Dhoom

Weirding Wavedia. Hello everyone, and welcome to the Bollywood Cinema Club, a podcast where we take a look at films from the Indian subcontinent, not just Bollywood films. But hey, you and I both know that a lot of Westerners don't even know that there is anything other than Bollywood films, which is unfortunate. I am your host, Chris Dashe. I do host the Culture Cast, which is the show that this one essentially has spun off from in these subsequent episodes since on this episode of the Bollywood Cinema Club, we will be taking a look at two thousand and four's Doom and joining me to talk about that film is a good friend of mine.

He is a screenwriter. He wrote Under Siege two, Dark Territory, The Mothman Prophecies, and he is currently an executive producer on DC Titans. If you've listened to the Culture Cast before, you have heard his voice. But now he is gracing this podcast with his presence. Your friend and mine, one Richard HadAM.

Chris, thank you so much for having me on. Your reputation precedes you. Because this is a new show of yours, I have to bring a certain level of decorum. I've become very lax on other shows, and now I want to bring a certain level of respectability to this. I want your new listeners to understand that I am a very thoughtful cinema watcher.

I've already blown it, Okay, it's just me. Well, I was wanting to say, so, you not only are a screenwriter, but you also you teach screenwriting. Yeah, I'm doing a class at UCLA right now. It's it's more about television, which is how I've spent the last twenty years of my career. As you mentioned, you know, DC Titans on HBO Max.

I've been on that since the beginning and we So the class that I teach is more about television, and it's not exactly a scriptwriting class as much as it is a sort of what is the DNA of television? A television pilot or a television show, and and how can you take your idea and and sort of arrange it in such a way that it can live and prosper as a long running television series. So, speaking of long running series, Richard, this movie that we're gonna be talking about has not one, but two sequels to it. Why you ask primarily because it's so successful. A movie with two sequels unheard of?

Yeah, right, three four? A movie with two sequels, and that's where it ends ostensibly. Now that actually, yeah, that is unheard of anymore in this day and age. Yeah, jeez, Louise. So yeah, on this episode of the Bollywood Cinema Club, we're gonna be taking a look at Sunjay Godvey's twenty or two thousand and four classic Doom.

So. The film is written by VJ. Krishna Aksharya and it stars Abishek Bachchan, who should whose last name should sound familiar to you, Richard, because he is Amita bak Chan's son obviously, I mean he looks like his dad. Also stars John Abraham, Uday Chopra, Isha Doel and Remi Sen, and the film centers around Abishek Bachchan's Jai Dixit, a police officer who is tasked with taking down a gang of criminals who are robbing, just robbing people. They're on a tear.

They're they're going on a tear. And that gang is led by Kabir Sharma played by John Abraham, a charismatic gang leader, and Abishek Bachchan has to figure out a way to get in with the gang, and he runs a us Ooday chopras Ali, a bike racer who considers himself a police officer. Whether or not he actually is is a completely different story. And that is more or less the cast. We do have some some female characters in the periphery, but for the most part, it's our three main characters, Ji, Kabir and Ali.

So, Richard, I know you had never seen this before, and this is also very unlike the other Indian cinema films that we've watched together. So give me kind of your initial thoughts on watching Doom. Well, I mean, this was an incredibly fun movie. I mean I really enjoyed it. I spent most of my time.

I don't know if this is fair, but because Western cinema is my only reference point, I spent a lot of times sort of sorting through what the possible influences were from Western cinema on this because they're they're they're fairly overt. I yes, almost almost to a point where the if you saw the poster, I think you would more or less kind of get a pretty good idea of what this movie at least is going to be. Tertiarily about like you could probably figure out kind of what this movie is just by looking at the poster. Well, so far from what I've I've maybe seen five Bollywood films, But what I enjoy about them the most, and I think they've all been in association with one of your shows, but the fact that that sort of every genre is represented in the same movie at the same time, musical numbers, you know, it's thriller, it's comedy, it's drama, it's it's everything that's I love that same and and it feels fairly seamless, and somehow it all lives of a piece.

This is not a kind of filmmaking I would have quote unquote approved of after film school. You know, it would have been like pick a tone, and I would have seen the representation of various tones and even genres at the same time in the same movie as a sign of lack of directorial control or lack of narrative control. But that's not what Bollywood films are about, at least that's so far. That's what I'm that's my takeaway as a Western viewer. So I really enjoyed this as I was looking at it, and some people have said, oh, it's the Bollywood Fast and the Furious.

And I think they say that because there is a motorcycle element and sort of a racing competition element to this. But in a weird way, I was almost I was almost seeing more bad boys. I was seeing some Will Smith, Martin Lawrence. I also saw a lot of Oceans eleven or the Oceans series with the and it's more like a specific moment in this film that and well, I'm sure we'll talk about it, but it's a specific kind of storytelling technique that they use in a scene that is very evocative, and it evokes a thing that they do in the Oceans movies, like multiple times throughout those movies, where it's the reveal where it's it's being revealed and you're seeing flashbacks of what's going on while it's being revealed, and they do it in one scene multiple times recontextualizing it.

This movie does it to pretty good effect at the end, but that at the time would have been like right out of the Oceans movies. Like if you're watching this as a Westerner in two thousand and four, you're like, that's from the Oceans movies. But you know what, like the Oceans movies. It's like they came up with that idea. It's not like they're the ones who invented it, just like Fast and the Furious didn't invent a car heist movie either.

It's it's that's the insanity of people going, well, it's like Fast and Furious, Well, and Fast and the Furious is like death race. Fast and the Furious is like gone in sixty seconds. Like to say something is like something else is inspired by it as one thing, but directly whole cloth, Ripping something off and transposing it into your film is something different. Well, it almost feels like if you if you're if you're taking one thing and and and there's like one other movie that is super influencing your movie. To me, that seems a little less okay, right, the movie that's like grabbing from ten movies.

You know, it's like, right, agree with you. Here's our Bad Boys part, here's our Beverly Hills Cop part. Here's you know, sort of the Fast and the Furious element. Okay, now is our Oceans eleven? Now you're just grabbing from a lot of things that sort of live in the same action comedy genre.

You're just grabbing from a bunch of them. I think, you know, maybe the only genre they didn't grab from was horror. Uh, there was no natural angle in this movie, which was fine with me, believe me. Well, well, there might be a supernatural angle at the end, given that there are two sequels and the character survive, so you know, but supernatural inasmuch as like any of these kinds of movies ever have a character going over a cliff and surviving, Like right, well, I mean again, like it has the sort of joyful, knowing indulgence of a style or a moment that like, in a way, the mood I was in watching this was the mood I was in watching The Mummy with Brendan Frasier. Sure, you know, it's just like, look, you know what we're doing.

We know what we're doing. We all know that it's on a certain level absurd. Let's just let's just accept that, put it on the table between us, and now let's enjoy ourselves. We're not going to break a lot a lot of we're not gonna break a sweat trying to convince you that this Mummy is a real thing that could really happen. We're gonna have some fun.

