TPBxKC: Indiana Jones and The Dial of Destiny

We're three two one. Welcome to the final chapter of our reading of the Lost Ark series aka a crossover between the Projection Booth and the Culture Cast. I'm one of your hosts, Mike White the you know me me, though you may know me as Lawrence Caston. Joining me, of course, is mister George Lucas himself aka Chris Dasher. It's like poetry rhymes, and of course Steven Spielberg aka Andrew Rausch.

Hey, what's up. There's Steven Spielberg in the room, right, mister Spielberg. I've got many questions for I shall answer them all. We are wrapping things up with the discussion of Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny. I'm retiring.

Well, in that case, what are we drinking? Same for the god daughter. Dad told me you found something on a train during the war, a dial that could change the course of history. Why are you chasing the thing that drove your father crazy? We'll move Why he's get out of here.

Stop sorry, doctor Jones. Get him? Yeah Itler made mistakes, and with this I will correct them all. You stole it, then you stole it, and then I stole it. It's called capitalism.

Give away till she built. There might be so twiblets. You've taken your chances, made your mistakes, and now a final triumph. Indiana Jones A few times in my life I've seen things. We're being tortured with voodoo.

I've been shot nine times, once by your father. Ah sorry, I've been looking for this all my life. This film has all of these folks credited as writers, Jazz and John Butterworth, David Kepp, and James Mangold, who also directed the film. Mangold has a real knack for looking at older characters at the end of the run, as he's almost doing a for Indiana Jones did for Logan. This film tells the tale of Indiana Jones finding an artifact that may change the course of history.

But that's kind of all of his always his thing. We're going to be spoiling the heck out of this movie. So we're going to be spoiling the heck out of this movie. So if you don't want anything ruined, turn off the podcast and come back. Don't be like the jackass who posted spoilers on my Twitter feed the day the movie open.

So let's go ahead and start at the beginning and work our way through this thing, and we've got our extended James Bond type opening with the d aged Harrison Ford. And yeah, Chris, I think you're a big fan of the d aging process. You know, if you want to make your movie feel like a Marvel there's a really easy way to do it. Step one d aging actor, in this case Harrison Ford, because you know, thankful, you know, we just watched Blade Runner twenty forty nine, no d aging there. The reluctance of Harrison Ford to come back is felt not only in the role, but also in his appearance here.

I'm assuming he was reluctant to come back. Maybe not. He seems to be enjoying himself on this kind of last hurrah with Indiana Joe. But you know, I we kind of knew it was coming. There had been kind of whispers of like there was someone wearing an Indiana Jones mask writing a motorcycle at one point, like a young Harrison Ford mask.

And then you know, again, like we've seen this technology in the Marvel movies so much now that it's kind of commonplace. I mean, the grandmof Tarken thing in Rowe one being another case but that's also a Disney thing. It's just never been this prolonged and pronounced. And again, I felt like the character that Malcolm McDowell plays in The Clockwork Orange. It's like holding my eyes open because with grandmof Tarke and you can look away and it's like a minute.

With this, it's like, am I gonna do? Go get a bucket of popcorn? For thirty fucking minutes? Like again, the action and everything else aside, just I didn't want to look at it because it's not. It's varying degrees of quality, but most of it is below what I would consider to be worth showing, at least for twenty five minutes.

Any what did you think? So I'm gonna be the odd man out here. It wasn't as bad as I thought it could have. You know, there were times I thought it looked really good. Um the eyes are that's the bad part.

The eyes always looked dead, no matter, but they look funky. But uh, you know, I thought it was better used than the Irishman. I was one of the people that didn't hate the Irishman, but they hate They still walked around like old people. I thought that this was one thing that they did better by using you know, in the in the action scenes, using a body double at a distance, and not having an eighty one year old man hobbling around on top of a speeding train. I don't know, I didn't hate it.

It was a lot more than I had expected. I mean, it was a lot, but I don't know. I mean, it wasn't one of the part parts of the movie that I hated the most. And I know a lot of people do, but hey, I'm fucking Steven Spielberg. You know I could do what I want and what it didn't.

But it didn't bother me that much. Like a Robert Downey Junior and tropic thunder thing here, like I'm not character until breaking character. That's right. You mentioned you mentioned that they used a body double. There are a couple of shots where they clearly didn't.

And it's old Harrison Ford and you mentioned the body double, and the voice is the other thing, like it is him doing old man Indiana Jones in a young body like Disney hire somebody to help with voice modulation or get an impersonator or something, because if you're trying to sell forty four, you're not successful in that regard. And they put in all this other effort to do it. It seems kind of strange. They just be like, well, nobody can do India's voice other than Harrison, and it's like, other than all the times in video games that right, he did it? Like what why?

I don't know, Like it feels like a video game enough, why not just go whole hog? It seems a little strange. I didn't mind it either in certain places, but when there's a lot of action, like when he's swinging around on the rope by his neck and stuff, I was just like, oh yeah, or were they flash alight in his face? At one point? I was like, that just doesn't look right.

The way that the skin looked or something just looked a little wrong. I mean, we weren't living in the Uncanny Valley, but there were a lot of things where it's like, oh, okay. But the thing that I did enjoy and I don't know if they d age Mad's Michelson, but if they did, it wasn't very pronounced, and Mad's Michelson not as old as Harrison. He almost looked like the same fucking guy he did, like the same fucking guy, but with shitty, shitty blonde hair, like, well, I don't know the real problem for me, and I know I'm jumping ahead, is he gets I would think he gets half of his head caved in by thing. How does he how does he not have a well, how does he not have a star?

Just like I thought there's a long star when we first see him and they're talking to him when he comes back right like, there's a long scene where he's got his head turned and I thought he's gonna turn and we're gonna see this, you know, uh crazy scar like you know the guy and raiders have lost art or there's gonna be something, you know, and it's nothing. It was just he just looked like the same fucking guy. Yeah he's Mad's Michelson with gray hair and a few brinkles. Yeah, same. He's a superman thing know, they talked about the Hitler wanted the Nazi Superman.

Maybe he was one of them. I don't know, but it was weird. Yeah, the super series why he recovered so quickly, that's right. Yeah, I like that they threw us a bone, us being the three of us here by talking about the Spear of Langinis and having the you know, the original mcguffin that George and Phil were talking about all those years ago. And I also liked that they determined it was a fake right away, right away.

I haven't say the Dial of right, I'm not going to try to pronounce whereas I mean, yeah, I mean, I know I have at least two atheists on this call. So the Spear of long Guinness, who knows if that was really a thing, who knows if Jesus was a real person, all this kind of stuff, But like, you know, all the mythology that goes along with the spear, all the stuff that goes along with the Arc, with the the cup, you know, the Holy Grail, right, and then the shan Car stones, No, the other than al Aram. Nobody really wanted those for much of anything. And then Moram, what's he wanted? He's just like, oh, when we get all these, we have power.

And I'm like, okay, great, but you know this is a real item. We're playing with real history here, which is just an odd turn for Indiana Jones because so many of his adventures mix science with with mythology, and now it's like pure science, but then taking the pure science of the Dial and making that into a mythological thing with time travel? Right, Hey, I do want to throw one thing in here. You mentioned that about atheists. I really am Jesus, I'm Steven Spielberg.

That's how I do what I do. So and I want to throw in when I make ET two, we're gonna d age ET. So I just want to throw that in there. And so, hey, I mean, why didn't anybody figure this out before? That's I'm fucking Jesus?

All right? So go ahead? Sorry? Can I mention you know, because you mentioned James Mangold already, But before we get further into this movie, I want to just ask, like just a general question, does this movie suffer from not being directed by Steven Spield Well? I think Steven would say yes, of course it would, God damn it, of course it would.

Okay, not addressing you Andy as Steven Spielberg, but you as Andy. I mean, is does this movie suffer from not having the Spielbergian touch to it? I don't know. I don't know if he's got that same touch now. I think he does really good with big, grandiose movies now, but I don't know if an action movie is really going to be his sporting anywhere.

I don't know, thoughts, mister Wyant. I don't know if it would have made a difference for me. So much of the movie is about the script, and you know, obviously we talked for six hours about the script when it came to Raiders, and just all that tinkering, all the stuff that went into it, all the things that were good, all the things that were bad, all the things that got pulled out into other things, and there's you know, of course, as I'm watching this movie, I keep thinking about our script conversation and just like looking for little things that they might have still kind of kept alive after all these years. Yeah, I don't know if it really would have mattered had it been Steven Spielberg in the director's chair, or if it would have been better if it was Lawrence Casden behind the typewriter.

The one thing that I think might have been different, though, was the editing, because it felt like this film, even though it wasn't like super flabby, I felt like there was some flab to it. And I can't say specifically, it was just in the second half, and I don't want to go into that, but it's just right just yet. But it didn't feel streamlined enough. There was a point later on in the movie where you know, I'd have been looking at my watch if I'd have had one. I mean, it wasn't bad, it didn't feel long, but it just and even though we were getting a lot of action.

I can't say what it was, but it felt draggy a little in the final third. So if I had been there, if Steven Spielberg had been there, I think I'd had a little more control in the editing bay and would have been smoother. Well, it wasn't Michael Kahan. It was three editors. It was Andrew Buckland, Michael mccustom and Dick Westerveldt, three editors for this.

I think the problem was not enough editors and not enough screenwriters, you know what I mean. Like and also, why didn't we have nine directors? You know, if we're gonna have nine people at every other job, why not nine direct We could have had like a big committee of fucking directors. Could have had Spielberg and Mangold and Lucas, all of them all, and Frank Marshall could have come on in and you know, done his you know, a rackmophobia thing. We could have had it pull out a Weijia board and get Bogdanovich on the horn.

I mean, all right with the spiritual stylings of Peter Bugdanovitch. Right, we could have made it just like What's Up? Doc? Or Last Picture Show? It would be great.

Yeah, you know one thing that bothers me if they took this in there real quick, we're talking about the train scene. When that's worth of b aging. Do you know what I'm really really sick of? And it was fun once upon a time, and maybe it would have been fun once in this movie. But the thing where he's ever on like some speeding train, speeding car, speeding fucking anything, and his head is being held off and then oh my god, there's a big thing coming his face and then he moves his head and we never think the Indiana Jones's gonna lose his head.

