doing what I can to ferry us across. Get more people on the boat every time, because the grass truly is greed and folks. So Dustin, thank you as always for joining me. It's it's always a lot of fun to sit down and watch one of these movies plies and as always, well we'll catch you on the next episode. H