And they tell you early, and as long as the movie tells you early what it's all about, then I'm in and it sticks with it. So I was I was having a good time start to finish. I misspoke. John Abraham does not come back in either of the sequels, so he jumps off the cliff at the end of his movie to his death. Well, and you know what's funny is that that did not leave a bitter taste in your mind.

No, it's earned. And I think you know to your point. And this is something I've said on almost every episode we've ever talked about an Indian cinema film, but you beat me to it, so I will echo it. The naturalistic quality to these films is what has drawn me to them because there is this and I think you clearly have mentioned it. In Western cinema, there's an expectation that it's a horror movie, right, so be a horror movie.

And it's like, if you're trying to make a movie about the way people interact with each other in reality, it's not that easy because most people aren't running into those kinds of things on a daily basis. People do deal with horrible things, but they're not necessarily dealing with Michael Myers chasing them to the house. You want to do that movie and lean on those conventions, fine, But if you want to make a movie where it's just existing in the real world and the things that are happening are crazy, but it still exists inside the context of a real world, then why wouldn't there be multiple tone styles? One one day is different from another in your own personal life, some days are going to be good, bad, some are going to be a mix of the two.

To say it has to be to put a binary focus on art or which is you know, cinema is art is to miss the point of why you're doing it to begin with. To put an automatic constraint on yourself is fine if you want to, but you shouldn't feel like you have to or need to. Well yeah, not only that, but and again I don't know, so please listeners forgive my ignorance of you know, current Indian pop culture or Indian pop culture from two thousand and four, for instance. I don't know if Esche dial is a is primarily known as a pop star or as an actress, or if she just sort of does everything. But I almost felt like the role she played in this movie would be the role somebody like you know, Madonna or Shania Twain or something like like, somebody's primarily known from music if they got cast in a movie, and the feeling on the part of the filmmakers would be, well, if we're going to have this pop star in the movie, let's have her do some pop star stuff, Let's have her perform, And so then they just create opportunities for that to happen.

Same thing with a Riney sen At. The movie opens with a big musical number that she is doing, and I'm like, I'm watching her and I'm going, well, this is great. And maybe she's just an actress who can sing and dance, or maybe that's how she's primarily known, or maybe there's less of a distinction when it comes to, you know, Indian movies and music and culture that they're they're just sort of like, yeah, there's there's no giant firewall between pop star movie star, and they can just move freely between one and the other, which is actually, in Western film a difficult thing to pull off. Well, so here's the thing. So in Indian cinema, the people that are singing the songs are not the actors on screen, So most of the time it's actors lip syncing to actual artists singing the songs.

So instead of doing like a Sweeney Todd where it's a Johnny Depp's gonna sing or Lala Land, it's we're gonna pay actual recording artists to sing and then you will do you know, you lip sync to it in the musical numbers. And but but at the same time, that's because these musical numbers are just part of these films. That's just it's just part of it. It's it has to have something. It feels like it feels like our way of saying it has to have something for everyone.

But I don't think that's what it is. What I feel like the more and more and watch these movies is it's not we feel committed to having something for everyone. It's we just this is part of the way we tell our stories, right, It's to have music and to have big, bombastic love love triangles with characters or characters falling madly in love. I mean, we've seen I mean so many of the themes of this movie. I've been echoed in d war and Shole, these other movies that we saw that are from twenty thirty, forty years before this, but they're talking about the same basic human things that I think again, a lot of these films that we've seen are touching at the core basic human emotions and feelings, but wrapping it in these movies about you know, motorcycles and heists, or brothers separated by different sides of the law, or you know, I forget show le what the conflict there was, but at the core, it's still about the relationships between the people at their core, And like American cinema doesn't do that as much anymore, unfortunately, or ever, or if we ever did put that as the primary focus to begin with, well, it's just it's just a different way of telling stories.

So over the end credits of this movie, there was a woman singing what was sort of one of the main themes of the movie, but she wasn't one. It was not Rene sand or excher Diol, So I don't know who that was, but but it did sort of make me feel like, oh, wait a second, is this the woman now who popularized that song and now we're seeing her do it or something, because that is a that is not one of our two leads in that final closing credit sequence, which which sort of feeds into it's like, I guess it's very accepted that, oh, okay, we're not expecting this actor to do all these things. But what's funny about it is when I went on IMDb and looked up these actors um Abishek back Shan and Ude Chopra, they their bios run six seven eight paragraphs and there it's it's actor, writer, producer, singer.

Then we get their whole CV where it's like, oh, they, you know, went to this university and studied engineering and then worked in this you know, other industry and then took up filmmaking and then and it's like, oh my god, all of these people do everything. So again, things aren't siloed off even in terms of the individual artists' careers. They are clearly there's no boundaries, you know, at least in terms of Bollywood, in terms of what people are accepted in terms of how they want to pursue their creative careers. They can do whatever they want and are accepted at different points as different things. A lot of these actors seem to have gone from acting and possibly writing to then directing and producing, and they kind of moved back and forth depending on what strikes them, and then they're also pop stars or in the case of John Abraham, models, I think that's sort of how he's primarily known.

She was a model as well. I totally believe it. Yeah, than any of these people are models. But I mean, I think Uday Chopra that's like the most interesting in terms of on screen character because if at first you're like, oh, okay, I get it, this is the this is the comic relief. So this guy is clearly a comedian and that's how he's known to Indian audiences.

And then so I'm like, so, what what's his equivalent here? You know, is it sort of Michael Myers or Mike Myers rather not Michael Myers the murderer from Halloween have to make that goddamnestation, you know, it's like like who is he? Is he Martin Short? You know? Is he somebody else?

But then he is an amazing dancer. Then the movie asks him to participate in a long fight sequence where he's clearly athletic and a great fighter and stuntman. I can do all that. So it's like, oh, even there, it's it's not siloed off. It's not like you are here for comedy and comedy alone.

It's like, oh no, he's doing musical numbers. He's doing it all well. And again I think that's what for me is the draw for something like, for something like this film specifically, is the charismatic leads in Indian cinema do everything they're expected, like you said, to do everything so saying and dancing and being in love but also kicking ass like that. Those those expectations are not only I get, I think a culturally expected, but then I think well executed. Particularly in this movie.

I think all three of the leads very charismatic. I mean, Abbishek Bachchan Apple doesn't fall far from the tree obviously, Geezily's. I mean, you could have worse parents than your dad being one of the five most important actors in Indian history. But then you do, like you said, you get John Abraham, who's good in his own right. I mean he's not doing much, but he's doing as much as he can to not be of It's one of those things where they can't make He's not really a villain, right, He's not a bad He's not a battie He's only a villain by circumstance, by what he's doing, not by his actions.