It's never a real fear. But they did it I think about four times in this movie, Like that is fucking overkill. Well that and putting his head in a bag. You know, his head is in a bag at least twice, if not three times in this movie. Well, maybe they could have done that instead of the aging.

Then you wouldn't have the complaints. He could have just had a bag on his head for twenty I mean, I mean, as far as I'm concerned, that would have been a better option. I still know it's Indiana Jones. Just cut out the eyeholes, right, do it? It's Mic frozen to bring my mask, Mike, just so you know, you're you're you're, you're freezing a little bit as he's as he's just quen.

Yeah, of course I'll go ahead, and I'll yeah. I don't know why it says my internet connections unstable, but it was fine before. For fuck's sake. Um, with the thing with the motorcycle in the train, I was and they were going to do a super cop thing and have him shoot the motorcycle onto the train. It's like, we get so close to having big stunts in here, but then we don't.

You know. It's it's like we're in the age where we have seen so many of these spectacular stunts, whether they're done for real like a Jackie Chan would do, or whether they're completely CGI. And I would say all of the stunts in here seemed like they're very CGI, which is a little sad, you know. And I will be honest, I kind of got fatigue from some of these probably in films, because it was, Yeah, I kind of I kind of was not a fan of the action in this movie. It seemed like overkill when it was happening.

The chase scene went on and on and on and then on some more, and then on and on, like they would take a corner of zoom zoom in the little cart and shit, And then I felt like that was never going to end. And when I was watching John Wick four and he kept going up the fucking steps and back down and up, I thought that was going to get hit in this way. But I mean it was okay, it was workable. This shit just kept going, and I thought the rest of this movie, like the next hour is just going to beat them driving around in his fucking car going down streets and little alleys. Thankfully that wasn't the case.

It was only like a quarter of the next hour. But I'm gonna watch that movie. Just get him driving in a circle and they just make a loop of that fifteen minutes and just some Keystone cop shit I'd watch right. Yeah, I mean, between the chase in New York with the horse versus the motorcycle in the car and then the Tuck Tuck chase. I was just I was chased out.

I was like, okay, in one he's chasing and the other he's being chased. I'm just like, okay enough. And by the way, going back to that train of fight, I get thinking of top secret. When the Nazi comes out of the smoke of the train and he's there and he's ready to fight Indiana Jones and there's a bridge that comes. I was just hoping that he would stand there and the bridge would collapse underneath, would break around him.

I mean, it would have been more compelling than what we got because for me, look, the original three Indiana Jones movies are of a piece. They are their own thing. I think I think that these two movies have more or less confirmed that those movies. One was obviously Lightning in the Bottle. Two is my favorite, and three is the favorite of many, and it is the third.

One is very different than the first, and the second is very different than the third, but they all feel of a piece. Four does not feel of a piece. It feels like its own thing, and five really feels like its own thing. And this opening is it sets that tone because it just lets you know, like a it's not gonna be what you think. It's going to be, like a flashback thing that everything does now anymore.

It's like, we're gonna show you this thing that you didn't know about. We're gonna retcon. It's kind of a retcon. It's a very lazy retcon, but it's a retcon none nonetheless, because again, oh, now he had a god daughter that's never been mentioned in all these wouldn't be convenient if he had a son, and we'll talk about that, right. But it it sets the tone in a way that the openings of the other movies kind of did as well for their respective movies.

I just think the tone of this movie is check your expectations at the door. This is not your mom and Dad's Indiana Jones movie. This is very different in a lot of ways. This is kind of what Ryan Johnson was trying to do with that Star Wars movie, and he varying degrees of success based on the person. But this, in the very same way feels like I want to do my own thing that's not Spielberg, with a character that is in the kind of pop culture pantheon and Mangold does his own thing, that is for sure.

For me, the tonal stuff really becomes a challenge once we moved to the present, once we moved to August of no, sorry, July of nineteen sixty nine, No, it's not July. It's August of nineteen sixty nine. That's right. It really changes tone when we moved to August of sixty nine and we get the Beatles music, we get him interacting with the hippies, We see the shiphole apartment that he's living in, we get to see the picture of Marion, the divorce decree that we have going so we're introduced to the there's trouble in Paradise type of thing and then him going in and of course he has to be lecturing about Archimedes on that particular day. So yeay, us so here's oh my gosh, yeah, we are just we're putting in this exposition right here.

It happens to also be moon landing day. We have to go right for all of the iconic shit and what are the odds of any of this? Right? And I know it's you know, I mean, the last movie had UFOs and it's so who gives a shit? And this one has travel, so we know we're not going for realism, but it just also happens to be the Moon travel day.

And the music that's loud that he's hearing is the Beatles. It just has to be something that's so iconic that we hear today and not one of the eight hundred groups. They were listening to a nineteen sixty nine that we no longer here today. And it's just or even the thing, the little little shit like where the picture of Marian is on the fridge and this is the first day forever that he puts the sting on it, or does he do that every fucking day? I don't know, but it's just it just seems so convenient.

And maybe this is a ridiculous bitch, but it's just I hate that. That feels lazy to me. It's very lazy. Even the thing with his retirement party that happens at this school. This was the craziest day everything happened.

Yes, yes, And then how does he not notice by the way that his god daughter is sitting there in his last lecture, she talks, He talks to her, but he doesn't know who she doesn't He doesn't notice she's not one of his students, right, Nor does he notice the African American lady that's sitting right next to her, right? Is she the pr African American woman that we've got I think all of these movies and she's an African American Nazi? O? No, she's CIA. Oh, but she was working for the Nazi guy, right, like right?

Yeah. The whole thing is the CIA, you know, very project paper clip and nothing against her and plenty against Nazis, but it just seems like somebody the Nazi would not have really dune working around because they weren't real big on women or African Americans or basically anyone that wasn't blonde haired, blue eyed. I mean, the whole thing with the CIA working with former Nazis, it is very project paper clip, and you know, they don't mention the jet propulsion that. But the whole idea of we're gonna get all of these Nazi scientists and it was ironic that I saw a trailer for Oppenheimer before this. I was like, We're gonna get all these Nazi scientists to come on over here, help us out with our stuff, and yes, help put people on the moon and mes Michelson is one of those guys.

Somehow he turned from archaeology into a rocket scientist, I suppose, or maybe he was some Verna von Brown type person over in Nazi Germany. And for me, you know, you're mentioning how Nazis wouldn't like having a woman African American woman around the only time that Matt's Mickelson comes off as a dick is when he is confronted with the African American gentleman who brings in his lunch or his breakfast and he says questioning like, where did you come from? No, I really mean your people, and he's just kind of being a real asshole about stuff. But for the rest of the movie, I'm like, I'd rather hang out with Matt's Michelson than I would most of the other characters in this film. When he says you thought for your country, didn't you?

To the African American guy, did I miss something like? How did he know? Is that just a guess or was he wearing a patch or something like I didn't see anything that seemed like a hell of a gash. I don't know. Maybe the mentalist too right, Maybe he was a jack of all trades.

You know, now that you mentioned it, let's let's mention I think the best one of the best things of about this movie is they said, who can play a villain? Really? Well, Mad's Nicholson of course, and like the best casting, I mean, one of the best casting choices was getting someone of his caliber in this movie. I think Unfortunately, he's not much of a villain because I mean again, he's a Nazi who was hired by NASA helps the Apollo moon landing, and now he wants to go back and kill Hitler, which means that this movie is about Indiana Jones saving Hitler's life. Yeah, well he I think he wants to take over for Hitler.

Like, if anything, I think he wants to kill Hitler so that he can become like the new fur Like he's mistakes that Hitler made and he's just like, no, no, I could do it better. I know what those mistakes are, right, Hitler was too much of a pantie for him. He wants to be the ultimate Hitler, super mega Hitler. So again, like, yes, I mean yes, obviously Mad's Nicholson probably not going to be much better than Hitler realistically, but it is ironic given how many times Indiana Jones has foiled the Nazis, that now it's not as much about foiling the Nazis as foiling a Nazi. So but Mad's I mean Mad's Michaelson is like the best part of this movie, Like bar barn None, it's just how can you make a movie with Indiana Jones and just focus on the villain?

That's that's more of the question, Like you can't do that. He's no Paul, He's he's no Bella. So you know, like I think Bellock as the anti Indiana Jones was even a chance to do much. And most of the time it's just him swooping in, taking one part of the dial, swooping in, taking the other pattern of the dial, swooping in, doing whatever he needs to do, and just he doesn't seem to have very many problems, and he's got Boyd Holebrook and then Olivier Richter is there to help him out, and Boyd Holebrook to him, I was like, oh, he and James Mangel must have really gotten along d again, because he's basically playing the exact same character but without an electronic arm. Well, and I was joking with you about it but Boyd Holbrook is not the character that Billy Magnuson plays from No Time to Die, the most recent James Bond movie.

But you could be confused by that because they're both just kind of blonde haired, blue eye, blue eyed Sam Worthington's or Sam Whitmore's or Joel Kinneman, like generic white guys, and they play villains. They play villain sidekicks. Really well, I kind of forgot that Boyd Holbrook was the main villain in Logan, but that movie really that's just about Logan fighting himself right well that it did in movie didn't even need a fucking villain, so kind of I think it's funny. Boyd Holbrook is kind of not needed here either, Like, I mean, he's fine, but sorry, he doesn't add much. I don't think.

I don't think they give him much to do. Unfortunately, either, at times it seemed like there was too much shit going on. There were too many characters, There was too much shit going on. It could have been paired down little yeah. Yeah, well you get the CIA chief with the bad knee or bad foot or whatever, and I'm just like, we're gonna find out anything about this bad foot like, you want to give us one line of dialogue.

Maybe he's been chasing Wombat aka Fleabag all around the place and that's why he's got that I'm sorry, I will say the person's real name, Phoebe Wallerbridge. He's chasing Helena all over the place, and that's why he's got this bad foot. Maybe she did something to him at some point and that's why he's really angry at her. But no, we don't know. And so yeah, you've got five six people chasing down her at Indies College where he just happens to keep the dial in this storage room where it could easily have been stolen.