Really, I guess his actions again, Like he's just robbing people. He's a somewhat of a victimless crime in this movie. Yeah, the um his character engine isn't fueled with you know, rage, He's not a psychopath. There's not a huge backstory about how he feels the world has treated him poorly. He's just he's a guy who apparently is really smart and has figured out a way to pull off some heists, and at a certain point he's going to be done once they do their last one.

He's taken off with the money and he's gonna go relax. It's not like he's going to go build you know, a space laiser or use the money to buy a nuclear bomb from terrorists and kill a million people. He's not that kind of bad guy. He's just you know, good looking and likes excitement. Remember when the Fast and Furious movies were just about simple things like stealing money, Like that's that's what this movie.

Watching this movie feels like it feels like a return to a time that we don't make movies like this anymore. Low stakes action movies like everything has to be the world is ending, and you know, some of the giant laser shooting into the sky or the giant blue sky beam of whatever destructive power. We don't even the fast and furious movies. The movies that were influencing this movie are now big, bombastic space action movies. Like I appreciate that this movie is you know, it came out O four, but it feels very much like nineties action movies.

It honestly feels, you know, a lot like some of the Hong Kong cinema with Jackie Chan, Like you you could put Jackie Chan and uh, you know, I don't know who else, Choo y Unfat. You could have Jackie Chan and Chao y Unfat in this movie. Jackie Chan could play the day Chopper part, Chao Yunfat could play the Abbischik Boxton part, and then John Abrat like you know what I mean, like it sh it's perfect, Like it's it. The story is so universal that you could watch this movie even without the subtitles on, and I think you would still understand what's going on because the characters are painted so broadly, which I've said every time I do this show. But that is what I love is because they're painted so broadly, they feel like real people.

They really do like they even though it's a broadly painted character. The actors inhabit the role so believably that I don't think it's an actor. I think it's the character. Yeah, and it's funny you talk about the subtitles. There was a lot of times where where at various points, I'm like, do I even need to be reading these?

I'd rather just watch the people. I don't think I'm going to get confused. I think if I just watch the visuals, I'll be able to get ninety nine percent of the story I'm supposed to get. There was very little I thought I was missing. But it was one thing that surprised me, though, is that, you know, at the end of the movie, they didn't They didn't go very far, like it wouldn't have taken much, but they kind of didn't circle back on Ali's wish to have, you know, the love of his life.

You kind of get the feeling that maybe Sheina is going to be in his future somewhere, but they don't. They don't bring that back, And I was a little bit surprised and you don't even see Sweetie again. Sweetie kind of drops out, and then at the end it's just those two guys, And of course I'm always figuring backward going. Well, then structurally this is a This is then a love story between those two guys. I don't mean a sexual love story.

I mean that's the relationship to watch, right, the evolving relationship of these two guys. And if if we don't see in front of us that Ali gets the woman of his dreams, he does get the dream of crossing that hazy line from criminal to cop, which he clearly wants to do, right, which which is such a fun and interesting and different character. How many times have we seen characters like Ali? Very infrequently do we see a character who wants to be a cop who is a thief of his own volition? Like like, this is what I want?

Wait what like and to the point where there are two more movies and spoilers for the next one shouldn't come as no surprise. He is now a cop, so obviously, but like to your point, it's funny they play with your expectations and the conventions at the beginning of this movie, where you do kind of expect that it's going to have more of the romance lean or angle, and it kind of does, and I think, I think to your point, it also does underserve it a little bit. I think you could have had some sort of conclusion with at least the Eschadol character, because it does feel like it's not wrapped up. But again, at the same time, it doesn't necessarily need to be, because the main story between the two leads is and their interactions with Caber.

That comes to a logical conclusion that I think really works. But it does kind of leave some ends kind of loose and hanging, even if they didn't need to be tied up necessarily. Yeah, Like I guess, sweetie, we know that they're you know, she's married to Dry We get it. You know, there was there you go like, it's not nothing's changing. Yeah, nothing's changing there, you know.

And and there's just that final moment with Sina where you do get you know, she doesn't want to tell him, but she repeats one of his lines, and it's just enough to tell us that she's like, Okay, that the cold surface might be melting a little. You know, this guy's put in the time in the work to actually be around me. Okay, I might, I might be slightly open to the possibility that's something will happen between us. And yeah, I mean again, like I don't think the movie needed that love story or that romance between the two of them, and clearly the movie didn't think so either, given that it doesn't really I mean again, if that's the kind of way that they're concluding it, perfectly fine. And she's not in the second or third movie, so really no.

Yeah, so holding that off, it's like, well, he'll they make they make such a deal and the and I love the you know, thank you mommy, you know, his constant looking to his dead mother in heaven to uh to send a woman his way. But but I'll see. I assume maybe in the second and the third one they finally get together or you get together with somebody. Well, see, this movie came out in o four and the most recent, Doom, came out in twenty thirteen, kays covering, So that's three movies over the course of a decade. Yeah, and the third movie, uh has a Mere Khan in it as the lead.

And he's he's one of the I mean, he's in the top five. Choprah and Amishek Bakshan. Are they in it? They are, They're in the next two. So they're in the next two, but the kind of surrounding cast changes.

They're the lethal weapon, they're the bad boys. They're right forty eight hours okay, right, which I mean again makes sense given the way that this story plays out, and given the way that they tell this story, and the relationship is clearly the relationship of the two with the two of them is the centerpiece of this entire franchise, clearly if show up in the other two. So but but I'll tell you what, Abbishek Bachchan is a fantastic lead. He works really well in this role. Yeah, he's great, and he's funny when he needs to be funny in a very low key way.

You know. I gotta tell you, Chris, I almost don't know. I almost don't know how to talk about a Bollywood movie because I don't know what I'm supposed to compare it to or expect from it. We're Westerners watching his movies, so we're bringing our perspective to it. No one is expecting us to have a complete Bollywood history at our fingertips.

That's the point of this point of this podcast is twofold to introduce Westerners to Bollywood films, but also give people who watch these movies in India and a sense of what Westerners think of their movies and show that we can appreciate these movies. We're not just watching Slumdog Millionaire and that's it. Well, but you know what I mean, like you you you you live in Los Angeles, you unto. We have friends from the South Southeast Asian subcontinent. If you told them that you'd watch Doom, they would be surprised.

Oh yes, shocked. If you told them you watch Shole, they might be even more surprised. I'm trying to change that because these movies are fucking amazing. Every single one of these movies that I have watched, for the most part, has been really good in a not surprising way. Yeah.

I mean, two of the writers on Titans a writing team, Josh Levy and Prafica Stern Vasson. They do a web series called Bally Weird and U and it's sort of again bridging the gap between you know, what people know of Bollywood films and and then sort of American romantic comedies. Interesting both and there are very few people I know, though, that talk about Bollywood at all or have ever seen a Bollywood movie, which is a fucking shame. Yeah, the ones that I've watched because of you, So I mean, the the barest skimming of the surface, maybe five movies. My takeaway is seeing feeling like I recognize a Western influence and being aware after a while of oh this could this is gonna sort of you know, criss cross between genres and storytelling modes and and so don't expect it to just be a comedy or a drama, or a thriller or a melodrama or a musical.

Okay, and I wouldn't even consider any of these musicals. It's movies with musical numbers, which which But the issue is in Western cinema there, that's not a thing. You don't have movies with musical numbers that are not primarily musical films. That's just not a thing you're not making. I mean, I guess is the closest thing, like the sound of music, something like that, like a Rogers and hamp But even then, like there's yeah, even then it's a musical like this is that's I think for a lot of Western audiences, the hardest thing to wrap their head around is the injection of pure, unadulterated joy into these movies through the form of the music and the infectious spirit of the Indian subcontinent.

Like that's really what it is. The Indian the continent of India is a vibrant, beautiful place, as someone who has been there, and it comes through in their films so strong it like that's for me, that's the biggest takeaway anytime I watch one of these is I feel the spirit of the people who made these movies strongly every time I watch one. And I can't say that for a lot of Western cinema, no, most Western cinema, even Jesus. I've enjoyed each one of the movies I've seen simply based on entertainment value, just the sheer sort of enthusiasm and desire to be a entertaining It's almost like the it's almost like the rule is, don't be boring, right exactly, And some of these movies have been three hours long and have every right to have sort of long, self indulgent down spots, but they really don't.

So so that's my entire takeaway from what I've seen and I've I mean, I think the oldest one that we watched was from the seventies and and all the way through, you know, extremely recent, you know when was gully Boy. That's the most recent one that we watched. That was like twenty thirteen at least. But even then, like you you understand when you watch that movie, you understand the point of view from the of the people that are making it. It comes through without even having to be said, you it just it's it's very apparent why these movies are being made, and the feelings and the emotions of the people behind them come through throughout the film and in the musical numbers and the dialogue, in the way that they're shot well, and the and the actors are so crazy arismatic, Like I never get why more of them have not crossed over.

Maybe it's maybe they don't feel the need to cross over into America. I wouldn't. The audience in India is bigger. I mean, Jackie Chan at a certain point was like, well, you know, I've got fans in America and you know in the West, why don't I do a few of those? And because the audience in America was bigger, the audience in India is bigger than the audience in America, and the audience in Hong Kong is a lot smaller than the audience in America was.

And I also think, to be fair, Jackie Chan had a much easier hill to climb what he was doing, somebody else had already come along and opened the door for him. He just walked through the door on his hands as opposed to walking through on his feet, you know, I mean, like Bruce Lee opened the door for that, and then he, you know, was doing the whole Charlie Chaplain meets Bruce Lee thing, because I stand by that's what Jackie Chan is. He's just the next most logical step in the Charlie Chaplain and Buster Keaton line of like now we're taking it into combat slapstick, not just self slapstick, which was essentially also just a further kind of refining of the three stooges. Really yeah, oh for sure, right, And when he's making movies, he's clearly I mean, he's he has seen and loved all of those, right, But but it does I don't know, I'm like, wow, if I was a you know, Warner Brothers Universal, you know, Paramount and Netflix whatever.

I'd be like, why not just why not get these people? Why not pursue them to do anything? Because they can clearly do anything. They can do. You know, these are actors who are adept in ways that American actors really are.

There's no demand on American actors to dance, there is no demand on American actors to sing or even lip sync. Choreography is not an expectation. If you can do those things, great, no one's gonna hold it against you, but you will rarely be asked to do it. It's used as like a fun fact, like with Chris walk In, where it's like, did you know he's also a classically trained dancer. It's like if I you know, why I don't know that, because like there's been like three or four movies that have ever done it.

And one of his best roles, shockingly actually uses his abilities to the best of his abilities, Hairspray. He's amazing in that movie and he's singing and dancing in it. Shocking. Oh yeah, no, yeah, no, it's great. And look, anytime I see an American actor who was able to do any of those things.

And by the way, fifty years ago it was not uncommon. Fifty years ago, I would not have been or sixty or seventy or eighty. However far back you want to go, it wouldn't have been shocking for me to see Carrie Grant dance or sing, to see Jimmy Stewart dance or sing. They didn't do it a lot, but if they did it, I wouldn't have been taken aback because my assumption would have been, oh yeah, back in the day, you had to be a triple threat minimum because you would come up as a chorus boy or a member of the chorus in a Broadway show before you emerged as a lead. So you probably spend a lot of your youth learning basic tap, basic vocal expression.

You'd be able to do this stuff. Then you get to the seventies where it's you know, it's it's a different kind of acting. I'm not waiting for al Pacino to sing. I'm not waiting for Robert de Niro or Dustin Hoffman to sing. I'm glad they don't.

I've seen now Pacino sing in that commercial for doun Cuccino from Jack and Jill. It's not great. There's a reason al Pacino doesn't sing. Yeah, yeah, that was not something anyone was asking them to do at the time that they became famous. So all they wanted was be real.

That's great and there, and these are great actors and I love them. But my point is, when you've got someone who can do everything, why don't we have more movies that that give us the whole meal? Why are we only eating off of one section of the buffet table. I don't know, man, That's what I've been saying this whole time. I don't get it.

I don't get American expecttions or Western expectations with film anymore. Because when people make a movie that's a horror movie that isn't straight horror, it's not enough of a horror movie that's genre bending, and it's like, shut up about the genre bending. Why does anything need to be sorted? Like, are we not at the point now where everything that is going to be made has been made and now we're just riffing on the things that have been made in substantive and exciting ways. Like I was thinking about this the other day when I was in the car.

I've all the good movies been made, and now we're just remaking them. And making something that's already amazing even a little bit better. But the core concepts aren't changing. That's where we are now. Like but and that, in my mind, kind of devalues the genre system, because the genre system is just this is this box, and I like horror movies.

It's like, but I'd like horror movies, but I would like my horror movies to do more and be more because now you don't have to just do the one thing. Think me really strange, And of course I think it comes from the top, even if it was an independent production, for a Western director to take on a film that was going to intentionally have most you know, big big musical numbers and then big action numbers, you know, or big action sequences aspects of a thriller with suspense, and then comedy there. Well, i'll tell you this, by the way, forget singing and dancing. Let's just talk about comedy. When I started working in television, which is when I began to have actual daily interaction with actors, right, I just assumed they could all do comedy.

I just Almo thought the lids like, I'm at Richard, you're a funny guy. You hang out with funny people. Your wife's funny, I like, but I'm writing, you know, mothman prophecies, and yet in my normal life I'm joking around, and so it's I go every everybody's got a sense of humor. Everyone can be funny and perform comedy. And man, a number of times I have run into the brick wall of a talented, charismatic television actor who absolutely cannot do comedy.