But and the I don't want to be this guy, but it really drives me crazy when you show a character shooting that lady in blue who works for the staff, shoot her in the hallway. She's there face down because he shot her in the back. He shoots I guess the head of the department. He falls down, and then later on Indiana finds her over in a different hallway, a different part of that and on her back, and I was like, well, she didn't crawl past that head of there and then flip herself over on her back. I mean, and nobody should have moved the corpse, So why did she move?

Why was the body move? Was this just a weird continuity thing? Or there was there another scene missing? Because there are scenes that are in the trailer that aren't in the movie that we saw. Oh there, it feels like there's half of a movie on the cutting room floor.

Well here, God, well that's the thing. I mean, you know, we have this opening in New York, right, we see old Indiana Jones, He's got no shirt on. Great Harrison Ford's getting show off his physique. I'm glad, but you mentioned it already. Andy.

It's like, since when did this franchise become Forrest Gump? All of a sudden, It's like he goes outside and they're doing this and it's moon day, motherfucker, and it's like, what the fuck is all of this? Like this? This? There was none of this before, Like when when we had the Last Crusade, which is kind of what this feels like.

It's aping when he's like he goes to the book burning in Berlin, Right, that made sense contextually, thematically, historically, those things all make sense here. It's like, all, why does it have to be today because the guy looking for the dial is the guy who put the Nazi, the Nazi who put the astronauts on the moon, Like that's why, And again, like to your point, like like that adds nothing. Him being NASA adds nothing, like other than like operation paper Clip, which they don't even mention. They just mentioned that. I mean again, they're not gonna mention Operation paper Clip by name, I guess, but they could, given we know that it's a thing.

I mean, you don't have to call it that then, But that's what's going on. And I was that was the thing I was most excited about in the movie, was this idea of like drawing on reality, and they just don't do anything with it. They just go, well, it takes place on this day and this guy did this thing, but as to informing the decisions that he makes or anything else, and that's it's all just kind of expository for no reason. Well and on top of that, they make it seem like the reason that doesn't even have to be there though, is because they make it seem like mad Michelson is the only guy that was responsible for the rocketry. And I want going back just a minute here, when we were talking about the unmedied characters.

The part that about this that really irks me is the one character we actually want to see again, Salah disappears, just disappears, and it's like it was kind of like that old I think it was Hitchcock that said, if you show a gun in the first act, that has to go off in the third. Well, I mean, okay, Salah does show up in the third, but we think. I thought he would show up. I thought, you know, just in the nick of time, he would show up and save Endy. But isn't he gone until the end?

Or yes, I thought for sure he was going to get marrying and they're going to save the day. At the end of the film, you know, he comes in as this Dao sex salo, smacking the guy in the face, punching the guy the hippie in the face where we find out about Mutt's death just through a random thing on the TV. Good thing. I was paying attention to that, and they're just like, oh, Arnes sard Gard and mom or whatever. I mean, I don't know he died on the way to his home planet.

Oh god, he bro I mean, but you know, let think back, because again in preparation for this. I watched the first four begrudgingly on that fourth one, and don't forget, in that fourth one, Sean Connery, still alive at the time, dies off screen. Den Holme Ellie and dead at the time, dies off screen, So his his death makes sense in the way they handle it. But they killed off Sean Connery the exact same way, more or less ignominiously. And here's the thing.

I mean, they set up the idea that, like, what would you do if you could go back in time and warn your so And it's like I would warn my son to not go to Vietnam. Like it's just it's it's so fun ridiculous, it's fucking strange. Because here's the thing. James Bond was what Spielberg wanted to direct, and they directed. He directed Indiana Jones instead.

Right, would James Bond, who now spoilers for no time, there is a child that maybe James Bond's in that movie, would that child? Would James Bond let his child go into the Iraq War? No fucking way, Why in what universe would James Bond or Indiana Jones go, Yes, you can join the Vietnam War, Like it's such a make It makes Indiana Jones seem like a really bad father in a really weird way, given that there was an entire movie about his inner like interrelational problems with his own father and four was kind of about that too. And then they're like, but he just went to Vietnam and died the d like, why do you you just had doesn't have to be there, Like this is kind of a day in Indiana Jones's life this movie.

It's like, I don't know why we needed to even fucking address it, frankly well, And why would he go back and try to talk Mutt out of enrolling in the arm services. Why doesn't he go back to when Marian found out that she was pregnant and actually be a father for this child who didn't have a father for years and years, you know, Like when he finds out that he has a kid, he's like, whoa, why didn't you tell me? And he's kind of upset in that fourth one, if memory serves, go ahead and go back and be the father that Henry Jones Senior never was for you, apparently not. Not. The weird tonal thing about this movie is like Phoebe waller Bridge.

I was. She's some sort of now mercenary and she's always talking about like, oh yeah, I've got all these gambling debts. And there was this prince here in Morocco who you know, I was supposed to marry and I left him at the altar, I sold the ring, YadA YadA, and she's just all like happy, go lucky. It's like she's in one movie and Harrison Ford's in another movie, because she's there having a great time, like, Oh, wouldn't it be great if you had a time machine? What would you do?

And he's like, I'd go back and tell my side. And wait a second. There's a point in the movie where an actor who shouldn't be in this series but is. That's five minutes Antonio von Deis, gets murdered and she's like, yeah, how we got away. Isn't that awesome.

He's like, my friend just kept for murdered. It's like this is something that would have been addressed in the writer's room. You're doing this on screen like this makes no This is like as like one of those Marvel joke moments where it's like a sincere moment brought to you by Marvel. Also ruined with a joke by Marvel. It's like that but worse, because like this is also fucked up and not funny.

It's this movie is a tonal mess in a way that I was not expecting, because four is not a tonal mess. Four is consistently bad. The tone thing there is so weird. Be like if she made a joke about maybe you'll get lucky when we go over there and he says I got my penis cut off, you know, like if the tone it would just go from it was so weird. Yes, the transition is so even.

She's like, fuck, what the fuck just happened after he says, you know, my son died blah blah blah, and then he turns and walks away. It is commonal, Yeah, you expect her to do the thing with the tyler going jeez right, A tough crowd, tough crowd. Well, there's there's other weird things in here, like that poor horse that he rides through the subway and I'm just like, watch out for the third rail. But when he takes he gets the horse back on another subway platform, jumps onto a train and takes off, and I have no idea how the fuck boy to Holbrook knew which stopped to be at it made no sense whatsoever. But he gets on the train, gets on the train, and then he has to say a joke, right, and he says the joke to this older here's another older African American woman.

He says a joke to her, like he puts the button on it. The button is so bad that I can't even remember what it was because it was terrible, and I was just like, no, there should have been like I was waiting for no ticket or something like that, you know, because this movie also feels the need to call back to all of the other movies, and we've got mentions of the blood of Kalie, We've got mentions of him being shot by his own father. You know, there's just like all of these of course, mutt in here, all of this stuff where you're like, okay, this is kind of weird, Like he's really cementing this in the there were four other adventures before this adventure, whereas the Indiana Jones that we know would have had a thousand adventures.

But he feels very compelled to tell us about the four or at least three of the four that he's had before. It's almost as awkward as when they're in that big warehouse at the beginning of four and you hear the arc theme and you know that the Ark of the Covenant is in this warehouse. So we've mentioned and you know, Phoebe Wallerbridge did some script punching up on No Time to Die, the most recent Bond film, And again I can't help but keep bringing it up because it is in a same way similar to what this movie is trying to do. This movie is the final story that Harrison Ford is doing as Indiana Jones. They've said they're not going to recast the role.

They've said that this is the final Indiana Jones adventure with Harrison Ford playing Indiana Jones. Should they do something else with Phoebe waller Bridge. Cool, but that's not going to be Indiana Jones. It's going to be Wombat and Friends whatever. Kid with the biggest mustache as a mustache, I don't even know, Like I was like, you know, is this like her Babe Villa Chance?

Like it just a dwarf. No, he's a little boy, but he's just got a fucking mustache. And here's a harry little guy speaking of her Villa Chez and James Bond. But any all that aside the the idea that this is a movie about the end of something and we're paying lip service to things that have come before. And No Time to Die.

I mean again, this is not spoiling the movie. It's in the trailer. He drives the asked in Martin dB five and that's the entire opening of the movie has to do with that car, which is the iconic car. And there's so many iconic things in James Bond, just like there are in Indiana Jones. They are parallel properties in a lot of ways.

It's just Indiana Jones didn't make use of the fucking time the way James Bond has, because it's all about Harrison Ford playing Indiana Jones until it's not. And you can have Sean Patrick Flannery doing a halfway decent job as young Indiana Jones and you've got all of that backlog. But No Time to Die is a much more successful ending of a story than this movie is, because while that movie has its problem, it understands that we have to be an entertaining movie while also ending the story, and this movie just feels more like it's just it feels like you're with India on a train just passing stops and getting to see them and wave at them as you conclude to the end of the line and you get off at the end of the movie.

It's just so Yeah, mentioned Temple a Doom and mentioned Mutt, which means you mentioned the fourth movie. It's like, to to what end? There's nothing else, There's nothing, nothing coming from any of this, Like there's this is it, and so's It feels very it falls very short of being even sentimental. It just kind of feels like they didn't know what to do because this movie has been being kicked around for another ten years since the last one. I love Phoebe waller Bridge, but she did feel like she was in a different movie a lot of times.

And Yeah, it was like she's got so much backstory that I'm like, Okay, you're hitting me with all this stuff that really doesn't matter. Like adding that Prince with the scimitar in the Tuck Tuck chase just made it longer, and I'm like, I don't need that. I don't need there to be the third route that's chasing and being chased, you know, just it's enough because like I can't remember if I said this time around or not because we started re recording. But the whole thing of the between the horse Chase and the Tuck Tuck Chase, I was just chased out. I was like the movie technically really exactly because he's going through all these and yeah, running away from the guys.