It is like asking them to juggle chainsaws, and and sometimes that's how they look at it, Like you asking me to do comedy is like asking me to do nudity. Like you don't. You don't just walk up with that. You've got to let me know weeks in advance, and then I've got to hire a consultant or or even worse. Oh, of course I can do comedy.

And then you see their attempt so and that, ladies and gentlemen, is how Jingle All the Way was made. It has stuck with me since the film came out that some I don't remember who somebody's. A review of the movie said that Schwarzenegger has the comedic timing of a dead mouse. Well, but it's weird because he's so charismatic. He's charismatic, but like if you see him on you know shows, he's funny, Yeah, very funny.

He has a sense of humor. He has a sense of humor about himself. Even in the Terminator movies, there are moments of comedy where it's intentional and he does it in a very specific way that is going to be funny, even if it's deadpan. So there is an understanding of comedy. So I can almost get how people made that mistake.

And maybe there were other reasons that movie wasn't funny. But what I learned is I cannot assume that that any actor I meet is going to have the comedy quiver in their little arrow basket. So maybe that's part of it too. It's that there's just that that's just not where we are in our storytelling and in terms of director's skill, actors skill, writer's skill, I wouldn't I wouldn't know how to go about if you put a gun to my head and said, right an American Bollywood film man, I don't think that's a thing. I'd be eating a bullet.

I don't think. I I'm just well, first of all, I just haven't seen enough of them to really sort of have the groove, you know. And yet I watched them and I'll tell you this, I don't know. I can't imagine anyone listening to this episode who isn't already a Bollywood fan. But if you're not, if you're within the sound of my voice and you're like, I'm afraid of that flavor, you know, don't be because it's not as foreign in terms of storytelling as you think.

The movies you're gonna see are gonna feel a lot more familiar, and they're going to be filled with gorgeous people who are ridiculously talented. I mean, having seen five of them, I can say that as being a constant element of all of them, and you should be believed in that regard. Well. But I but as someone who is seeing a fair amount, I would agree. I mean, you take take the first scene with Abby check back Shan in this film.

He comes up to an inspector and he he's like, hey, you know, uh. The inspectors like, hey, I'm waiting for ACP Dixit to show up, so get out of the way, playing yeah, And he's like no, no, I am him and he's like what and again it's a funny scene that's played for laughs, but obbus Chef Buckton's not being funny, but he is being funny by the way he reacts. And it's it's that subtlety with the way that things are done that, like you said, like it's it's comedy, but it's not like everybody's not laughing out loud. It's just written in a way where it's the kind of comedy that happens throughout the day with misunderstandings and just miscommunications, which is not the way that that's normally written in Western comedy.

It's jokes and funny observations and stuff. It's not just from you know, that's a situational thing which is kind of fallen out in I don't know, I don't know. They don't, they don't. We don't lean on sitcom tropes in movies. No, Well, Bollywood has their own tropes in right, and and and again.

I mean, every every Bollywood film I see makes me want to see ten more because I feel like I want to take a deeper dive just so I can have more points of reference, because the more I see, the more I'll be able to go Okay, all right, now, I'm beginning to piece together a picture of what these various directors, writers, producers, actors are trying to do, how often they're succeeding when they're not succeeding as strongly. I'm just thrilled. I'm not bored or confused. Those are my two. And when I go to American films, I'm afraid I'm going to be bored and confused.

Right it's this is not an Indian cinema thing. This is a just cinema in jet What What in your mind? What in your mind? Was some of the more successful points in this movie. What What What?

What like? Because I really appreciated how well shot the action was. The action in this movie is really well shot, again for for a film that I did not know what to expect, because again I have not seen a Ballywater Indian cinema, car film, motorcycle film. Yeah, I was, I was well, I was kind of impressed with everything. I the fight on the truck at the end, I really enjoyed, um oh yeah and I um.

But I also really find myself in love with what I'm still calling the musical numbers and um I uday Choper's performance. I was so fun and just so delightful and endearing on every level. You know, uh Ali is just a great character. But and then I sort of came around on on amishek Bachan. I was like, Okay, he's got the less flashy role.

His job is to play the straight man. But then even he, you know, was given moments of oh okay, now we're now we're seeing under the surface and we're getting we're tipping our hat to the audience saying he knows what movie he into, right, So it's like, I don't know. I mean, I just enjoyed so much of it. And when I expected, when I expected the story to lag, more more invention came in. I actually thought it was pretty well plotted.

Like, here's the thing. There's a certain tossed off quality to it. They're not working really hard and spending a lot of time on the heist right watching it going well, okay, all right, they have figured it out, And I guess we're just going to say that the casinos vault is beneath the bathroom of one of their suites. Okay, that's fine. I could sidering question the logic of that, but I'm not going to well I mean, do you question in the Oceans movies, like there was a similar there was a very similar beat in the Oceans movies with the I believe is like the Asian character climbing into the ceiling in their hotel suite and then using that as the opportunity to go into the vault, which I think was like that had to be what they were kind of re Yeah, the Ocean's movie probably those probably go like an extra step or two.

Oh yeah, that's it's all about that singular heist. Yeah, sort of establishing the clever credentials, right, whereas this movie that clearly wasn't in the top five things it was even doing was we've got to prove to you how smart we are, that that that you're going to come away from this thinking we are experts in casino security, high tech thievery. It's like, you know what, We're going to use some props that you recognize from other movies and some editing techniques that you recognize from other movies to signify that this is the moment of the mission impossible heist. That's all we're gonna do, because we got other things to do, because we've got a musical number going on upstairs, and we've got a guy who's in love with someone who's not in love with him, and now we've got a whole other concluding half hour or we've got to sell you, so we've got other fish to fry, and frankly, that's it's like I can feel a burden being lifted off my shoulders as a writer watching the movie, like, oh my god, thank god, these people aren't a burdened with trying to pull this stuff off in the newest, most creative way we've never seen before.

But they recognize that that's not a real big story value. You're only going to get so much from feeling like, oh, the filmmakers are clever, right, rather see something funny, sexy or fast. And that's the other thing. That's the other thing that I You know, again, I'm not saying that that's not the case with some of the things that I've seen, but there does seem to be in these kinds of movies, at least in Western films. It's like, we have to show that we can make a cool and interesting like puzzle that you are going to watch us put together in front of you, And yeah, this movie's focus is more.

This would be like if in Ocean's eleven it was more about the interplay between George Clooney and Brad Pitt and Matt Damon, and that the way that they interact with each other and the story between them that's being told, and you know, George Clooney's interaction with Julia Roberts, because that this movie is about the human interactions more than what they're doing or how they're making the dice to rob the casino, or like you said, what does that serve It serves just to be cool, I guess, or we've What it honestly feels like to me is we've thought about everything. And not only have we thought about everything we have to show you, we've thought about everything we have to, like you said, prove to you how smart we are.