But I was really kind of tired by all of this stuff that's going on. I'm just like, please take a break, have a discussion. Let's hear a little bit more about this. Okay, great, you got this little flashback. Okay, cool.

Indie promises that he's going to destroy the dial. I don't think he ever keeps that promise no matter what. Like even by the end of the movie, I don't think that that dial is destroyed. He takes it back with him. So the way to go or or fucking Toby Jones.

That poor guy, he's just I don't know why he couldn't survive, but he dies off screen too well, and I don't understand his character. Like his character again, I was expecting more of him in the movie. It just seems like they're an their God, we should mention in the Toby Jones scene, we get to see another another iteration of d aged Indiana Jones, and this time it's older than last time, but younger than he is now. So it's like it's a time that we, I guess, have never really seen in his life, and it's it may be worse than the opening of the movie, but at least it's like one scene. But it stands out even more because he's in like a really well lit room and he's like interacting directly with Toby Jones, and they have to keep showing them like next to one another.

It's like, oh my god, Like, guys, like it worked a little bit better in the opening just because he was just constantly moving and you didn't have to see it constantly. Well, I agree with that. It did work better for me in the beginning. And a real quick on Wombat, if it's okay, I want to make two quick points. When she first showed up, I was thinking, please God, don't let her be his gallipal for this movie, Like I didn't want her to be a love interest.

And I thought, this is a classy enough movie that hopefully they're not going to pay an eighty one year old this hot thirty year old, and I was so glad that did not become a thing, and so instead, yes, we got the weird Oh my god, he's got a goddritter we've never heard once about. That's one and then two, I didn't buy her backstory that she goes from having this father that's really in love with these pieces to becoming a mercenary of these pieces. And also if she really did become that, if she knew where this giant piece was and she the whole time the one that she could really make the money on, why did she wait so long to go after it? Not that that really matters. It could happen, but he just seemed a little weird to me when it was so screenwriting one oh one as well, when we see Teddy the kid being introduced and he's got all of the gages and dials set out before him, and he's teaching himself how to fly while working security or something at a hotel, and I'm like, Okay, well, that kid's going to be flying a plane anytime now, right, and a plane that had a guy in it who didn't need to be there.

I don't know why this guy who sleeps better than I ever could in my entire life wakes up after they go through the hole into you know, the past thousands of years, and he's just like, hey, what are you doing my plane? You know, I'm like, oh my god, that guy slept for a thousand years, but just backwards, right, I don't know. It was shit. That was weird. It was to make the one joke.

It was all just to make the one joke of him going, you stole my plane and then we go, oh my god, there's a guy there, and that was it. And it wasn't a funny joke. It was we were talking about the button with the African American woman in the subway. This was even shittier. And yet and the line there was the trains faster was the shitty line in that one.

But it's like, it's all just to make this dumb joke of the man sitting up and that's it. There's nothing else. He doesn't knock the shit out of the little kid. He doesn't go why are there? You know?

What is going on with all these warships? Right? I heard their arrows coming through the door here. It was just really weird. I don't think it did with theirs, but it was just weird.

Well, even when it comes to the punchline of I know a guy and he's got a great ship, and I'm like, okay, then you cut to the guy and he's got this really shitty ship, and I think at one point she just says I was expecting a different ship or something like that. I'm like, no, that was the joke. Guys like he's he's got this really shitty shit that that should have been the thing. And please God tell me why it wasn't Katanga. Why wasn't George Harris in this movie.

I mean, I don't know, is George Harris with us? But this should have been fucking Get another actor and dagum or ageum up or something and make it fucking katanga. Don't have it be. Antonio bandettis in here for five fucking minutes. One of the biggest wastes of this man's time ever.

I mean, he had more presence in the SpongeBob movies. You know, come on, it's like this, he's just here to die and that's his only for him and that other guy, the other guy that's on the boat. Actually the two first red Shirt dies and then Red Shirt two dies, and then Antonio Bandeis is like, shit, I'm a red shirt too. I went to the bathroom and I never go to the bathroom. Maybe it's because I'm fifty, maybe it was because I'd been busy all day.

I never go to the bathroom, but I ran. I was trying to get done really fast. I come back and fucking Antonio Bendaris is on the stream. I thought I walked into the wrong theater, Like, where the hell did this guy come from? And why is he here?

If it's the right movie? Hey, they never answer that, because he has what two lines two one, and there's a point where he's going to open his mouth and someone else cuts him off, and I was like, wait, wait a second, Like is that going to be the joke that he doesn't have a lot? It's Antonio Bendaris was in one of the best movies of this year, that Puss in Boots, last Wish movie just fanesque, and he is like, what is why why? It was really distracting too to have a big name person there to play that little bitty role. Right, And then in what I saw, they didn't really like I said, I pete, but it didn't really see him like you know they had this long friendship here and it's like, oh, that was my friend, Like he's all pissed about it, like right, an old friend.

Okay, he's an old friend. You've never heard of him. It's like Mike and Barney Miller by my game buddy Hey from Hey, you remember when all those missions we had together so fun, Like it's it's the same thing they did with Phoebe waller Bridge. It's that same like you just have never heard of him. He was there all the time.

He's you know, it was Agatha all along. It's that same shit. It's like very you know, it's just like Inspector, I am the author of all of your pain James, Like no, you're not. And the fact that they're they're trying to lazy chain like Daisy chain, but lazy chain it together is lazy. And again like, oh, well, Phoebe waller Bridge is your goddaughter, Like yeah, sure, I guess, he guess.

He's never mentioned he didn't have one at any point, so he didn't mention he did either. So but yeah, like Antonio van Dara's man, like what what a waste? What if he shame Amy's third build? He must have one of the best agents in the world. And if you look at some of the posters, it's like he is bigger than Phoebe Waller Bridges.

On the posters, it's like Indiana Jones feed Bridge. Antonio Bandera's like way big in The Old Man and then on the poster. Because I successfully until that motherfucker posted stuff on my Twitter, I had successfully avoided all spoilers for this movie. I hadn't seen any trailers for it, so when I saw the posters, I thought it was Pedro Pascal and I'm just like, this is another Pedro Pascal thing. This guy's everywhere well and here's the other thing.

So I didn't see his main build because the theater that I went to cocksuckers. I almost feel like I should tell it on here, like an ad started the movie early, so I walk in, and yes, I walked in, and I was two minutes after the ships that I started rolling right, So I don't even get one trailer. I'm already they're on the fucking train doing shit. So I didn't even get to see baa baa, Like I missed all of that. So I also apparently missed missed his name, which I'm okay with that, but the blah blah, I would like duc I don't think they showed any names at the beginning.

I think it was a very cold open. It was the there was the Disney open, it was a Paramount open. It was Lucasfilm and Disney present or the Lucasfilm Icon. And then they went into the movie. They started with Indiana Jones with a bag over his head and okay, that's where I came in.

He already had the rope. They were putting the rope on his neck. When yeah, and that's when it says Disney and Lucasfilm, which was a weird credit to see, and then Indiana Jones and Dialod Destiny. So no names at the beginning that until the yet yeah, and it feels like a Disney movie, Like it doesn't it feel like a Marvel movie. It's it's so weird to me because again, I rewatched Four, and I don't want to be an apologist for four, and I don't think anybody should, because Four is not a great movie.

But at least Four felt like an Indiana Jones movie, like at least it still had the DNA at the heart of it. That made it an Indiana Jones movie. Yes, I didn't like where it went, and yes it where it went to so cuckoo Banana's bullshit with the ancient aliens and stuff, and I think it's fun. I think it's funny. How horseshit it is because again that ancient astronaut theorists and all that stuff aside.

But like this movie it feels so like a Disney movie, and the fact that I saw it at the beginning, just like you mentioned Disney one hundred, one hundred years of Disney, like, oh right, this is a Disney thing now, like you know, what's weird? So generally I would like we were going back to for real quick. Generally I would like aliens, right, Generally I would like time travel, but somehow both of these movies have made that aspect kind of shitty. Like I mean, I look, there are aspects of the time travel here that was interesting, but somehow they made it kind of overall feel sucky. And that's how I felt with the Aliens and four, like how do you make Indiana Jones and Aliens be so shitty?

And they did it? I don't know. And so these movies do have something in common and something to be impressed about. And it's the way that they ruined things that should have been more interesting. Well, it kind of goes back to the thing that we're talking about with the weaponization of the mcguffin, the Crystal Skull.

I mean, did the Russians think that they were going to revive the Aliens or join with the Aliens and then have them attack America or something, because there's nothing there's no reason why the Russians should be interested in these aliens whatsoever. There's no like we will take a part the capitalist worldview with these aliens or something. If anything, ransom knowledge, that's what it's supposed it gave them, Like infinite knowledge is what you okay? Well, like the explodes, right, be careful what you wish for you. But again, like to your point, though, the Arc and the Holy Grail play into the climax in the movies in a way that makes sense because what they do has been established, and what the Aliens do was never established, and what the Dial does is established up until like thirty seconds before it happens.

And then it's like Indiana Jones finds the whole ship. Oh no, he's the only he's the only one who realized. And it's like fucking Christ movie. Here we go, like all that he's doing. Do you know what he's doing.

He's doing George Lucas in those story sessions that we read where George just like, well, you know, the sun would have shifted and the stars would have changed. So really, we can't use the sun to figure out where the Ark of the Covenant is because thousands of your path and Indiana Jones becomes that guy he says saying, oh you it is. There's continental drift our commedians didn't know about that. We're going to go back to the wrong period, which is like so fucking hilarious, Oh my god, and talk about last minute. It's like once again things you could have brought to my attention yesterday, and like I get why they do it when they do it, but it just it again comes back to this idea of you introduce so many characters and so many other things that we never really get to focus on the like you mentioned, Andy, we never get to focus on the time travel.

Just like in the fourth movie, we never really I mean we get to talk more about the aliens in the fourth movie. In this movie, with the dial. But the dial in this movie is more of a mcguffin than any of the other things we're in the other movies, because even in two the Shankra stones play into the way the movie concludes with Molarram, you know, grabbing him and burning his hands and you know, freaking out and dying. But in this it's just like, okay, sure, but we only ever see it do its thing one time, which I know the Arc and the Holy Grail are the same way, but in this it's like even that, it's just like it just kind of happens. I don't know, It's it's very strange to me that this is what they went after all this time and all these other ideas and going to the Well of Aliens, this is still where they landed his time travel?

Fuck? It is that not the last gasp of a dying franchise? Is that why they did it in an end game is because that was the last time to do it then and then you never have to do it again. Like, I just don't get it. They should have time traveled back to when people gave more of a shit about these movies.

That would have been you see the numbers on this movie. It's making the same numbers as the Flash Wow, it's going to it's a bomb. Who is this movie for? Ultimately, Like the fans of this movie are what, Like, I don't know, I think they're I mean, I don't know how old you are, Chris. I think it's for me and my early third I'm in my early I grew up with the first three movies, like yeah, only on the fourth movie twice in theaters the day it came out.

Like I was overjoyed to be able to buy Indiana Jones merchandise in two thousand and seventeen thousand and eight, because there was none of that. Like I had an Indiana Jones hat growing up, like that fucking Fedora. I had the template Doom poster in my room. Like that's why it feels like I know that South Park did that. It's their personal attack episode on Indiana Jones.

But like at this point, I wonder, like who the fuck is this ship for, because like, I don't know if young kids are like Indiana Jones. I'm a huge fan of that. Like, so I'm glad, I'm you establish your cred and that's great for a thirty one year old, But I want to say that the majority of the fans are forty and off right, like, I mean, you grew up with them. But I think Mike and and I'm not this is doesn't give a shit. I don't give a shit.

But there are people in a different way that grew up with them like Mike and I did, and people that are older than us. But it's like, I don't even though you're an exception, and I'm really glad you're an exception, I don't think there's that many people under forty that are super fucking amped to see another Indiana Jones movie. And I think that that's part of the problem. And the other part of the problem is a lot of the older audiences, hopefully older than Mike and I, are the people that just want to stream now because it's too much of a pain and ask to go to the theater. So who is the audience.

There is no audience, that's the problem. There's not really an audience. I think they're looking for a nostalgia that people don't seem to give enough of a shit about for that to really be there for many people other than us. I was amped. I bet you guys were amped.

But I mean my aptness left as the movie went on. It's interesting too that you would think, now, Phoebe waller Bridge is immensely talented, mas Michelson wonderful, a Tonio Bandera's fucking a but kids are probably not that super thrilled for Harrison Ford. If anything, you would think you would want to put another big star in here to make it appeal more to the kids. It's not like a twenty five year old is going, oh man, I can't wait for that new Phoebe waller Bridge movie to open. That's gonna be the lit you know, or whatever the kids say these days.

Oh man, I watched Fleabag all the way back in twenty sixteen, and that was so great. You know, I watched a little mustache boy with the fucking unibrow. A big fan of him, you know. Yeah, But you know, what are you gonna do. You gotta put something or somebody else in here to make it appeal to a little bit more wider audience.

And I don't many twenty year olds you're going, I can't wait to see an eighty one year old in an action movie, right right, And And that's the and that's where the total disconnect comes from because Phoebe waller Bridge is in the movie that they should have made, and Indiana Jones Allah Harrison Ford is in the movie that they couldn't help themselves but make because James man Gold made it. Like it's it's that like musing on life and age and going grilling older and you're little losing because old Simately the climax of the movie comes down to do you want to be out of time and admit you're out of time? Or do you want to like get with the times, motherfucker? And like that's ultimately that the question of the movie is are you ever going to feel out of time even if you're in and again whatever, fine, you want to go that route would be fine.

James Mangold, go for it. But I just for me, it's like Indiana Jones is not that avenue. Like it should have just been a triumphant finish to a career and a character that so many people, like we've mentioned though many people that are not more of more of being made every day. I get to your point, like this should have been a last hurrah for the people that were fans of this fucking franchise. Not attempting to make something to kind of bridge the divide when you know that there's nothing to bridge, there's nothing else here.

They're not doing anything else, Like and you were on the right track with Mad's Michelson. Everything else kind of fails. It's just like everything else kind of fails. Other than the fact that they got Jonathan Rees Davies right back into the movie again, which I'm sure he would have come back for four willingly. You know, God, he looks like he's five thousand years old.

He looks like the Mummy that they dug up. I mean, I feel bad, but as you know, we could talk about Harrison Ford being eighty one, but god, he looks like he's fifty years older than Indiana. Like it looks bad. Yeah, I was glad to see him, but god, he looks so shitty. I almost wasn't sure it was him.

Going back to my screenwriting stuff that I was talking about before with the kid and the flying one thing that never seems to pay off, and I've seen writers do backflips to try to make this payoff. Is her forcing the card? And there have been writers that I've I've read over the last few days that are just like, oh, well, you get it. Her forcing that seven of Spades on everyone with the cards is like Archimedes forcing them to go back to the Battle of Syracuse with the dial. And I'm like, really, that's where you're gonna go with this, that's what you're going to try to prove to me.

To me, it just made no sense because I was waiting for her to do another card trick or something later on in the film. I mean, she does a little thing with the dynamite sticking out of her back pocket, those kind of things, but nothing to do with cards. And then the other thing is that he's got those papers which seemed to disappear pretty quickly after that, where they have the dates of eight twenty sixty nine all over the place, and I'm like, all right, well, first off, we know that an American had to write that, otherwise it would be twenty eight sixty nine. They don't seem to give a shit about that that Toby Jones and Mad's Michelson are both from Europe. But anyway, we've got a date here, folks, eight twenty sixty nine.

The ticket tape parade for the Astronauts took place on eight thirteen sixty nine, so we've got a ticking clock, something's going to happen on eight twenty sixty nine, And they really never tie the thread that the gate is going to open on eight twenty nine, that we are we have a ticking clock. We don't feel like we have a ticking clock with this movie. We don't get the Nazis are going and digging at Tannis scene from the from the first movie, the scene with you know, it's it's the arc, you know, and you know that whole thing with the specialists, Like there's none of that in this movie, and it needed that like that, it's if these are James Bond, which again they kind of are, then this movie doesn't have the scene that the other movies have had, which is the explanation of the thing.

I will say I appreciate. As someone who played a lot of Indiana Jones video games, including the Lucas Art Point and Clicks, I can't help but feel like the whole scene in the Archives is a callback to the Fate of Atlantis video game, which would have made a much more compelling movie, because again, it's just for me, it's like you you have to I know that the dial is a real thing, but like that kind of Actually it wasn't. Never the point of the other things, the Arc and the Holy Grail are maybe real things, like and you've imbued them with what one could consider and I would think a lot of people would agree, like an understandable level of power associated with these biblical frelics. In this it's like this could do whatever the fuck.

Frankly, like it doesn't. I'm not even sure they understand what the fuck they're trying to introduce, because yes, Harrison Ford says, well, we can travel to a fissure in time, and this finds that fissure, but it seems like there's actually more going on, and they never kind of explain it, and they kind of just YadA YadA, which in of all the movies to YadA YadA, even in the fourth movie Indiana Jones doesn't YadA YadA the explanation of what they're going after. It never does that. It takes a moment to do it. And this movie is just not as concerned as the other movies have been, which is kind of strange.

He's his own m in this one. When he's giving the lecture, that's as much backstory as we get. And I'll tell you that whole thing with the Battle of Syracuse when he's talking about those claw things, things that would grab the ships, and we see those kind of peripherally as the planes are flying way too low over this battle. Fucking pull up, man, or else you're gonna get speared like they do. But anyway, they also talk about the mirrors and how they were setting fire to the ships with these mirrors, and I was like, yeah, I want to see that.

I want to see like death laser beam from these mirrors, like that casino in Vegas that was cooking people by the pool because the windows were all set up in correctly. It's like, yeah, I want to see that kind of stuff. No, no, we're not going to see that. We're gonna see old our comedies come out. We're gonna see this Roman soldier get gaged and apparently our commedies died at that battle, so that he isn't dead when Indiana leaves allegedly or however that happens, because he gets knocked out cold.

I think that Roman who was coming after Indiana was the one that should have been killing our commedies. And they're all worried about the sanctity of time, and I'm like, since when is Indiana Jones worried about the sanctity of time? Well, I was convinced that the entire third act of this movie was gonna be you know, he goes back in time. He's like, well, I'm going to leave a note for myself about my son, unlike and then and then in that kind of the coda, you have, well, Marian is back, because like, Mutt is still alive, you ort to fucking see him. But it's like, well, I got a call from Mutt or you know it answers the phone and it's Mutt or you know, it's like, yeah, like back to the right, back to the future.

Wanted it, wanted it one way and had its cake and then ate it too twice with the second and third movie. But even it understood that you can tease that hole, don't don't mess up time. But if you mess up time for the positive, nobody cares. And that's the thing that they do an end game. It's like, yes, we fucked with the timeline, but guess what we got ostensibly quantitatively a better timeline out of it.

So nobody cared, and that should always be the way time travel is addressed in these movies. It's not we can't full up time, it's we can't make it worse, so do whatever you can to make it better. And yes, I get that, that's where you kind of get the paradox of it. But at least that's more interesting than just doing this. Well, I'm not going to stick around because I'll fuck up time thing because it's like cheese is what is this the butterfly effect all over again?

Like it's so so played out at this point. Well, she's like, oh, there's not enough medicine and you you've been shot and blah blah blah. I'm like, first off, he's walking around just fine after being shot. Of course there's a shoulder moaned. But I'm like, hey, guys, don't forget our comedies.

Was also a physician, so you know, maybe you're in okay hands here and if not, you die at home. You die here in ancient Greece. Yeah, what what do you want? So? But yeah, I totally thought that they would have had some sort of thing where either him or Phoebe waller Bridge make that trip and talk to Mutt and he's there alive and we're good.

By the end of the film, Right Marion comes back, they do the little on the elbow thing, which was a nice throwback. I guess they do call back to Raiders with that, but yeah, I really wanted his son to be alive too, and they don't really. He gives that speech about how you know they broke apart after Mutt died and you know that he's basically living as this bitter old man, but they don't really address that too much in this, I mean, other than just Harrison Ford being a bitter old man. I felt like I felt like the ending is totally unearned, right, yeah, like like, what do we do here? Let's make everything perfect to this ridiculous amount.