Yeah, and it's just fucking exhausting. It's fucking exhausting, and it's not necessarily I mean, the thing that rises to the top, like you said, are the charisma of the actors and the enjoyment of seeing them interact with each other, which again you know, like like I would say, the most meta example would be the way Julia Roberts enters into the Oceans eleven movies where she's almost playing a character named Julia roberts Well on the third movie they go that for Yeah, it's like and I think people in Western audiences get a little queasy when that happens. They're like, wait, why are you doing this? You're you're ruining it for me. I'm not You're You're supposed to be fooling me better.

And and yet that's the sort of thing that I feel like is done day one on these movies is just and again, not knowing how these actors are seen in public and how they interact with their fandoms. I don't know what the separation is, but they're revered. We do not treat our actors that are as high profile as say amitab or SRK or Amir Khan or Rajnikan. We don't treat our actors that way. They're revered.

It's like a cult surrounding them. But that used to be the way it was back in the sixties and seventies and eighties and nineties. I mean even now that is the way it is. But here in our country, we're giving a lot of credence and attention to people that are completely untalented and don't deserve attention. You know.

Well, it's almost like I wish when you hear people talking about The Fast and the Furious movies, especially now, there's always this sort of apology that comes with seeing those movies and people say, yeah, I saw Oh I saw Fast nine. Oh how was it? Oh it was ridiculous, you know, I mean I had a good time, it was fun, but I mean it's completely insane, right, and you sort of you hear that, and I almost wish that there was a place and you know, the Fast and the Furious movies. In other words, all this makes me think is that the Fast and the Furious movies should be funnier, faster, take themselves less seriously, and have musical numbers, and I would like them much more. And then everyone could just pull the stick out of their ass and enjoy themselves.

Because I don't think Doom was trying to do anything more than that, and it achieved it. And I think the people who went and saw it knew exactly what was being served up and ate it up and enjoyed themselves. So why not sort of again, unburden a certain kind of movie from having to do that stuff? I think maybe the closest we get are some horror movies that are willing to be over the top in terms of gore and at the same time also be funny and weird and shocking and unrealistic. But also the other the other question is like a character driven right, because that's the other thing about this movie.

It really is all about the character interactions. Yeah, that's true. That's true. I never felt like, oh, it's relying on surface e flash. It gave me characters that I enjoyed being with, that I understood as human beings and cared about, you know, as much as I needed to and that, and but but characterized that or compare that to something like Fast and the Furious, where I've seen a fair amount of those movies.

There's like ten of them this point or nine. I have never cared about any of those characters, because the characters don't matter to the plot. They just exist to they exist to further along the plot. They're not actually characters that we're supposed to care about. And in this movie, I feel like, you know, VJ.

Christiana Aksharya does a very good job in again creating characters that we spend a fair amount of time with the three of them, and I feel like we get a good idea what the three of them are all wanting from one another or from the situation or in their lives without having to sacrifice action and other stuff. Well, to be fair, the men, well, let's talk about that. Female characters in this movie woefully underserved. Yeah, they're I mean again, they're they're beautiful and talented, but clearly it's not about them. They are you know, Sweetie exists to be Ji's wife, and you know, sort of she represents the woman or the kind of woman or the relationship that Ali wants.

You know, I want to be married. I want to have this thing that that Jai has. So I care about what she thinks about me. So I care that she doesn't know that I'm a criminal. Okay, got it.

But she only exists to serve an aspect of his character, right, She doesn't have her own agenda. Sheina exists to be a twist in the narrative to surprise us that she's not just a pop star but also somehow involved in this criminal gang. Somehow criminal? Yeah? Sure, why not?

Perfect cover? Yeah, I mean, hey, those those magicians had a pretty good cover when they were stealing things. Yeah, you know, so that's her deal. She doesn't seem to be you know, uh, she does not have her own story. But I mean to be fair, if they're using a lot of these other kinds of movies that inspire this movie as reference points, neither do those true unless they're conceptually designed that way.

Like, I enjoyed this movie a lot more than I have enjoyed the Western equivalents, because I do not seek out the Western equivalents of this kind of movie. This is not the kind of movie I watch. I am not a Fast and the Furious watcher, like that is not a film series I watch. I like The Oceans movies, but this movie doesn't have a lot of that. It's like a couple scenes.

It's definitely more Fast and the Furious inspired you. If you use Bad Boys as a comparison, which again I think is pretty close, do you think that's the best comparison In a way, I think there's sort of a Will Smith Martin Lawrence vibe. Okay, guys, I've never seen Bad Boys so wildly entertaining. Yeah, sure, I believe it. I believe it over the top action, but but comedy and the relationship between these eyes and then and then also their their girlfriend's wives.

Uh later on in the third one, those all and kids, you know, the family aspect. All that stuff comes in if you I get, yeah, have Will Smith singing in a Bad Boys movie and you'll be sixty one percent toward a Bollywood film. Well, but again, I mean that's the thing, you know, none of the actors in this movie I think are actually singing. I think all of it is just um, well, playback singers, which I mean playback singers in in Indian cinema are a bit. It's a big deal.

Like that's not a thing in Western cinema anymore. But still that's that is a highly sought after and well regarded job in India, is being a playback singer. Will Smith could do it well, or someone could sing for him and he could lip sync it, I think rather convincingly. Yeah, isn't that funny? That's also like like that is it's sort of like verboten.

Yeah, that's my point. It's like they're doing things in Indian cinema that we have like not just left behind, but people are making documentaries about people doing that. AKA that Darlene Love story with twenty Feet from Stardom is literally about playback singers. That's not a job that like is given, Like you said, not even any attention, but not even any respect anymore. But then you so then you end up with a movie like Mom and Mia, where Pierce Bronston, who's fantastic.

He's a great actor, he's a great comedian, not a singer. Where are those happy days? They seem so hard to find? Oh, Pierce, Pierce, Pierce gonna stop you right here. You watch that and you're like, no, no, no, how did somebody think that was okay?

I don't know, Maybe it was in his contract or something. It's like, it's like, can you imagine that Pierce has to sing, no matter how bad it is? Pierce is Peters? Is that Peter scars Guard? Is Stellen scars Guard?

Is that who's also in that movie? Is he sing in that movie? He probably does? Maybe he does. All I know is you shouldn't be watching the movie.

I would rather watch a movie and go, wait a second, is that his voice? Then watch a movie and go, oh, I wish this was not his voice. Yeah. Paul Sorvino in Repo The Genetic Opera very similar thing. You think about Paul Sorvino singing opera.

Oh, it's not good, it's it's it's really again, I understand why we and Western cinema have the things that we have where it's like, oh no, it's got to be the person singing. But I've seen Johnny Depp sing in Sweeney Todd it's not great, Like it's there's something to be or Ryan Gosling and Emma Stone in La La Land, Like that's the point. It's both to be bad, Like okay, what, Like, I'm sorry, did you just tell me that your movie is gonna be bad before I like, the singing quality is going to be bad in your movie before I watch it? Like yeah, well those two, those two, you know, we crossed the streams of of you know, naturalism and performative conceit right and and performative conceit lost. And so now it's like, okay, you know, I'm Marlon Brando.