So we have Marian with the biggest bullshit appearance, like she's there for thirty seconds, and Saul's like, oh, they all come in, like here's our happy family, and they're all of this shit happening at the very third, last thirty seconds or whatever, and it's like, oh, everything's happy. The police aren't even looking for him anymore. What has changed that? Like, I don't understand that he really pissed me off, Like and no one goes, oh, we have to lay low until we figure out you know, did they figure out the whole situation with the cops and clear him while he was asleep. It was awful.

I'm sorry that lad. The ending was awful. I thought that the twenty minutes leading up to it was awful, but then it got there and I thought I still missed it up. I'm not gonna lie about him and Marian, but I thought it was an awful scene. Well, when they played Marion's theme, that's when it got me because I was just like, oh, that music, that love affair that they had, and you know, I remember when she was twelve and he was twenty two.

Thank you, thank you. Hey, it's not weird though we promised, okay, Steven Spielberg, he's here with us now, and he said it's fine. He wasn't grooming her. He wasn't. It wasn't.

None of that wasn't. It wasn't like an Elvis Jerry Lee Lewis thing at all. They were married, they had kids. In the end, it was like someone it was like someone saw a return of the King and they were like, how can we make this like that? But dumb?

I mean again, it has that same feeling because if you think about return of the King Frodo drops and it's like, what happened? Where am I? And you have to come to the realization of what's happening with the character. You don't see the character coming to, you come to with the character. And in this it's so bizarre because they go back in time in an Indiana Jones movie to a time that has nothing to do with anything other than contradential drift, and it's like, okay, sure, and there's a bunch of Nazis and we get to see Mad's Michelson in a straight up Nazi outfit, which is a wild piece of imagery.

I will say, to my wife's credit, she mentioned and I think we should mention here Mad's Michelson doesn't look remotely German at all, even when they put him in a Nazi outfit. But what an ignominious way to end an interesting character. It feels like they really had no I know that there were mentions of rewrites of the third act of this movie, and that's the only explanation. It feels like they improvise the whole movie, are right, thank you? Like and then they get to the third act and it's like, what happens?

So he goes back at time and they're plane crashes and they die and they meet Archimedes and then well does he stay or not? And they're like, well his last movie and well maybe, and it's like, just make a fucking decision here, and they don't even they make a decision, and then they don't let the character get the decision that they made. They go the character is going to make a decision. Bop dusex fist to the fucking face. And it's like, and that is a better way of doing this, how than actually earning your ending.

I was gonna say, I love it when they get there Archimedes. They just happened to be right the fuck where Archimedes is walking around one. But the other thing was is that was I wrong on this? Like I felt like there was an implication that and it's that that trope thing where Archimedes doesn't realize that he's going to make this thing until he sees theirs. But if any and if that's I like that kind of trope.

But the problem here is if he died at that battle, how would that have ever happened? I mean, even if it's changed now, if in the original timeline he wouldn't have known until that, how would that even be possible. The other thing is we talked about how no one seems to know exactly how the dial works, but he looks at it and instantly knows, like I don't know it. It was fascinating to me that aspect. The whole movie just seems really sloppy.

Some of it. I had fun with it. Sloppy. Let's come go ahead, Mike, Sorry, your wife brought up a really good point. My wife was also bringing up when when he goes to the airport, she's like, wait, aren't the tops looking for him for murder?

And then when they're doing the whole map with the dot stuff later on, she raises up her hand in the theater and does the fingers mean the money thing, and she's like, where did all the money to pay for these trips? And I was like, yeah, that's a really good point. Because he lives in a hovel, right right, It's not like he's got a money bells. When he leaves the house. He has no idea he's going to be going on an adventure.

At this point, Salah gave him some money, Okay, so I want to I want to compare a couple of things. Let's compare the scene of the kind of the tomb rating, because we get a little bit of tomb rating in this movie. We got some in the fourth movie as well, when they're looking for the tomb of oh whoever, whoever has the skull buried under his chest and the thing with the tilting plate. It's actually kind of fun. The third movie.

I guess you could consider the third act the tomb rating thing or the person in Venice as well, right, the thing with the rats and then the thing in the palace in Indy two and then the Well of Souls thing. Um, this is so like for me, this was the best part of the movie because it was kind of the most like Indiana Jones of the things that we see. And you don't have to have Harrison for doing a lot in these scenes compared to him, like rolling around on top of a fucking train or jumping out of an airplane with hair shoots, all sorts of things that know, like you know, Timothy and All was doing in Living Daylights and now Indiana Jones is doing in this movie. But the thing that I will say though, because the tomb rating scene has the thing that you mentioned andy in it.

They're like, oh my god, the sarcophagus. It has an eagle with propellers on right, and I'm like, oh no, it's doing that thing that so many time travel things do where it's like, wait, he has the watch on his arm. That's Urgenvolers watch. And it's like, oh no, movie like, so they're going to travel back in time. The movie is the movie is like telegraphing what it's gonna do twenty minutes before it does it, and it's just I don't know's it takes the wind out of what ends up happening, because what ends up like if you don't spoil it, it actually is kind of interesting, but if you tell the audience what's about to happen, like with characters going look at this thing.

It has propellers like an airplane. You know. I thought there's some low budget looking tomb rating too, because until they get to the actual room where the coffin is like, you've got this ten minutes to them going through this really narrow space, it looked like it could have been a sound set or something like a sound stage, and it looks like shit, And then all of a sudden and it's I don't know, it just a vert and then all of a sudden there's like, you know, the the fucking bugs on them and shit like, I don't know, it's just and they were only in that one area, Like I thought, this is a perfect place for a snake, not a bullshit you know, eel eel like they use eels. Oh he looks like a snake. But no, I mean because that's the endy thing, right, like we're gonna have a snake reference.

No, there's no snakes and there's really nothing worth the ship until you get there and then I don't know it just that was my thing is I thought, this looks really low budget this particular scene. Everything else is overdone with cgi and shit for no particular reason, but this it looked like shit to me. I don't know, if anything. I thought they were going to do an homage to the first three films and do here's a room with bugs, here's a room with rats, right, here's a room with snakes, like and then when they went into the one room and they're like, oh, well, this methane which seems about their Phoebe waller Bridge but doesn't seem to bother her he's just like, m doesn't even like put a scarf over his face.

Nothing. He's just like, yeah, he doesn't cough. She's coughing her head off. And eventually he's like, oh, this guy was all into water displacement and I'm like, oh, yeah, Eureka. And I thought that was really funny when he says Eureka and he sees the thing, my eighty one year old body is immune to mething.

Okay, yeah, I'm sorry, but it's just like that. But I thought they're going to do this homage and seven then of course no. And then apparently, like you can see stills from the trailer, there's a giant stone ball that they find at one point that I think Phoebe Wallbridge releases, and I was like, okay, yeah, they were. I think they were going for more of an homage to the earlier films, and they trimmed it down to be just the bugs, which look terrible. They all look like CEREI bugs now, and I'm like, no, they were probably half real in Temple of Doom.

I think. Unfortunately, James Bond and Mission Impossible and a lot of other franchises action franchises have gone the correct route, which is focusing on doing things practically. I mean, look, Tom Cruise is doing a lot of his own stunts. Daniel Craig did a lot of his own stunts in those Bond movies. But you know who didn't do a lot of their own stunts in those Bond movies was Roger Moore late in his tenure in a View to a Kill, where it's every shot of a person doing something is a body double or a stunt man, and then close up shots of him being James Bond are just him, Roger Moore.

And this is what this felt like it and it has that weird disconnect, you know. In Lord of the Rings, which we've kind of already mentioned, Peter Jackson is the god of making disparate things that shouldn't work work, like the fact that they're filming with small actors, using masks, using force, perspective, all of those things in multiple times. They're using multiple things in multiple scenes and it all works together and it never cheap or shodily put together. And here to your point, Andy, everything looks really shodily put together and cheap. And they spent like three hundred million dollars on this movie, and I just don't understand.

If you know your actor can't do things, why do you do this thing again that requires him to do things? Why not have him be Again I'm not advocating for this, but why not have just killed him off like they did with Han Solo and have that be Half of the movie is then them coming to terms with the death of Indiana Jones and avenging his death like I just because then you free up a lot of space and room to actually do things believably as opposed to doing a lot of the things in CGI. And again, like all those other action franchises that I mentioned, they are really committed to doing things practically, and it shows. It really shows that Indiana Jones one, two, and three really were committed to it, because again they also came before a time where it was as prevalent as it is now.

But now it just feels like a bacsimile of something that we grew up loving, just with all of the love and fun kind of drained out of it, and not in the way that four was just goofy and dumb. This movie just feels kind of decisions being made by committee, which I think is like a Marvel movie or a Star Wars movie. At this point, I think that Laura Croft really ate Indiana Jones's lunch while he was away from the table, because I kept thinking of the two earlier Laura Croft movies and the one that came out just a few years ago, and I was thinking that I liked the tomb reading in those better than I liked the tomb reading in this one, and a lot of the stuff in those felt. A lot of the stuff in this felt derivative of things in those, and so I just was like, oh, yeah, no, Like I want to see more of the water displacement thing, all of the puzzles, all of those things that you need to do, Like Okay, great, there's a crescent up on the rock, so let's go up here than go through this entrance.

But then once you get inside those caves, it gets really confusing and there's no sense of geography. There's no I have no idea how long they're traveling. That the bad guys can show up wherever they want to. As far as I know, they don't have teleportation powers, but it definitely feels that way. The death of that one giant guy seems really horrific to me.

That the kid Hank touffs them to the gate underground rounds. I was kind of horrified by that. I'd much rather have my villains get their faces chopped off by propeller blades or get shot in the in the heart or something. My god, that was really more bad. Well, the weaponization of the mcguffin is you know, there there isn't any because it's the time travel device, you know, like the Holy Grail allows Julian Glover to quickly age and like, oh okay, like makes perfect sense.

Like and the thing with Kate Blanchett, you know, she gets so much knowledge that her brain can't contain it and her head explodes, like makes sense in this it's what yeah, And and there and there's Mad's Michelson just like his head on a rock, like with his face burned. It's so it's so unfulfilling. Like and look, here's the thing. In another role that Mads Michelson had where he played a villain in Casino Royal, you could almost compare how he's treated there and here simultaneously, because that has a rather anticlimactic and to his character in that movie. But I wouldn't consider that death ignominious I would consider in this movie, the villain's death is so ignominious, It's like, what was why was he even in this?

Because ultimately, you know, this movie has the biggest criticism that can be leveled against it is remember in Readers who Lost Art Indiana Jones didn't do anything, the Nazis would have killed themselves. Well, yes and no, but the Nazis would have still had the arc, So yeah, someone needed to be there to take it away. In this it's like if they if he had just let them be, they would have gone through time eight ship and then would Yeah, like he didn't need to be there at all at all this time is what I'm getting at. And I just kept thinking of out their time travel movies. I can't remember.

I don't think Chris, you were on the tomorrow I'll wake up and scaled myself with tea episode where it's three basically ex Nazis that are living in Rio hire a plane or hire a time travel machine, and they want to go back and give Hitler a nuclear bomb near the end of the war when things have taken a bad turn for Hitler, and at one point they go back and they think that they're in one year, but they're actually another year, and I'm just like, yeah, that was a much better movie than when I'm watching here with Matt's Michelson suddenly revealing his plan here of I'm going to go back and out Hitler Hitler. The other one that I kept thinking of is a movie that I liked up until the very end of it, which was Days of Future Past, the X Men movie, where when Logan wakes up at the end, everything seems to be normal and good and all this, and I'm just like, wait, no, things have changed, like you things that you were doing have changed where we're at, like everything's good now, Like everything's fine, And that was totally the end of this movie, where he just wakes up and it's like, no, everybody's good now, all right, but you know, but MUD's still dead and ultimately, like, I cannot believe that the climax of this movie is decided against the character's wishes and in a way, like Indiana Jones dying in the past, it could have worked, like I look, I think it could have, as much as I don't want to see Indiana Jones die, like he's effectively dead as a character anyways, because they're not doing anything else.

So, yes, he survived in the final closing minutes of his story, but to what end. Like Again, even ostensibly, if you were like, well, Indiana Jones in twenty twenty three is long fucking dead, that's what he is, because he would be like a hundred something now so's And that's the problem ultimately with all these movies that they had to set it in sixty nine because Harrison Ford is gonna say unforeseeably old, but he's so old that you can't cover up how old he is anymore. Like when four came out, it's like, oh, he's kind of he looks seventy. Yeah, yeah, he's seventy, but he looks damn late fifties early sixties, because again he's an actor and he takes good care of himself like he can. But here it's like, the guy is so old that we can't cover up the fact that he's old, which means the action has to be what it ends up being.

And because of that we have a movie that's it's climax is like I want to stay in the past. No you don't bang the end right, Yeah, I really would have liked to have had more of a conversation rather than them just yelling in ancient Greek to this befuddled Archimedes. And of course I keep thinking of Socrates from Bill and Ted's excellent Adventure too, and I'm waiting for you know, we're dust in the way. I would have prefer that. Again, it's just it has for a time travel movie, because this now is an Indiana Jones movie that's time travel.

It wastes every opportunity to do anything with it other than the one thing it does. And again notes the stack deck. Okay, that's really boring. Like, yeah, I get that it's kind of a trope now that the thing can only do it once. I mean again, the arc, the grail, the stones, the skull, But you want to do something different, dude, don't do that, then do something else, like have them fucking with the time travel thing and him going back and forward in time over and over again.

Like if you're gonna do it, dged Indiana Jones. Anyways, why not just go full fucking hog. I just don't understand, or have him interact with his younger self. Again, I don't get why they passed up all these opportunities, given what the budget of this movie is because guys, this movie's budget is like three hundred million dollars. It's one of the most expensive movies ever made.

Well, what's crazy to me and I'm actually just going to say that something about that budget. When we talk about the better time travel movies, which is most of them, you know, their budgets were so much smaller. And what's crazy to me is there was a time when we thought, you know, Batman for fifty million dollars was an outrageous budget. Now we're looking at three hundred million. And yeah, you have an account for you know, the time and stuff, but you look at like, you know, different kinds of movies.

But I was thinking of this, you know, like movies like The Godfather when you're going way back, but it's still proportionally nowhere close to what three hundred million dollars would have been. Or even something like pulp Fiction, which was like seven million you know today proportionally still nowhere close to three hundred million. Those are better movies. And so what the point I wanted to make that I thought was interesting and it's always been that way, is that great filmmakers have to find ways to work around a budget. Right if you only have so much money.

You have to find a way to make that budget work, and it seems like a lot of times they have to come up with more creative things to make that work. And in the opposite way, it seems like when you have three hundred million dollars, your creativity seems to go right out the window. And it's been that way with most of these gigantic budget movies. It's interesting to me because it's like, here's money, we don't need any intelligent anything. We'll rely on CGI everything.

I don't know, it's just it was just a thought I had though that it seems like so many great movies are made with no budget, and these movies suck for three hundred million. You think like Time Crimes, which cost probably two hundred dollars, right, absolutely, it is one of the best time travel movies ever. And what's crazy to me is, you know, even something like Endgame, Right, Okay, so the budget of Endgame was three hundred and fifty six million dollars. I could actually see where the budget of that movie went. I'm not even sure where the budget of this movie went.

Three hundred million, like three hundred million dollars for what, Well, and I was wondering, does the three hundred million? Does that include? They had to have a massive I mean there was a massive advertising campaign. Does that include in the three hundred million? Because at least I could see where that went.

It didn't help, but I can see where that went. But nothing in the movie other than a ridiculous amount of CGI speaks three hundred million to me. And it's not for acting because most of these actors, they're not three hundred million dollars actors. I mean, your plug, your biggest actor is going to be Harrison Forward. I mean, come on.

And then that shooting on location, I mean, the New York stuff is definitely just all a lot kind of stuff. I mean, and the camera is set up, I think exactly the same place for both when he walks out to go to work and then also when the salad walks out with the kids to go get ice cream. I think. So I'm just like, Okay, that's what we're doing. We're just going to shoot this from the exact same thing.

We just had a lockdown camera, probably shot him one right after the other. But man, oh man, it just seemed so yeah cheap in so many ways, And did somebody walk around with a walk out with a hundred million in their pocket. This is the budget of four. Again, two thousand and eight, the budget of four was one hundred and eighty five million, Like, what the what the fuck is going on? I just I genuinely don't understand, because, like to learn, I didn't realize going into the movie that it was such an expensive movie.

And frankly now it makes me kind of more perturbed at this movie because for this movie to be three hundred million dollars, there should be more. There should be more things go. The action should have been good, the action should have been compelling. Anything should have been compelling, because the only things that are compelling, I guess are what Harrison Ford doing Indiana Jones one more time in a version of Indiana Jones we've never seen before. I don't get what the point of the movie ultimately is because even at the end of the movie, they looney tunes themselves out of existence, and it's like, what is is this the end?

Or is there more to come? Like I just don't understand because you said there's no more, but but yes, stupid, yeah, the hat being pulled off the line. Yeah, like port surprise, there wasn't yeah the surprise, there wasn't a noise, good bye folks, and then he speeds off into the distance like it's I just don't understand, Like what was who was this for? And if whoever it was for, did they enjoy it? And I just died.

The amount of people that saw this movie feels like was it just for James Mangold? I mean, really, I don't imagine James Mangold had a good time on this movie. I just have a feeling that he didn't have a nice time because he was probably answering to a lot of executives on this right, That's what it feels like. Like the third act of this movie is the Worst Offender, But it feels like a film by committee. They were like, well, we like maybe James Mangold and David Kapp and some of the other folks fought for Harrison Ford to stay in the past.

Maybe they fought for it. Maybe they fought what I would consider to be the good fight. If you're making this kind of movie and you're addressing this kind of thing, which is he wants to be part of the past. He spent his entire life chasing the past and now he can be there, which is like a thing that almost seems impossible in the in the context of this time travel feels almost like a bridge too far. But yet he's there and he's in the past, So why go all the way and not give him that?

Like that would have been almost poetic, It really would have. At the time, I was like, don't end this way, And then when we ended with what we ended with, I think I was thinking, no, go back and end with that, right, right, yeah, yeah, It's like you have this opportunity to say, well, you know, I've I've ruined my life where I live now, and my only option is maybe to go back and live a life somewhere else and maybe leave a note for my future self, and like there you go, and you know, you could then have a Phoebe waller Bridge epilogue where in the future Mutt is still alive or something, and that's where that in road is where it's like, you know, Indiana Jones sacrificed himself some Mutt could live type thing and it doesn't even have to be life.

You could interject in there, I've ruined this series where I live now, and maybe I could go back I mean that would have been a bridge too far. I'm sorry, I honestly don't think that James Mangle really gets Indiana Jones. Like he was talking about the whole idea of the Archimedes dial thing, and he's talking about like, oh, yeah, I came up with that before we even did this because of time, and it's really about Indie getting old and blah blah blah. And I'm like, Okay, yeah, that's good, that all makes sense. I'm with you there.

But then he talks about how the Arc of the Covenant, that that was a test of Indiana's faith, that he didn't believe in any sort of spiritualism, that there's a bunch of hocus pocus to him. And I know he talks a little bit about hocus pocus, but when he brings up the Ark of the Covenant to those army guys, you can see the excitement in his face. He one percent believes that there is an arc. It's not like he doesn't believe in this thing. And the way he's just like, didn't you guys ever go to Sunday School.

I mean, when they're when they're talking about Tannis, He's just like, oh, Tannis. You know, he's just so excited about it. I don't think that he was testing his faith in that movie. I think that James Mangold is totally off base with that ink. To me, this movie smacks of again, to go back to James Bond.