I'll do a musical, but it's also going to have my voice. What we don't need that? Yeah, you're an actor, because it's been done. They have dubbed over actresses roles. You know, we since time Immemoriam so why not just dub over everyone and let us enjoy the movie for once.

I don't know. I've seen bugsy Malone and that movie they dub over children with adults. It's it's weird, but it's only weird because it's children with adult voices coming out. I am of the one hundred percent mindset that putting music in and having characters lip sync to it with playback singers is. I don't see the problem.

I don't know why it's been kind of abandoned by Western cinema. I know that we have no interest in having musical numbers in non quote musical unquote movies, but that's that part of It's fine, But I think for the foreseeable future, and I think overall, like casting actors who can't sing in movies where they're being expected to sing makes very little sense. No, and just be upfront about it. You know, I'm not going to be heartbroken and disillusion to learn that Pierce Brosbon can't sing, right, I don't expect that Pierce Brosbon can sing. I don't expect Abishek Bakshan and Uday Chopra can sing.

I don't expect that from them, Nor do I expect that they do all their own stunts or that that's necessarily even their ass I'm looking at when they pull their pants down because often it isn't right, or that it's them that I'm seeing in a shot from behind, like doubles, and there are doubles, body doubles and stunt doubles, like it's not just Yeah, I feel like we as Western audiences expect I don't know what it is, but do we expect there to be like no magic anymore? Like we you know, we're always showing our hands, you know what I mean, Like that's always what it feels like. Yeah, I can't. I can't. I can't ever have made or film studio like I can't ever have filmmaking magic anymore.

It's all about like everything has to be like I'm being upfront, I'm telling you like you gotta be real and grounded in reality. It's like why it's movies except for the you know, two hundred million dollars of CGI right, which often has the unintended effect of making the movie less entertaining, less compelling, less visceral, and less believable. And if we were living in an era before this one. What we would be seeing on the screen where the CGI is is literally nothing because you couldn't do it, so you didn't do it, and you worked. It was a limitation, so you had to work around it.

And god knows how many scripts exist from the eighties and seventies and nineties and sixties where it was we can't do this because it's too expensive and technologically impossible. Yeah, and CGI makes the impossible possible. But then you watch a movie like this which has very little CGI, all practical right, and then and then plus has some filmmaking flourishes which are so clearly goofy split screen and weird blur effects that are basically insisting that you constantly are aware that you're watching a movie, a movie called Doom. Nonetheless, it says it like the little musical Doom. It says it so much, it's like a sound the title of the film is a sound effect in the film to get your attention, like Doom Doom.

It does it over and over. I'm not complaining, it's just you wouldn't want west. There's not a Western cinema version of that. I can't even point to something like that, like that's just again it's a it's a weird it's not even weird. It is a specific technique that I have seen before in other Indian cinema films, So it's an Indian cinema thing.

It's not often paired with like a specific auditory queue, but sometimes it is, so it's it's less surprising. But at the same time, if you're not a Western audience member, you're not going to be surprised. No, if that happened, you would assume it was a parody. Yeah, yeah, you would. You would think that, oh, you're doing this to be funny.

But the whole trend in American filmmaking, I mean, I mean, the one franchise that was able to embrace sort of a sort of loopy, elevated esthetic were the James Bond movies. And boy did we grind that beneath our heel. Right, God forbid it. It's you know, it stretches credulity. So now now we have some very well made films, but there's no rush of adrenaline, there's no burst of joy.

There's no jumping out of your seat and shaking your fist in the air when something cool happens. We're all supposed to sit there quietly and receive and then walk out impressed, and I, you know, not to start reviewing a different movie. But I think No Time to Die kind of took that as far as it can go. I think even people who love that franchise like me, but who loved Daniel Craig and the modern incarnation of it, I think even those people walked away from that going, what the fuck did I really pay this much money to a theater and a and a babysitter to leave my house during COVID to see this. Now I'm done, and I'm look, I'll always go see another James Bond movie.

But I'm glad there, you know, I'm glad the Daniel Craig era is over well and this and this movie is coming right at the tail end of those kinds of James Bond movies existing. I want to say, Die Another Day. Diannother Day came out. I think this year in oh four. I think you're right.

Yeah, and but but that and that is seen as like such a like a woeful failure as a Bond movie, and like it's not great. I'm not going to sit here and sing the praises of it. But it's it is a Pierce Brosnon Bond movie made with Roger Moore Bond sensibilities like it's it's I mean, I get it, it's it's they. I think maybe Dian other Day stretches it too far, but when you snap back so hard, you've drained the fun and out of it completely. As a human being, I'd see that movie.

I'd see Die Another Day. If you ask me what I want her to watch tonight, I'd watch that instead of No Time to Die. I would rather watch that over any of the Craig movies. For the most part, I will never well, except for Casino Royale, sure, I agree with you on the rest. I will never see Die Another Day ever again.

Well unless my friend Evan forces me to before the next one comes out, because every time a new Bond movie comes out, he rewatches all the Bond movies in anticipation. It's kind of like his own cinematic ninety nine bottles of Beer on the wall. But uh, and I you know it's fun because you know, we eat and drink, so you know, reason alone is fine. But I mean, again, stripping all that away, Yeah, I don't want to see that movie again. And uh, and yet I would happily watch, you know, stick my hand into the bucket of Mollywood and pull out anything and watch it.

Well. And so that's that's what I'm curious about, you know, the way the movie the ends, like we've mentioned, you kind of have our two heroes walking off into the sunset together. The female leads or female characters kind of don't factor into it. The next time we do one of these episodes and the two of us, we should do the sequel. We should do Doom too, you know, and why not?

I Mean, on the one hand, it kind of bumps me out because I'm like, well, I know, but there's such a giant Bollywood, you know. But I don't think it's not. Let me put it this way, I think your expectations for what it are are being informed by Western sequel expectations. Yeah, I mean that's that's my hope. At least I want to do it just because it's like, well, okay, I mean I'll have a much closer reference point because I'll have the first movie and I'll go, okay, well I've got something right next to it to compare it to.

Was it better or worse than Doom? Right, yeah, I'm in And this movie was a success. This is the third highest grossing Indian film of two thousand and four. I mean, this was a success obviously, even though it was panned critically in India and in the States. For the people who saw it in the States, for it being derivative, it's interesting so so Indian uh Indian film commentary will take a film to task of course, of course, because again Fast and the Furious is a popular enough movie that people in India have seen it and love it.

I mean again, it's even an O four fact. I mean that's the thing. Fast and the Furious. I don't think has ever not been popular. It's just a question of how popular is it, you know well, I mean in terms of like you know, Abushek Bakshan and Jude Chopra were they were they at a point at that point where it's like, oh, we'll see whatever they do.

Audience are just like you know, in other words, it's like Eddie Murphy or whatever. They're just like, yeah, let's go see it. I mean, this was this was very early on in um Obbishek Bakshan's career. I mean he started acting in two thousand. I mean, obviously he was.

He has an easier road than some given his last name, given who his mother and father are, Jaya Bakshan, who is an actress in her own right and a politician, so you know he comes. They just they fugged everything. Yeah, I mean again, if you're so well known, why not. They're also an athlete, they're a soccer player. I mean, it's just like they don't there is no lane.

They're just doing everything. People in our country are excited about having egots. It's like guys like but but it's funny because when when I when you you asked a question about this, is this this is early on where this this movie was not this movie. No, people didn't go see this movie because of who was in it. I don't think they weren't like well as well regarded as they are now.

This is early on in both their careers. And this movie was kind of a shocking success too. I mean they you know, the movie cost about one hundred and ten million and it made about seven hundred and twenty four million, so I mean, you know this, this movie was rather financially successful as well. You know, that's a lot of crore that's a lot of crore to be making. I mean, I think it's equivalent of like I want to say, I don't know how much that would be an American dollars.

And also for inflation, it's a lot of money. A crore. Well, that's what that's what it is. It's in It's not in dollars, it's in krore. I mean that's I liked this movie a lot, and I'm glad that you liked Richard.

I'm very I'm very pleased to learn that you liked this movie. Yeah, I'm glad I liked it too. Well. It's I mean, again, like with any sort of international cinema, regardless of where it comes from, there is going to be a culture gap that we have to overcome. We had it earlier this year with The Handmaiden, when you and Cullen and I talked about that, a South Korean film where we neither one of us or none of us are South Korean.

So we're having to bring our Western interpretation of things to our interpretation the movie. Similar to this podcast, with all the Indian cinema, neither one of us are Indian. I have been to India, I have Indian friends that I grew up with in high school that I feel very privileged to have been able to hang out at their house and absorb their culture as much as I could. But I'm not Indian, and neither are you. Part of my fear comes from having gone to film school, where they show, you know, the international cinema they would show was based on like, let's show you how different the film language is with the Japanese.

You know, these are films made in the thirties or forties share where they're very difficult to consume. So so part of my training with foreign film is that it's going to be difficult, punishing, excruciating, and and you're you know, you're gonna come away feeling like you understood ten percent of it. That's not the case here. Well, but it hasn't been the case in any of those Indian cinema films that I've shown you. I mean, there are those movies no where The Handmaid, I mean, The Handmaid felt like, you know, Western cinema with subtitles, And maybe we've missed a lot of culturally explicit or cultural cultural notes that we don't get because we don't live in that culture.

But we're still I think appreciating the movie as much as we can. Well, look, i mean, if you're gonna be doing this show, then you're gonna be seen a lot more. So. Well, hell yeah, I'm going to keep watching Bollywood movies till we find ones we don't like. Oh and I'm sure they exist.

I mean, it's like anything else we just have. I mean, I just happen to be looking at the ones that people are telling me to watch or I've heard of. I have heard of Doom and Doom three since I was in high school. I had heard about him in high school. I'd never watched him.

Okay, then why don't we do Doom two and Doom three? Yeah, let's do it of two and three and we'll just watch two and three and then we'll talk about two and three. It's like six hours. Fine, I've got nothing else to do. I haven't started the next season of Titans yet, So what do I care?

That's fair? I like it, rich very very very astute Richard. So so, final final thoughts on Doom two thousand and four is do I say watch it? Yeah? It's totally fun.

I just watched it. I mean it's look, it's fun it's fun like singing, dancing, being funny and shooting guns at each other. What else do you want? What else? When?

When did we get so full of ourselves? One? And that's and that is what I walk away with from every single one of these movies, even the ones like Parinda where it's like a crime movie and it has a bummer of an ending, Like the movie is still fun even after the conclusion, even after certain things happen to certain characters that is not fun. By the end of the movie, I'm like, I had a good time watching it, and like that anymore, Like that's all I kind of need. But the fact that all these other things amplify it, especially with this movie, like the like the practical effects, like the acting, like the musical numbers, it just all makes it that much better.

But it's already light years ahead of a lot of things that I'm seeing now because it's doing something different, because it is a different like you said, film film language, it's not drastically different from our own, and I agree with you. I'm one of the other things I'm trying to do with this podcast is try to change the immediate interpretation of someone saying we're gonna watch a foreign film from a oh shit moment to a okay moment. Well, the only foreign films that people should watch shouldn't just be Giermo del Toro movies, because he makes movies that are horror movies that are kind of like those now, you know what I mean. People aren't watching foreign films anyways. Like well, yeah, and with certainly with Doom, you could you could technically watch this without subtitles and only miss about ten percent of what's happening in the movie.

Yeah, the visual storytelling, the performances are you know, everything is broad and and sort of you know, forward enough for you to understand, got it. Good guy, bad guy, funny, good guy. You know, female lead, second female lead, who is you know, of questionable morality at a certain point, you know, Yeah, yeah, this is and this is a very fun kind of an another easy entry point, but again also a movie unlike a lot of the Indian cinema I've seen, I have not seen a action car slash motorcycle Indian cinema movie. So it's fun. It's it's just it's fun to see interpretations of genres through the lens of another culture.

And this is their interpretation of a genre that has a lot of Western interpretations to draw from. So, so until the next time you're on this show, Richard, which I guess we're gonna be talking about Doom two and three. Where could people find you and your body of work? You can find me on HBO Max. Titans season one through three is already on, so you can get you can you can just start and over the course of a holiday weekend.

When when is this one gonna? So I was gonna I was actually gonna tell you might want to redo it only because this episode is not coming out until sometime next year. Oh okay, I'm making content ahead of time so that I don't have to struggle next year for content. Um, I'm on. You can find me on HBO Max.

I'm a writer on Titans season one through four, all of which and at least season four, part one definitely is available now on HBO Max. So enjoy that. And um and when I'm not doing that, I'm pretty much sitting here on Zoom talking to you, Chris. It's true. I feel very honored to have a modicum of your ear.

So as for me, Weirdingwaymedia dot Com, that's where you can find me and all the things that I work on. I'm assuming that I'm as for me. Bollywood cinemaclub dot com. That's where you can find all the things that I work on. Weirdingwaymedia dot com.

That is the I guess that's the best place to find this show and eighteen other shows, including eighties TV Ladies, which is the show that Richard's wife has created. So that's where you can find all those shows. Bollywood cinemaclub dot com, Bollywood sind him a club on Twitter, and all those places where you can find this show. Richard, thank you so much for letting me have a moment of your time to talk about Indian cinema. Always a pleasure, man.

Just let me know when we're doing Jim two and three and I will and we'll catch on the next episode.