This smacks of what Sam Mendez tried to do with Skyfall and Specter, where it's like, we're gonna have amusing on the character of James Bond and what really drives it. Who is he as a man, and what does he do and what it's like. You know, I just want to be this guy for once. I don't fucking give a shit if he's gonna cook breakfast for himself, if he's gonna eat a waffle or a pancake, I give a shit about what adventure he's going on, because that's the way that I get that we want to have amusing on the finale of a character, and you want to have Phoebe waller Bridge calling him a tomb raider and a Gray Robert or whatever. It's fine, you're gonna do that, but you don't have to.

You could just make a movie that is in the vein of the other movies that were in the vein of other things intentionally that weren't trying to be some musing on faith or other bullshit. They were just action movies and for once, I want to be that guy to just go. They were just fucking action movies and that's why we loved them, not because they were some introspective anything. And then they try to do this and it's like, man, see what I mean, Like it just doesn't really work. When you did that Sam Mendez voice, I was thinking, I really wish he had been with us.

Also, you know when we did the George Lucas and all these guys, because I would have been kind of he sounded like he had it going on. Man, Yeah, he understands the Bond character. Okay, his brother. You see, we're gonna introduce a brother character that's the dark James Bond. Cool.

It's just like you don't. You don't understand what people love about the character. And because you don't understand, you inject your own beliefs and ideas into it, which is fine, but that's not a hollow void. There are things there already that you're kind of believing aren't there and pushing out of the way for your own stuff. And then you're surprised when the fans and people that love these series that have been around for thirty forty years ago.

I'm not a big fan of this, Like it's just a little too much, I mean, and I think Mangold's a darn goood director. Really love what he did with Logan though I think a lot of that comes from the Scott Frank script of Memory Serves. But I mean, Jess Butterworth, his brother John Henry, they're really pretty solid writers as well. David Kepp I have some issues with here and there, not always like in everything that he's done, though he's done some great stuff. But man oh man ah.

Just for me, my final thought is thinking about Indiana with the whip in the scene where they're doing the auction and he brings out the whip and he's whipping around and everybody's freaking out, and then they all pull out guns. That's where there needs to be a punchline, and there really is no punchline. Like the punchline, I guess is maybe the pulling out of the guns, but there needs to be something else after that, and all that happens is they just fall to the ground like he and Phoebe Wallerber is just ducked down. I'm like, that's it. That's your solution to stuff.

As they're shooting all the guns, You're just going to duck down in here. So and it worked, it works, But that's a new way that scene. Hey, I did real real quick. Can I hit on one thing? It's very short since I know we're wrapping up.

You know what I thought was one of the I actually, I'm gonna maybe it didn't affect you guys this way, but I was giddy in one little part and it was on the fucking train. But there was one part that I thought was fun moving back that I forgot to mention, and no one else mentioned the part when that big gun on top of the train gets stuck and it just keeps firing and the train is going around the bend and it's just picking off Nazi one by one by one. I thought that was awesome. Now, if anything else in the movie had been as fun as that, I would love this movie. Anyway.

I just thought that was great. That was a really good thing. And the sound of the gun sound right, really good. Oh yeah, it was great. Yeah, And seeing all those Nazis being picked off because it's always fun to watch Nazis get killed.

Let's be honest, Yeah, yeah, always. I ain't gonna lie this is I almost wondered, this is a pro Nazi punching podcast, so I was gonna make the joke. I almost wondered if the reason that this movie is flopping at the box offices because there are now so many Nazi sympathizers and they knew that the Nazis were not going to win, therefore they did not want to go. But that is only a theory, just like the card game thing, It's just a theory. There are movie fans on both sides, good people on both sides, good people on bosis, but not really Andy, do you want to give your final thoughts first?

Or should I mixed bag? I wanted it to be better. I liked some of it. Probably I was a little bit of a stand in that, you know, I talked about the beginning part. It didn't really bother me that much.

But like I said, my enthusiasm for the movie. I came in with it super high. I was going to accept a lot as long as it didn't take place in the fridge. But it got more and more into the fridge as it went, I just I don't know, I lost my enthusiasm and the last third was mostly boring for me. So thankfully this is the last time that we ever have to talk about Indiana Jones.

And I say thankfully only because the final movie, I think kind of. I don't think it did anything better worse than four in terms of leaving the character in a spot that's interesting. I think for was a little bit more of a resounding success in the terms of how we left to the character of Indiana Jones, and that the journey he goes on, he finds out that he's a dad, he finds out that he has a son that's kind of an ass like he is. He reunites with Marian, and he saves the day, and you know, John hurts along for the ride. And by the end of this movie, sure, I guess Salah and Marian are there and they went for ice cream and who the fuck knows, frankly, And you know, I as an Indiana Jones fan who remembers when he was too short to go on the ride at Disneyland, when he went when he was six, who had a fedora, who wanted to be an archaeologist and had the Temple a Doom poster in his room for twelve years, essentially this movie.

I can't believe it, but I fell asleep for like two or three minutes in this movie when they were underwater like and I'm ashamed to admit it, but it for me kind of speaks to more where I came into this movie. After the fourth movie. I was so jaded that I was not for this movie. I was just hoping it wouldn't be an affront, And there are some parts that I enjoyed, but I think ultimately I'm glad this is the last time we have to talk about Indiana Jones. But I'm glad that the three of us got to talk about Raiders at the Lost Dark for six hours, which I think, for me is what I will always think about when I think in this movie is the reading of the Lost Dark as opposed to the Dial of Destiny.

Ultimately being kind of the worst of all five. The best part of the movie was us getting to talk about Yeah, it was good teeing you guys. Again. I'm not that huge of a fan of Last Crusade, but them riding off into the sunset was the way to end this whole franchise like that gives that hits me more emotionally than anything four or five ever did. And I think I read on the ring or they were like four and five or less sequels and more epilogus to the first three.

And yeah, but unneeded epilogues, unfortunately. And you know, I refer to this entertainment weekly that I had as a kid in the late nineties early two thousands, and it was all about sequels and things in development. Hell, and they talked about Indiana Jones four, And to think that we now have Indiana Jones five. If I could go back and tell myself then, like you're not only going to get four, but you're also gonna get five. Like it's still crazy.

I can't believe that it happened. But like, please stop with these sequels. We like, we need to start doing We need to start understanding that the pop culture things that people used to get animated about don't do it for people anymore. And if you want to make money in this show business, you gotta stop going back to the well because I think it's dry. No.

What I think we should do, guys, we should all just take a vacation to a beach in Hawaii and start pitching ideas. Yeah, all right, I got this guy, hear me out, Indiana Smith. Right, they wouldn't let us make an Indiana Jones movie, SOID We're gonna make our own character, Indiana Smith. All right? What is the one Cleveland Smith or whatever?

The yeah? Yeah? Do you remember Mike White At the end of the nineties one we were going to do that book on the unproduced Screenplays, and there were a shit load of Indiana Jones screenplays, which all got obviously crammed into the last movie before this. But I just thought of that that was great. And at the time we were like, these are so weird ideas, you know, and now here we are, and I wish they'd maybe made those instead of these movies.

Yeah. I much rather would have had a monkey that has a peach pit that makes you immortal. That would have been pretty great. I mean again, I come back to the Indiana Jones video games that I played as a kid. Fate of Atlantist, fucking hum.

The other one, the one where it's like in China and it takes place right before Temple of Doom, Like fuck, just just don't don't do this this I don't know, like you know what. The Mummy was the best Indiana Jones sequel. Fucking fucking fight me on that one. Guys, Come on, you know how bad these are? Is it?

Atari? I'm going back here. Atari twenty six hundred had the Raiders of the Lost Art game, which was awful. I mean it was terrible and I played the shit out of that and it was so bad, and yet it was better than these movies. James Mangold, it's all good, it's all yeah, you know what et this this makes this is like et It's just like there's a bridge too far.

Just just go away. Indiana. Well, thank you so much Chris and Andrew who have been with me on this incredibly long journey talking about Raiders of the Lost Ark. It's taken a year almost for us to put this together, which is kind of wild. But thank you Chris for reminding me that there was a fifth Indiana Jones movie last year.

And Mike, why are we doing what are you doing this for? Something? Right? Like? Okay, you gave me purpose, Chris.

Thank you guys for putting up with me. I was late to twice I think on this. Thank you guys both so much Spielberg, I mean the Spielberg and has to get in the way somehow. I'm fashionably late, you know. So, Chris, what is happening with you lately?

Sir? Not a whole lot, just not going to the movies, not seeing new movies, but talking about movies on the Culture Cast, which you can find over at Weirdingwaymedia dot com, along with the aforementioned reading of The Lost Dark on the Projection Booth, RSS feed, or plenty of other things like Andy and I did an episode on Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas a couple months back, which was awesome, a fun one. So that's where you can find all the things that I work on Weirdingwaymedia dot com. And Andy, you always give me a run for my money when it comes to being busy. What is going on with you these days?

So I'll just cut it down to three books. I've got two that just came out and one that's coming out. The two that just came out, one is a novel which is a sequel of my novel Layliss Score, which is called Layliss Gone, but moviewise I just had the book on Watermelon Man come out. It's called Melvin Van Peebles Watermelon Man. And the other thing is I have the oral History of The Room finally coming out in December.

Very proud of both of those. Beyond that, I've got a couple of books in the future that I'm working on for Applause books, Gay and if I live long enough, they will get tinished and it will be great times for all of us. It's pretty funny. In the editing that I was doing of reading at the Lost Arc sessions, we were talking so much about the Room because you were working on a book at the time, and I was like to call back. It was like half an hour, I think, discussing the Room and Tommy and all that stuff, and I was just like, holy God, we were talking a lot about The Room.

And then I remembered, oh, yeah, India was right in the middle of writing that book. I'd rather watch The Room than these two Indiana Jones movies. I was thinking the same thing. Thank you so much for guys for being on the show. Thanks everybody for listening.

Again. If you want to hear more of me shooting off my mouth, check out some of the other shows that I work on Like Chris, they are all available on weirdingwaymedia dot com. Thanks especially to our Patreon community. If you want to join the community, visit patreon dot com slash Projection Booth. Every donation leaguet helps the projection Booth dick over the world